7 ms·

When I was in single digits, my mother and I were coming home from an international flight and the plane was struck by lightning. We lost a bit of altitude (fel

by M_Grey 10y ago

When I was in single digits, my mother and I were coming home from an international flight and the plane was struck by lightning. We lost a bit of altitude (felt like a TON of altitude subjectively), and yeah... it was a damned good thing we'd all been told to keep those seatbelts on. It was literally the difference between seconds of terror, and someone being seriously injured.

ghshephard 10y ago
Using that philosophy, then anyone riding a bicycle, even if they aren't going at high-speed on road, should wear a helmet "just in case" there is an accident to protect their skull? There is a balance between annoyance and utility. I personally have no problem wearing a belt for the entire flight, including while sleeping. But I'm not to dismayed by those who leave it off, walk around the cabin, go hang out near the cocktail lounge in business class, etc...
- deleted 10y ago
  [deleted]
- sulam 10y ago
  Yes, you absolutely should wear a helmet, just in case -- no quotes required. I have been hit by a car on my bike, and trust me, my helmet absolutely saved my life. No high speed required.
- webignition 10y ago
  Yes, you should absolutely wear a helmet when riding a bicycle at low speeds. Your skull is vulnerable to impacts at speeds that are relatively low compared to full-speed cycling. On a few occasions I've witnessed a cyclist panic and wobble after being passed far too closely by a car traveling far too fast for such a manoeuvre. This has caused such cyclists to wobble, inadvertently clip the curb and mount the pavement, fall off sideways and subsequently strike their head on a nearby wall whilst falling. The resulting injury can be very harmful. Another example of slow-speed head injury: off-road biking down a very steep incline with a loose surface. I've seen people fall and tumble at almost stationary speeds.
  - tajen 10y ago
    Yours are anecdotal evidence of an extremely low risk. There are some bike accidents, which are already rare; Very few involve the head; and even fewer would be saved by a helmet. Whereas, requiring a helmet is a sufficient disincentive to biking that studies have shown that it increases the number of deaths in countries that made it mandatory, by making people drive instead and later die from cardiac diseases and obesity. So yes you should wear a helmet while biking, but we should not make it mandatory. In other counter-intuitive statistics about biking, passing at the red light is good for you.
    - lorenzhs 10y ago
      Please don't turn this into yet another debate on whether making helmet use mandatory is a good idea.
    - M_Grey 10y ago
      "Thinking is pointless, just like motorcycle helmets!" "Rafi, how many of your friends have died in motorcycle accidents?" "Pfft, nine. Buy NONE of them were from head trauma, they all died from massive spinal trauma." Be honest... are you just playing the reference game, or do I need to be really worried?
  - ghshephard 10y ago
    To be clear - any cyclist crazy enough to ride a bicycle on the same road as cars definitely needs all the protection they can get, I think that goes without saying. But now you've moved from the "extraordinary low risk of accident" that comes from cycling to the "Probably one of the most dangerous things I can do" risk factor. And, pretty much 100% of the time I go snowboarding, I wear a helmet. What I'm trying to surface (apparently poorly) is that life, to some degree, is about managing risks. And we often respond carte blanche scenarios with exactly the same response, regardless of whether it's proportionally required. Cycling - on road, moving fast, around anything else moving fast, at all treacherous conditions - sure, yes wear a helmet. But, casual cycling on a nice day, protected path - probably not required. Another area of proportional risk response - portable devices on planes. At one time, end of the world if you had one on during takeout (seriously, other passengers would freak out if they thought yours was on) - and then, all of a sudden - every airport/airline in the United States lets you read your kindle, play games on your phone. People realized their responses were not proportionate to the risk.
