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How are you going to deal with zoning? Generally the big problem with tiny houses is that while they're relatively cheap to make they're not allowed by existin

by cbr 10y ago

How are you going to deal with zoning? Generally the big problem with tiny houses is that while they're relatively cheap to make they're not allowed by existing zoning.

liseman 10y ago
IMHO, zoning is is one of the biggest challenges facing anybody who wants to do something interesting in real estate. CA actually is forcing cities to make it easier to build ADUs: http://www.hcd.ca.gov/policy-research/docs/17Jan30-ADU-TA-Memo.pdf http://www.hcd.ca.gov/policy-research/docs/17Jan30-ADU-TA-Me... . Worst case, we put wheels on them and have license plates to avoid having to comply with building regulations;)
- komali2 10y ago
  I hate to be that guy but "putting wheels on them" is not a simple solution at all... it will take a lot more than that to make your cargo containers street-legal.
- dragonwriter 10y ago
  > Worst case, we put wheels on them and have license plates to avoid having to comply with building regulations;) Once they are vehicles, it's much easier for them to be impounded for violating parking and other vehicle-related regulations, which the proposed uses seem as likely to break as building regulations.
iamacynic 10y ago
a good service add-on would be help with getting one installed in various jurisdictions. i.e., what exactly is the process to get one installed on a plot of land in unincorporated Los Angeles County? (or wherever) who do i need to call and permit in order to not get kicked off my own land? right now, that process is completely opaque and mysterious, and people who have done it don't seem to want to share.
willholloway 10y ago
Many places treat these types of dwellings as mobile homes, and there is probably no form of development that is more widely banned than mobile home parks. Even putting one of these on your own lot as an accessory structure is going to be very difficult in much of the country. These rules are all legally codified class discrimination, and is very much largely about middle class single family homeowners keeping out what they call "undesirables". In their worldview, "undesirables" can include anything from a mixed use building with commercial on first floor and an apartment on top, to turning a single family home into a duplex, but there is nothing more detested by these folks than mobile home parks. It's an American caste system and it leads to unnecessary high housing prices. Very broadly, America doesn't want to invest in fixing social problems and there is a big focus on just moving the problem to other areas. The counter-productive part of this is that high housing costs drain resources from families and that induced poverty state leads to the social problems that are trying to be hidden in the first place. Zoning is in need of serious reform, it is possible to go up against it and it is possible to win. I have, but it wasn't easy, and you really need public opinion on your side. Market positioning can make the difference, and there is opportunity for things to change due to the bad economic position many towns find themselves in. Many places simply can't afford their snobbery anymore. The rebranding happening with the tiny home movement has a chance at breaking through this and I hope that it does. I would love to develop a piece of land with a group of affordable small houses but it's a total non starter in my area.
- brudgers 10y ago
  Mobile homes have a distinct legal disadvantage: they are classified as vehicles rather than real property. Local municipalities have statutes on the books that readily allow impounding vehicles and regulating their parking that are much more 'action oriented' than the legal formalities for liening real property for zoning non-compliance.
asciimo 10y ago
Looks like they learned some lessons the hard way. They were forced out of their original location by Oakland. "Iseman said after the inspection at 2836 Union Street that it might have cost $200,000 to $300,000 to bring the property and containers into compliance with building and health codes. ... The new space 'will be organized, beautiful, and largely inside, hidden from the prying eyes of nosey neighbors and nettlesome bureaucrats.'" (http://sfpublicpress.org/news/2015-03/shipping-container-homes-run-up-against-health-and-building-codes http://sfpublicpress.org/news/2015-03/shipping-container-hom...)
- ceejayoz 10y ago
  The quote about the new space sounds like they're soon to learn about building inspectors. Putting a bunch of containers into a warehouse somewhere sounds like a good way to repeat http://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/oakland-warehouse-fire-victims-families-face-agonizing-wait-n691911 http://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/oakland-warehouse-fire-v...

by cbr 10y ago

How are you going to deal with zoning? Generally the big problem with tiny houses is that while they're relatively cheap to make they're not allowed by existing zoning.

liseman 10y ago

IMHO, zoning is is one of the biggest challenges facing anybody who wants to do something interesting in real estate. CA actually is forcing cities to make it easier to build ADUs: http://www.hcd.ca.gov/policy-research/docs/17Jan30-ADU-TA-Memo.pdf http://www.hcd.ca.gov/policy-research/docs/17Jan30-ADU-TA-Me... . Worst case, we put wheels on them and have license plates to avoid having to comply with building regulations;)

komali2 10y ago
I hate to be that guy but "putting wheels on them" is not a simple solution at all... it will take a lot more than that to make your cargo containers street-legal.
dragonwriter 10y ago
> Worst case, we put wheels on them and have license plates to avoid having to comply with building regulations;) Once they are vehicles, it's much easier for them to be impounded for violating parking and other vehicle-related regulations, which the proposed uses seem as likely to break as building regulations.

iamacynic 10y ago

a good service add-on would be help with getting one installed in various jurisdictions. i.e., what exactly is the process to get one installed on a plot of land in unincorporated Los Angeles County? (or wherever) who do i need to call and permit in order to not get kicked off my own land? right now, that process is completely opaque and mysterious, and people who have done it don't seem to want to share.

willholloway 10y ago

Many places treat these types of dwellings as mobile homes, and there is probably no form of development that is more widely banned than mobile home parks. Even putting one of these on your own lot as an accessory structure is going to be very difficult in much of the country. These rules are all legally codified class discrimination, and is very much largely about middle class single family homeowners keeping out what they call "undesirables". In their worldview, "undesirables" can include anything from a mixed use building with commercial on first floor and an apartment on top, to turning a single family home into a duplex, but there is nothing more detested by these folks than mobile home parks. It's an American caste system and it leads to unnecessary high housing prices. Very broadly, America doesn't want to invest in fixing social problems and there is a big focus on just moving the problem to other areas. The counter-productive part of this is that high housing costs drain resources from families and that induced poverty state leads to the social problems that are trying to be hidden in the first place. Zoning is in need of serious reform, it is possible to go up against it and it is possible to win. I have, but it wasn't easy, and you really need public opinion on your side. Market positioning can make the difference, and there is opportunity for things to change due to the bad economic position many towns find themselves in. Many places simply can't afford their snobbery anymore. The rebranding happening with the tiny home movement has a chance at breaking through this and I hope that it does. I would love to develop a piece of land with a group of affordable small houses but it's a total non starter in my area.

brudgers 10y ago
Mobile homes have a distinct legal disadvantage: they are classified as vehicles rather than real property. Local municipalities have statutes on the books that readily allow impounding vehicles and regulating their parking that are much more 'action oriented' than the legal formalities for liening real property for zoning non-compliance.

asciimo 10y ago

Looks like they learned some lessons the hard way. They were forced out of their original location by Oakland. "Iseman said after the inspection at 2836 Union Street that it might have cost $200,000 to $300,000 to bring the property and containers into compliance with building and health codes. ... The new space 'will be organized, beautiful, and largely inside, hidden from the prying eyes of nosey neighbors and nettlesome bureaucrats.'" (http://sfpublicpress.org/news/2015-03/shipping-container-homes-run-up-against-health-and-building-codes http://sfpublicpress.org/news/2015-03/shipping-container-hom...)

ceejayoz 10y ago
The quote about the new space sounds like they're soon to learn about building inspectors. Putting a bunch of containers into a warehouse somewhere sounds like a good way to repeat http://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/oakland-warehouse-fire-victims-families-face-agonizing-wait-n691911 http://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/oakland-warehouse-fire-v...