3 ms·

Why is mentioning loops a bad sign? The question is simple, and asks for only checking one value; that's a simple answer that, for one value, takes linear time,

Why is mentioning loops a bad sign? The question is simple, and asks for only checking one value; that's a simple answer that, for one value, takes linear time, which is the best you can do (without assuming the array is sorted, but expecting someone to ask you if the array is sorted turns it into a trick question, rather than a real world one). I mean, yes, I'd prefer them to go to a library call for that, but I wouldn't expect them to infer additional complexity from how I stated the problem. Sure, if someone were to start asking questions, finding out that we're doing this operation a lot against the same arrays, so it makes sense to rebuild them into a set, or we're doing it against only sorted arrays so we can do a binary search, or whatever, is great...but that's more interview technique, not actual coding skill. You're clearly asking a contrived problem, have provided no additional context (no business requirement is "search two arrays to see if a number exists in both"), so it's not really fair to assume a prospect will treat it as an ambiguous requirement that needs further refinement. This is really the heart of the issue; you're not testing for basic coding ability, which is what you're thinking you're testing for; your own criteria is testing for whether they assume you're trying to trick them. Talking it out isn't testing for coding ability either; I've met people who could say "You would search through each array to see if you can find the item in question", and then literally could not code that correctly, in their alleged preferred language. If you want to measure whether someone knows to clarify business requirements, give them a business style requirement. "We have an interface that allows users to provide a list of their favorite foods. We want to provide a way for users to compare their own list of foods with that of a potential friend, and see what they share". Okay. That leaves the underlying data structures up the developer (as they are in the real world), and describes a problem they can ask questions around.

onion2k 10y ago
...that's more interview technique, not actual coding skill. The skill and art of "coding" is in finding solutions to problems, not "writing code". When I interview people I'm looking for someone who can explore problems, ask questions, and find good solutions. If they don't feel like they have enough information I expect them to question things. If they're working on assumptions (like 'what does the array actually look like?') I expect them to question those assumptions. Expecting someone to go deeper in to a problem by finding out more is not "trying to trick them", it's a discovering whether or not they can do a fundamental part of any development job.
- rand_r 10y ago
  If you keep questioning assumptions, you'll fine that justified knowledge is theoretically impossible. Don't be ridiculous.
- toast0 10y ago
  The fundamental part of the job being reading your mind? For every interviewer who asks how to find if a number is in both arrays and is expecting a detailed discussion of he to do a nicer job by not actually having arrays, there's another interviewer who just wanted to see if the candidate can write two loops, leave the loops early when the value is found, and not run the second loop if the first one doesn't have the value; expecting to do all that in five minutes so more complex questions can be asked.
  - onion2k 10y ago
    The fundamental part of the job being reading your mind? The fundamental part of the job being that writing code without having a good understanding of the problem is a waste of time and often leads to throwing things away. If an interviewer was annoyed that I asked for more information about a problem before writing any code I'd take that as a sign I wouldn't really fit in at the company. I was a cofounder at a startup that was trying to improve requirements management for a couple of years. This might go some way to explain my attitude about this. I really hate writing code to solve problems without having enough information first. It's so wasteful.
    - tchaffee 10y ago
      > This might go some way to explain my attitude about this Yep. You're giving bad interviews because you're expecting someone to have the same previous recent bad experiences as you. I would never ask about the context of the problem you gave because it is so obviously just a quick coding test. You want questions about the requirements, you need to ask a question that feels like a real world problem.
lostboys67 10y ago
data structures huh ?? thats a ml Q ie what sort of machine learning algo would you use to do that.

onion2k 10y ago

...that's more interview technique, not actual coding skill. The skill and art of "coding" is in finding solutions to problems, not "writing code". When I interview people I'm looking for someone who can explore problems, ask questions, and find good solutions. If they don't feel like they have enough information I expect them to question things. If they're working on assumptions (like 'what does the array actually look like?') I expect them to question those assumptions. Expecting someone to go deeper in to a problem by finding out more is not "trying to trick them", it's a discovering whether or not they can do a fundamental part of any development job.

rand_r 10y ago
If you keep questioning assumptions, you'll fine that justified knowledge is theoretically impossible. Don't be ridiculous.
toast0 10y ago
The fundamental part of the job being reading your mind? For every interviewer who asks how to find if a number is in both arrays and is expecting a detailed discussion of he to do a nicer job by not actually having arrays, there's another interviewer who just wanted to see if the candidate can write two loops, leave the loops early when the value is found, and not run the second loop if the first one doesn't have the value; expecting to do all that in five minutes so more complex questions can be asked.
- onion2k 10y ago
  The fundamental part of the job being reading your mind? The fundamental part of the job being that writing code without having a good understanding of the problem is a waste of time and often leads to throwing things away. If an interviewer was annoyed that I asked for more information about a problem before writing any code I'd take that as a sign I wouldn't really fit in at the company. I was a cofounder at a startup that was trying to improve requirements management for a couple of years. This might go some way to explain my attitude about this. I really hate writing code to solve problems without having enough information first. It's so wasteful.
  - tchaffee 10y ago
    > This might go some way to explain my attitude about this Yep. You're giving bad interviews because you're expecting someone to have the same previous recent bad experiences as you. I would never ask about the context of the problem you gave because it is so obviously just a quick coding test. You want questions about the requirements, you need to ask a question that feels like a real world problem.

lostboys67 10y ago

data structures huh ?? thats a ml Q ie what sort of machine learning algo would you use to do that.