- ajdlinux 10y ago
  That happens to be the justification that my country uses to make bicycle helmets mandatory (though there's significant debate about whether it's actually helped reduce injury rates, and it fairly clearly depresses overall rates of cycling versus other modes of transport). I think the cost of wearing an aircraft seatbelt while you happen to be seated is rather lower than the cost of having to wear a bicycle helmet, though.
  - tempestn 10y ago
    What's the cost? Helmets aren't that expensive. Having to carry it around? Could always lock it to the bike. Helmet hair?
    - throwanem 10y ago
      People being afraid their bike helmets make them look like goobers, maybe? Well, they do. Better to be a goober with an unfractured skull, though.
    - mnw21cam 10y ago
      I always thought the statistic that mandatory helmets reduced cycling was a bit pathetic myself. It really isn't that hard. Yes, I have come off my bike and hit my head, while wearing a helmet. Unfortunately, I landed on a tooth rather than my helmet, which wasn't a lot of fun. Regarding helmet hair, I had a colleague who had the most amazing hair spikes (think coffee cup sized), who would very carefully put a cycle helmet on every day before cycling home.
    - throwaway7767 10y ago
      Locking it to the bike isn't a good solution if you live in a place where it rains or snows a lot. So you end up having to carry it with you on errands. If you bike a lot, those small inconveniences add up. I can't imagine fashion sense is much of a reason, that seems like a strawman argument commonly conjured up by helmet laws advocates.
    - lmm 10y ago
      Would you be ok with a mandatory helmet law for car drivers and passengers? The risk of a head injury that a helmet would prevent is much higher in a car, and carrying a helmet around in your car is more convenient than on your bike (e.g. it's much less likely to get stolen). Nevertheless, we don't have mandatory helmet laws for people in cars; why is that?
- _ph_ 10y ago
  I think the bicycle helmet comparison is valid here - one big point is, that the typical bicycle helmets are not protecting your head well, you would need a motorcycle helmet for good protection. I don't think one needs to be confined to the seat for the whole flight duration, but when sitting down, there is no good reason not to wear a belt either.
  - ptaipale 10y ago
    Bicycle helmets are a compromise of course; a heavier helmet would give better protection but would be very cumbersome. But even light helmets give a lot of protection against very simple, silly accidents, like not noticing a bump on the road, or failing to unclip when slowing down.
    - Moru 10y ago
      And there are ofcourse better or worse bicycle helmets around. And the way you wear them is also important. I have helped a large number of kids around my block put them on correctly after seeing them mostly hanging on the back because the parents don't know how to set the length and angle of the strap...
- sneak 10y ago
  There is a pretty good statistical argument for wearing a helmet anytime one is near roads, sidewalks, moving walkways, bike lanes, or anywhere else objects are moving more than 0.5m/s, whether you are moving or not. You can even die relatively simply from falling from an otherwise motionless standing position and hitting your head on the paved ground. The brain is remarkably fragile. I kind of want the helmet-in-public fashion trend to kick in.
  - jen729w 10y ago
    Here in Australia, where they're mandatory, us 'hipster' types get around this by wearing helmets that look like the sort of 'crash hat' that skateboarders wear: very dome-like, skull-shaped things rather than the traditional swept-back-vents-all-over helmets that your racing cyclist would wear. Hotter in summer, but they look cooler. ;-) FWIW, I thought it was weird at first having to wear a helmet. I'm from the UK. Now, though, it just seems bizarre that I wouldn't. It's my skull! My brain is in there. It only takes one idiot, and knocking my head off concrete from 6ft up at even 10km/h sounds like a terrible idea. Anything that cushions the blow, even if that blow is unlikely, now seems like the most obvious idea in the world.
    - ptaipale 10y ago
