4 ms·

> can be resolved with a trivial amount of research If someone has to do a hundred trivial fixes then you might start to believe that there is something fundam

> can be resolved with a trivial amount of research If someone has to do a hundred trivial fixes then you might start to believe that there is something fundamentally broken with whatever software confronts me with a hundred trivial problems. I'd absolutely love to get away from windows but I tried it multiple times in the past and linux just isn't close to being an alternative in the desktop market. There are so many problems and almost everytime the solution involves doing some arcane stuff in the terminal. This isn't going to win your average user over to linux. Linux runs on all my servers, where it does an excellent job, but I can't see it replacing windows on my desktop systems, not until they fix some fundamental usability and driver issues.

Sir_Cmpwn 10y ago
A hundred trivial fixes? More like 3 trivial fixes max! Jesus christ, Linux isn't that complicated. You're likely to run into a similar number of problems setting up your scanner on Windows! I've run Linux on desktops and laptops for years with next to no problems.
- fauigerzigerk 10y ago
  Interestingly, there's always someone like you making such claims in every online debate about Linux on laptop. And yet I have never succeeded in making Linux run as well as Windows or macOS on any of my laptops over decades. I never seem to have one of those unicorn hardware/driver combinations that perform well, don't drain battery, don't run hot and don't break on dist-upgrade. I have researched my issues every single time because I would prefer to use Linux for many reasons, but the fixes I find are often partial, temporary and fragile. Eventually I give up and go back to macOS or Windows. dist-upgrade almost always breaks things for me, especially all those hard fought for fixes. And it's not just minor things that break. Last time (Ubuntu 16.04 to 16.10) networking stopped working completely because some maintainer had decided that network manager should no longer manage wired connections on my particular variant of Ubuntu.
- DanBC 10y ago
  https://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=2254322 https://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=2254322 That's a 156 page thread. The result? Ubuntu still doesn't fully work on that particular machine. And that machine isn't particularly unusual in its class.
  - Sir_Cmpwn 10y ago
    I will concede that ASUS laptops tend to take a year or two to sort out. But they do get sorted out - as far as I can tell most of the issues mentioned in that thread are also solved in that thread. Did you read any of it?
    - DanBC 10y ago
      I've read all of it. It's a considerable amount of work for an average user to get a working Ubuntu, and even after all that work there are still things (headphone audio ffs) that don't work. This thread is about how people today should move off Windows, and how it is trivially easy to do so. I agree people should move off windows. I disagree that it's trivially easy to do so, especially for these class of netbook style machine. I think that your advice (basically "wait until the kernel is updated") is proof that there are problems with these machines.
      - Sir_Cmpwn 10y ago
        ASUS is the exception, not the norm, and dealbreaker bugs are generally only found in recent models. My point is that for nearly everyone, switching to Linux is easy, and people who generalize the whole platform as broken are spreading FUD.
        21 10y ago
        So I tried yesterday installing (as a dual boot) Ubuntu on my desktop. 3 year old system, Intel 4770 CPU, Gigabyte motherboard, nothing fancy. Ubuntu 16.10 wouldn't boot from a USB stick, with some PM error and the CPU watchdog errors. Fine, go to all the trouble of plugging in a DVD drive, go out, buy a blank DVD. Same thing. The Ubuntu installation media just hangs with an error. Googling that didn't help.

Sir_Cmpwn 10y ago

A hundred trivial fixes? More like 3 trivial fixes max! Jesus christ, Linux isn't that complicated. You're likely to run into a similar number of problems setting up your scanner on Windows! I've run Linux on desktops and laptops for years with next to no problems.

fauigerzigerk 10y ago
Interestingly, there's always someone like you making such claims in every online debate about Linux on laptop. And yet I have never succeeded in making Linux run as well as Windows or macOS on any of my laptops over decades. I never seem to have one of those unicorn hardware/driver combinations that perform well, don't drain battery, don't run hot and don't break on dist-upgrade. I have researched my issues every single time because I would prefer to use Linux for many reasons, but the fixes I find are often partial, temporary and fragile. Eventually I give up and go back to macOS or Windows. dist-upgrade almost always breaks things for me, especially all those hard fought for fixes. And it's not just minor things that break. Last time (Ubuntu 16.04 to 16.10) networking stopped working completely because some maintainer had decided that network manager should no longer manage wired connections on my particular variant of Ubuntu.
DanBC 10y ago
https://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=2254322 https://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=2254322 That's a 156 page thread. The result? Ubuntu still doesn't fully work on that particular machine. And that machine isn't particularly unusual in its class.
- Sir_Cmpwn 10y ago
  I will concede that ASUS laptops tend to take a year or two to sort out. But they do get sorted out - as far as I can tell most of the issues mentioned in that thread are also solved in that thread. Did you read any of it?
  - DanBC 10y ago
    I've read all of it. It's a considerable amount of work for an average user to get a working Ubuntu, and even after all that work there are still things (headphone audio ffs) that don't work. This thread is about how people today should move off Windows, and how it is trivially easy to do so. I agree people should move off windows. I disagree that it's trivially easy to do so, especially for these class of netbook style machine. I think that your advice (basically "wait until the kernel is updated") is proof that there are problems with these machines.
    - Sir_Cmpwn 10y ago
      ASUS is the exception, not the norm, and dealbreaker bugs are generally only found in recent models. My point is that for nearly everyone, switching to Linux is easy, and people who generalize the whole platform as broken are spreading FUD.
      - 21 10y ago
        So I tried yesterday installing (as a dual boot) Ubuntu on my desktop. 3 year old system, Intel 4770 CPU, Gigabyte motherboard, nothing fancy. Ubuntu 16.10 wouldn't boot from a USB stick, with some PM error and the CPU watchdog errors. Fine, go to all the trouble of plugging in a DVD drive, go out, buy a blank DVD. Same thing. The Ubuntu installation media just hangs with an error. Googling that didn't help.