6 ms·

I do have liability insurance for my car, since it is required by law. I would be prepared to live without one if it became unaffordable. For most of human hi

by sverige 10y ago

I do have liability insurance for my car, since it is required by law. I would be prepared to live without one if it became unaffordable. For most of human history, the vast majority of us got around on foot. (In fact, that may still be true, I don't know.) Buses and trains still work, if that's not palatable for some reason. Whole startup companies have been built around getting people from point A to point B in larger cities. I do not have health insurance. I recently had major surgery that others have helped me to pay for, but I was in fact completely prepared to die, as odd as that may sound to most. Our lives on this earth are finite. Most people don't deal with that reality in any meaningful way, even when they acknowledge that it is true intellectually.

sumedh 10y ago
So why did you accept help from others?
- sverige 10y ago
  I did not solicit their help in any way. Their decisions are theirs. Why would I deny them the ability to participate and to do what their consciences apparently led them to do? It's not as if it is a dishonest debt, such as a gambling debt; if it were, then yes, I would return their money. (Though I certainly believe that in the totality of the debt, there is some dishonesty on the part of the providers.)
  - sumedh 10y ago
    > Why would I deny them the ability to participate and to do what their consciences apparently led them to do? Why didn't you have the courage to say no to them and simply die according to your principles?
Smaug123 10y ago
Maybe it's mandated that our lives be finite, but their lengths are not mandated!
mikeash 10y ago
You strike me as awfully hypocritical. You go on about how terrible insurance is, how lives are finite anyway, how you were prepared to die, and yet you didn't just die, nor did you pay for your own treatment. The only difference between you and me in this area is that I can admit that I'd rather not die now, and my relationship with the people who would pay for my major surgery is a little more formal. This business about how health insurance is a terrible idea and you're prepared to die from a lack of it would be a lot more convincing if you were paying for your own care and foregoing major interventions.
- baddox 10y ago
  People seem to be interpreting the phrase "prepared to die" very strangely. To me, that doesn't indicate a preference for dying over living.
  - mikeash 10y ago
    It doesn't indicate a preference for dying but it does indicate that they don't have much preference for living either, when it's the "but" clause after "I recently had major surgery." I understand the whole thing to be saying, I accept mortality and it wouldn't have been so bad to forego the surgery and die. Which makes me wonder why he went ahead with the surgery and foisted the resulting high cost onto their mysterious benefactors. I could understand (if not agree with) "I was prepared to die, and it wasn't worth the cost, so I'm dying now." I could understand "I was prepared to die, but preferred to live, even though it came at a high cost." But I can't understand "I was prepared to die, but preferred to live using other people's money, but by the way insurance is terrible and I only buy the minimum required by law."
    - sverige 10y ago
      I understand the objections. Frankly, I was not consulted about the surgery, so the choice was not in my hands. And I have committed all my available funds to paying the bills. And they are not completely paid at this point, but neither do I expect that others will pay them. Rather, others graciously provided funds to help in paying the bills, unsolicited. There was no "Go Fund Me" or similar internet plea for assistance, not even any request by email or phone or in person. And frankly, I would have preferred to leave here, but it was not my choice. In fact, I have not dealt with it well at times, and even got drunk a little over a week ago. Shameful to admit, but true. I have commented further in this thread at https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=13917089 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=13917089 .

by sverige 10y ago

sumedh 10y ago

So why did you accept help from others?

sverige 10y ago
I did not solicit their help in any way. Their decisions are theirs. Why would I deny them the ability to participate and to do what their consciences apparently led them to do? It's not as if it is a dishonest debt, such as a gambling debt; if it were, then yes, I would return their money. (Though I certainly believe that in the totality of the debt, there is some dishonesty on the part of the providers.)
- sumedh 10y ago
  > Why would I deny them the ability to participate and to do what their consciences apparently led them to do? Why didn't you have the courage to say no to them and simply die according to your principles?

Smaug123 10y ago

Maybe it's mandated that our lives be finite, but their lengths are not mandated!

mikeash 10y ago

You strike me as awfully hypocritical. You go on about how terrible insurance is, how lives are finite anyway, how you were prepared to die, and yet you didn't just die, nor did you pay for your own treatment. The only difference between you and me in this area is that I can admit that I'd rather not die now, and my relationship with the people who would pay for my major surgery is a little more formal. This business about how health insurance is a terrible idea and you're prepared to die from a lack of it would be a lot more convincing if you were paying for your own care and foregoing major interventions.

baddox 10y ago
People seem to be interpreting the phrase "prepared to die" very strangely. To me, that doesn't indicate a preference for dying over living.
- mikeash 10y ago
  It doesn't indicate a preference for dying but it does indicate that they don't have much preference for living either, when it's the "but" clause after "I recently had major surgery." I understand the whole thing to be saying, I accept mortality and it wouldn't have been so bad to forego the surgery and die. Which makes me wonder why he went ahead with the surgery and foisted the resulting high cost onto their mysterious benefactors. I could understand (if not agree with) "I was prepared to die, and it wasn't worth the cost, so I'm dying now." I could understand "I was prepared to die, but preferred to live, even though it came at a high cost." But I can't understand "I was prepared to die, but preferred to live using other people's money, but by the way insurance is terrible and I only buy the minimum required by law."
  - sverige 10y ago
    I understand the objections. Frankly, I was not consulted about the surgery, so the choice was not in my hands. And I have committed all my available funds to paying the bills. And they are not completely paid at this point, but neither do I expect that others will pay them. Rather, others graciously provided funds to help in paying the bills, unsolicited. There was no "Go Fund Me" or similar internet plea for assistance, not even any request by email or phone or in person. And frankly, I would have preferred to leave here, but it was not my choice. In fact, I have not dealt with it well at times, and even got drunk a little over a week ago. Shameful to admit, but true. I have commented further in this thread at https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=13917089 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=13917089 .