      Indeed. I feel naked if I start to cycle without a helmet (even though they are not strictly mandatory here, the law says you should wear one but there are no penalties for not wearing it.)
    - Moru 10y ago
      But a skateboard helmet doesn't work as well as a bicycle helmet when bicyckling. They are made for different falling types. They are better than nothing but not as good as the better bicycle helmets.
      - jen729w 10y ago
        Sorry, thought about it at the time but didn't write it - they are actual bicycle helmets styled like skateboard helmets. They're fully rated for bike riding. If the cops stop you (which they do, occasionally) and you are actually wearing a skate helmet, not rated for bike riding, that doesn't count as 'wearing a helmet' and you'll be fined. (I'm sure the idea of being fined for wearing the wrong helmet will horrify some people but remember, that's the law here. The law also says you need a bell on your bike. It's rare, but the bike police do random stops and if you don't have a bell, strictly speaking, you'll be fined. Never happened to me, but it can.) ((Which, by the way - and sorry for the errata with the double-brackets - I actually support. I ride through central Melbourne. Pedestrians are a nightmare. Having a working bell is actually important. They cost $5. The law is a public service which, in this case, works. Get a bell.))
- mikko-apo 10y ago
  Keeping the safety belt on protects other passengers too. A person weighing 80kg has surprisingly high amount of kinetic energy when the plane trashes around. Kinetic energy is also the reason why the flight attendants try to lock as much as possible of the loose items to the overhead bins or under the chairs.
- JoshTriplett 10y ago
  > Using that philosophy, then anyone riding a bicycle, even if they aren't going at high-speed on road, should wear a helmet "just in case" there is an accident to protect their skull? Having personally done a header over the handlebars onto my helmet, resulting in a dented helmet and an un-dented head: yes, I'd recommend it.
- peteretep 10y ago
  > anyone riding a bicycle, > even if they aren't going at > high-speed on road, should > wear a helmet "just in case" Is this a trick question? The answer is yes. In many places it's a legal requirement.
  - Zombieball 10y ago
    Thank you! I'm probably heavily influenced by the fact that I live in one of these places (where helmets are a legal requirement). All I could think while reading this is "yes, you definitely should always wear a helmet!!"
    - throwaway7767 10y ago
      Out of curiosity, is cycling a common mode of transportation where you are from? I recall seeing studies showing that helmet-laws generally coincided with low use of bicycles. Places where cycling is extremely common (like Denmark and Holland) never seem to have them, and it's uncommon to see cyclists using them unless they're doing something particularly dangerous (riding in traffic, off-road, etc).
      - uzoodoo 10y ago
        I would guess in places where biking is extremely common (like Denmark and Holland), it's also a lot safer to bike (dedicated bike lanes, etc.)
- mikestew 10y ago
  Using that philosophy, then anyone riding a bicycle, even if they aren't going at high-speed on road, should wear a helmet "just in case" there is an accident to protect their skull? Speed only makes a difference if your head hits something whilst moving at that speed. Or you can just fall off at a walking pace, and the acceleration between the top of your head to the ground is enough to kill you. Happened to a guy on the local trail a few years ago, as happens elsewhere as well.
hueving 10y ago
What likely happened is that you hit a wind shear at the same time as being struck by lightning. Planes are struck by lightning frequently without passengers even realizing.
- jkchu 10y ago
  I flew into Dallas during a storm once, plane was struck by lightning many, many times. It was pretty spooky, but that was all. The lightning simply passes through the exterior of the plane. However if there is a gap in the exterior, then damage could occur. https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/what-happens-when-lightni/ https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/what-happens-when...

