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There's quite a few societies where old people live great active lives up until the day they die and take care of themselves. They're healthier. So shouldn't we

by Jemmeh 10y ago

There's quite a few societies where old people live great active lives up until the day they die and take care of themselves. They're healthier. So shouldn't we try to be healthier and less reliant on the young people too? Granted stronger social bonds has often been linked to better health so maybe a bit more relying on each other is a good thing.

tudorw 10y ago
I was thinking more along resource lines, if the ones alive get to live longer and longer, does that not reduce the opportunity for new lives ?
- mistercow 10y ago
  You seem to be assuming that new lives are worth more than old lives. Why?
  - tudorw 10y ago
    This is a good question, I don't have a tidy answer, it just feels like that is the way of things, born, grow old and die, if we change the die bit I do feel like something is lost, if I could freeze time, no more births, no more deaths, would I, no, I don't think so, and we are still evolving, so perhaps that is a good reason to let things run their 'natural' course?
    - Jemmeh 10y ago
      This line of thinking comes up a lot in longevity discussion. Pretty much all medicine is "unnatural" and extending life. People evolve all the time even while being alive, we change our opinions on things, we learn things, and we make impact on our surroundings. Usually the question of social progress comes up, but there are still quite a lot of people alive today who dealt with segregation in schools, it wasn't just the deaths of people with those beliefs that moved that progress forward. I could even argue that the fact that people have to focus so hard on survival is slowing down a lot of progress.
      - mistercow 10y ago
        I'd also argue that a lot of the reasons people think death is "necessary" are actually symptoms of senescence. Decreased neuroplasticity, for example, is likely one of the reasons that old people tend to get "stuck in their ways" and are unwilling to accept new ideas. Clearly, part of solving the aging problem involves solving that too. A lot of anti-immortality arguments reduce to this problem. Folks who advocate ending aging do not want us to just live forever as progressively more decrepit and cranky old codgers. The point is not to keep you at 90. It's to keep you at 25 (and put you back there if necessary).
cm2012 10y ago
Japan is probably the healthiest large country, they still have plenty of old people that need constant care.

by Jemmeh 10y ago

tudorw 10y ago

I was thinking more along resource lines, if the ones alive get to live longer and longer, does that not reduce the opportunity for new lives ?

mistercow 10y ago
You seem to be assuming that new lives are worth more than old lives. Why?
- tudorw 10y ago
  This is a good question, I don't have a tidy answer, it just feels like that is the way of things, born, grow old and die, if we change the die bit I do feel like something is lost, if I could freeze time, no more births, no more deaths, would I, no, I don't think so, and we are still evolving, so perhaps that is a good reason to let things run their 'natural' course?
  - Jemmeh 10y ago
    This line of thinking comes up a lot in longevity discussion. Pretty much all medicine is "unnatural" and extending life. People evolve all the time even while being alive, we change our opinions on things, we learn things, and we make impact on our surroundings. Usually the question of social progress comes up, but there are still quite a lot of people alive today who dealt with segregation in schools, it wasn't just the deaths of people with those beliefs that moved that progress forward. I could even argue that the fact that people have to focus so hard on survival is slowing down a lot of progress.
    - mistercow 10y ago
      I'd also argue that a lot of the reasons people think death is "necessary" are actually symptoms of senescence. Decreased neuroplasticity, for example, is likely one of the reasons that old people tend to get "stuck in their ways" and are unwilling to accept new ideas. Clearly, part of solving the aging problem involves solving that too. A lot of anti-immortality arguments reduce to this problem. Folks who advocate ending aging do not want us to just live forever as progressively more decrepit and cranky old codgers. The point is not to keep you at 90. It's to keep you at 25 (and put you back there if necessary).

cm2012 10y ago

Japan is probably the healthiest large country, they still have plenty of old people that need constant care.