by M_Grey 10y ago

ghshephard 10y ago

Using that philosophy, then anyone riding a bicycle, even if they aren't going at high-speed on road, should wear a helmet "just in case" there is an accident to protect their skull? There is a balance between annoyance and utility. I personally have no problem wearing a belt for the entire flight, including while sleeping. But I'm not to dismayed by those who leave it off, walk around the cabin, go hang out near the cocktail lounge in business class, etc...

deleted 10y ago
[deleted]
sulam 10y ago
Yes, you absolutely should wear a helmet, just in case -- no quotes required. I have been hit by a car on my bike, and trust me, my helmet absolutely saved my life. No high speed required.
webignition 10y ago
Yes, you should absolutely wear a helmet when riding a bicycle at low speeds. Your skull is vulnerable to impacts at speeds that are relatively low compared to full-speed cycling. On a few occasions I've witnessed a cyclist panic and wobble after being passed far too closely by a car traveling far too fast for such a manoeuvre. This has caused such cyclists to wobble, inadvertently clip the curb and mount the pavement, fall off sideways and subsequently strike their head on a nearby wall whilst falling. The resulting injury can be very harmful. Another example of slow-speed head injury: off-road biking down a very steep incline with a loose surface. I've seen people fall and tumble at almost stationary speeds.
- tajen 10y ago
  Yours are anecdotal evidence of an extremely low risk. There are some bike accidents, which are already rare; Very few involve the head; and even fewer would be saved by a helmet. Whereas, requiring a helmet is a sufficient disincentive to biking that studies have shown that it increases the number of deaths in countries that made it mandatory, by making people drive instead and later die from cardiac diseases and obesity. So yes you should wear a helmet while biking, but we should not make it mandatory. In other counter-intuitive statistics about biking, passing at the red light is good for you.
  - lorenzhs 10y ago
    Please don't turn this into yet another debate on whether making helmet use mandatory is a good idea.
  - M_Grey 10y ago
    "Thinking is pointless, just like motorcycle helmets!" "Rafi, how many of your friends have died in motorcycle accidents?" "Pfft, nine. Buy NONE of them were from head trauma, they all died from massive spinal trauma." Be honest... are you just playing the reference game, or do I need to be really worried?
- ghshephard 10y ago
  To be clear - any cyclist crazy enough to ride a bicycle on the same road as cars definitely needs all the protection they can get, I think that goes without saying. But now you've moved from the "extraordinary low risk of accident" that comes from cycling to the "Probably one of the most dangerous things I can do" risk factor. And, pretty much 100% of the time I go snowboarding, I wear a helmet. What I'm trying to surface (apparently poorly) is that life, to some degree, is about managing risks. And we often respond carte blanche scenarios with exactly the same response, regardless of whether it's proportionally required. Cycling - on road, moving fast, around anything else moving fast, at all treacherous conditions - sure, yes wear a helmet. But, casual cycling on a nice day, protected path - probably not required. Another area of proportional risk response - portable devices on planes. At one time, end of the world if you had one on during takeout (seriously, other passengers would freak out if they thought yours was on) - and then, all of a sudden - every airport/airline in the United States lets you read your kindle, play games on your phone. People realized their responses were not proportionate to the risk.
ajdlinux 10y ago
That happens to be the justification that my country uses to make bicycle helmets mandatory (though there's significant debate about whether it's actually helped reduce injury rates, and it fairly clearly depresses overall rates of cycling versus other modes of transport). I think the cost of wearing an aircraft seatbelt while you happen to be seated is rather lower than the cost of having to wear a bicycle helmet, though.
- tempestn 10y ago
  What's the cost? Helmets aren't that expensive. Having to carry it around? Could always lock it to the bike. Helmet hair?
  - throwanem 10y ago
    People being afraid their bike helmets make them look like goobers, maybe? Well, they do. Better to be a goober with an unfractured skull, though.
  - mnw21cam 10y ago
    I always thought the statistic that mandatory helmets reduced cycling was a bit pathetic myself. It really isn't that hard. Yes, I have come off my bike and hit my head, while wearing a helmet. Unfortunately, I landed on a tooth rather than my helmet, which wasn't a lot of fun. Regarding helmet hair, I had a colleague who had the most amazing hair spikes (think coffee cup sized), who would very carefully put a cycle helmet on every day before cycling home.
  - throwaway7767 10y ago
    Locking it to the bike isn't a good solution if you live in a place where it rains or snows a lot. So you end up having to carry it with you on errands. If you bike a lot, those small inconveniences add up. I can't imagine fashion sense is much of a reason, that seems like a strawman argument commonly conjured up by helmet laws advocates.
  - lmm 10y ago
    Would you be ok with a mandatory helmet law for car drivers and passengers? The risk of a head injury that a helmet would prevent is much higher in a car, and carrying a helmet around in your car is more convenient than on your bike (e.g. it's much less likely to get stolen). Nevertheless, we don't have mandatory helmet laws for people in cars; why is that?
_ph_ 10y ago
I think the bicycle helmet comparison is valid here - one big point is, that the typical bicycle helmets are not protecting your head well, you would need a motorcycle helmet for good protection. I don't think one needs to be confined to the seat for the whole flight duration, but when sitting down, there is no good reason not to wear a belt either.
- ptaipale 10y ago
  Bicycle helmets are a compromise of course; a heavier helmet would give better protection but would be very cumbersome. But even light helmets give a lot of protection against very simple, silly accidents, like not noticing a bump on the road, or failing to unclip when slowing down.
  - Moru 10y ago
    And there are ofcourse better or worse bicycle helmets around. And the way you wear them is also important. I have helped a large number of kids around my block put them on correctly after seeing them mostly hanging on the back because the parents don't know how to set the length and angle of the strap...
sneak 10y ago
There is a pretty good statistical argument for wearing a helmet anytime one is near roads, sidewalks, moving walkways, bike lanes, or anywhere else objects are moving more than 0.5m/s, whether you are moving or not. You can even die relatively simply from falling from an otherwise motionless standing position and hitting your head on the paved ground. The brain is remarkably fragile. I kind of want the helmet-in-public fashion trend to kick in.
- jen729w 10y ago
  Here in Australia, where they're mandatory, us 'hipster' types get around this by wearing helmets that look like the sort of 'crash hat' that skateboarders wear: very dome-like, skull-shaped things rather than the traditional swept-back-vents-all-over helmets that your racing cyclist would wear. Hotter in summer, but they look cooler. ;-) FWIW, I thought it was weird at first having to wear a helmet. I'm from the UK. Now, though, it just seems bizarre that I wouldn't. It's my skull! My brain is in there. It only takes one idiot, and knocking my head off concrete from 6ft up at even 10km/h sounds like a terrible idea. Anything that cushions the blow, even if that blow is unlikely, now seems like the most obvious idea in the world.
  - ptaipale 10y ago
    Indeed. I feel naked if I start to cycle without a helmet (even though they are not strictly mandatory here, the law says you should wear one but there are no penalties for not wearing it.)
  - Moru 10y ago
    But a skateboard helmet doesn't work as well as a bicycle helmet when bicyckling. They are made for different falling types. They are better than nothing but not as good as the better bicycle helmets.
    - jen729w 10y ago
      Sorry, thought about it at the time but didn't write it - they are actual bicycle helmets styled like skateboard helmets. They're fully rated for bike riding. If the cops stop you (which they do, occasionally) and you are actually wearing a skate helmet, not rated for bike riding, that doesn't count as 'wearing a helmet' and you'll be fined. (I'm sure the idea of being fined for wearing the wrong helmet will horrify some people but remember, that's the law here. The law also says you need a bell on your bike. It's rare, but the bike police do random stops and if you don't have a bell, strictly speaking, you'll be fined. Never happened to me, but it can.) ((Which, by the way - and sorry for the errata with the double-brackets - I actually support. I ride through central Melbourne. Pedestrians are a nightmare. Having a working bell is actually important. They cost $5. The law is a public service which, in this case, works. Get a bell.))
mikko-apo 10y ago
Keeping the safety belt on protects other passengers too. A person weighing 80kg has surprisingly high amount of kinetic energy when the plane trashes around. Kinetic energy is also the reason why the flight attendants try to lock as much as possible of the loose items to the overhead bins or under the chairs.
JoshTriplett 10y ago
> Using that philosophy, then anyone riding a bicycle, even if they aren't going at high-speed on road, should wear a helmet "just in case" there is an accident to protect their skull? Having personally done a header over the handlebars onto my helmet, resulting in a dented helmet and an un-dented head: yes, I'd recommend it.
peteretep 10y ago
> anyone riding a bicycle, > even if they aren't going at > high-speed on road, should > wear a helmet "just in case" Is this a trick question? The answer is yes. In many places it's a legal requirement.
- Zombieball 10y ago
  Thank you! I'm probably heavily influenced by the fact that I live in one of these places (where helmets are a legal requirement). All I could think while reading this is "yes, you definitely should always wear a helmet!!"
  - throwaway7767 10y ago
    Out of curiosity, is cycling a common mode of transportation where you are from? I recall seeing studies showing that helmet-laws generally coincided with low use of bicycles. Places where cycling is extremely common (like Denmark and Holland) never seem to have them, and it's uncommon to see cyclists using them unless they're doing something particularly dangerous (riding in traffic, off-road, etc).
    - uzoodoo 10y ago
      I would guess in places where biking is extremely common (like Denmark and Holland), it's also a lot safer to bike (dedicated bike lanes, etc.)
mikestew 10y ago
Using that philosophy, then anyone riding a bicycle, even if they aren't going at high-speed on road, should wear a helmet "just in case" there is an accident to protect their skull? Speed only makes a difference if your head hits something whilst moving at that speed. Or you can just fall off at a walking pace, and the acceleration between the top of your head to the ground is enough to kill you. Happened to a guy on the local trail a few years ago, as happens elsewhere as well.

hueving 10y ago

What likely happened is that you hit a wind shear at the same time as being struck by lightning. Planes are struck by lightning frequently without passengers even realizing.

jkchu 10y ago
I flew into Dallas during a storm once, plane was struck by lightning many, many times. It was pretty spooky, but that was all. The lightning simply passes through the exterior of the plane. However if there is a gap in the exterior, then damage could occur. https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/what-happens-when-lightni/ https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/what-happens-when...