6 ms·

Ask HN: Is front-end engineering ever going away?

9 points by ud0 10y ago

So I was thinking if there would be a time when the world wouldn't need front-end engineers and it would be better to be a full-stack software engineer to be more flexible in the future.

mvpu 10y ago
Um, no. If you're asking about JavaScript, be warned: it's invading the backend.
- acchow 10y ago
  Prediction: Future web backends will be running node but executing asm code transpiled from Ocaml/Reason </s>
  - bbcbasic 10y ago
    There will be multiple translations. Developer won't even know what platform they are developing for. It'll be serverless.
- mythrwy 10y ago
  I prefer the term "infesting".
  - mrmondo 10y ago
    Devistating and consuming memory and executing it off the stack
- endisukaj 10y ago
  If it's invading the backend then people clearly like it and helps more and more people get their job done in an easier fashion than other languages. What would you rather have people use for the backend?
anonyfox 10y ago
I really hope for a standardized universal UI to emerge, maybe something like the futuristic screens in Deus Ex games. There just needs to be something like a hypermedia-api on a server, some semantic content markup, and all consumers (browsers, terminals, ...) handle everything else. As a developer I just want to provide an data/api endpoint and say somehow "this is an universal UI app". No, Basic HTML isnt enough, and wiring together data into presentable forms over and over again isnt particular fun or exciting after a while. Except you learn a new frontend framework for every project... :)
- moondev 10y ago
  as soon as the Deus Ex screen spec is finished someone will write a react renderer for it
- mrfusion 10y ago
  That's a great idea. I wish it would happen. But I worry it's a lot like asking for standardized clothes or cars. Great ideas in theory but everyone wants some level of differentiation. I'm not sure why.
- spcelzrd 10y ago
  I think the front end guys are thinking, I really hope for a standardized universal back end to emerge, maybe something like HAL or a Siri that works. I'm joking, of course. But I think front end and full stack developers are safe for a very long time.
digitalzombie 10y ago
Uh.. I was full stack engineer and I would rather stay mostly backend than touch front end. It's just wild wild west when I was still a full stack dev. There was these clientside rendering framework emberjs, angular, knockoutjs, etc... What the hell man, now the flavor is fluxjs and reactjs or whatever. This is on top of html and css being more of an art then a science. Then came along the grid system to fix most of the warts but cross browser compatibility, etc... I don't believe front end engineer is going away because there is just so much stuff in front end and back end to be for one person. You can be a fullstack but you can't be a master of all of it unless you got no life, no family, etc..
- RUG3Y 10y ago
  I do a little bit of everything, front-end, back-end, databases etc., and man, the front-end feels like such a janky disaster to me. I really miss the simplicity of the "old" internet that I had growing up (I'm in my 30's). I'm with you, I'd much rather be writing code on the back-end and spend my time solving interesting problems. My front-end problems are almost invariably styling/ display issues, etc. The kind of problems that are just labor to solve, not interesting.
et-al 10y ago
If you're talking about just constructing new JS views, creating templates, and styling them, yes I think that will be relegated a WYSIWYG editor for a designer to weld. I know people said this was going to happen when Dreamweaver came out, but the languages were still clunky. CSS had barely come out and layouts were done by nesting tables within tables. The machine-created code was shit and browsers were wildly inconsistent. Now we have decent browser consistency between Firefox/Chrome/Safari, CSS grids are arriving, and React component web views are gaining more traction. So in 5-10 years, why can't we have an editor that does all this for you? Yes, there will always be a need for custom interfaces. So a small amount of front-end folks will remain hand-crafting artisan components (and perhaps selling them on a Wordpress-like market place), while other people will either need to move into design/UX roles, or further down the stack.
RikNieu 10y ago
I don't think so. There would always be a need for specialists. Maybe full-stack engineers would have an easier time finding employment(as requiters keep on piling up those needs-to-know requirements), but some shops will always value someone who's shit-hot at one specific thing in particular, as opposed to merely competent at a lot.
dagw 10y ago
Depends what you mean by front-end engineer. If you are interested in front-end work I would focus on brushing up on your UX and design skill. I have no particular need for someone who only knows how to implement a front end based on an exact spec, I would however love to have a developer on my team who can actually both come up with and implement a good looking, easy to use front end.
- responde 10y ago
  This is not realistic. UX, design and HTML/CSS/JS(this one's a beast) Have all become complex such that it's rare to find someone who can handle all aforementioned roles efficiently. Web UI's are becoming complex everyday, and rightly so as the world has demanded more from the web. It is very unrealistic to handle all roles or find someone who does.
  - eswat 10y ago
    It’s not that unrealistic if the team is willing to let go of the idea of finding someone that’s perfect in all three: UX, design and front-end. Teams just have to find a person that’s effective given their existing team and their immediate goals. I have broad skills across all three but double-down on whatever vertical the team I’m working with needs the most help with and this does not require me having to handle all three roles perfectly.
  - dagw 10y ago
    I don't think it's any less realistic than hoping to find someone who understands front-end, back-end and databases, and yet 'we' ask for that all the time.
- peterchon 10y ago
  As a graphic designer turned developer, yes - there's an enormous amount of demand for designer/developer hybrid.
edimaudo 10y ago
There is still a demand for front end devs since there are so many frameworks that are coming out and so many to maintain. I would still go for full stack roles as it would give you better job security. Plus, it would gives you a better view of how the system works.
peterchon 10y ago
Since we're heading towards a AI-driven applications, perhaps front-end has plateaued. However, would full-stack still be so relevant if front end is no-longer a concern?

9 points by ud0 10y ago

So I was thinking if there would be a time when the world wouldn't need front-end engineers and it would be better to be a full-stack software engineer to be more flexible in the future.

mvpu 10y ago

Um, no. If you're asking about JavaScript, be warned: it's invading the backend.

acchow 10y ago
Prediction: Future web backends will be running node but executing asm code transpiled from Ocaml/Reason </s>
- bbcbasic 10y ago
  There will be multiple translations. Developer won't even know what platform they are developing for. It'll be serverless.
mythrwy 10y ago
I prefer the term "infesting".
- mrmondo 10y ago
  Devistating and consuming memory and executing it off the stack
endisukaj 10y ago
If it's invading the backend then people clearly like it and helps more and more people get their job done in an easier fashion than other languages. What would you rather have people use for the backend?

anonyfox 10y ago

I really hope for a standardized universal UI to emerge, maybe something like the futuristic screens in Deus Ex games. There just needs to be something like a hypermedia-api on a server, some semantic content markup, and all consumers (browsers, terminals, ...) handle everything else. As a developer I just want to provide an data/api endpoint and say somehow "this is an universal UI app". No, Basic HTML isnt enough, and wiring together data into presentable forms over and over again isnt particular fun or exciting after a while. Except you learn a new frontend framework for every project... :)

moondev 10y ago
as soon as the Deus Ex screen spec is finished someone will write a react renderer for it
mrfusion 10y ago
That's a great idea. I wish it would happen. But I worry it's a lot like asking for standardized clothes or cars. Great ideas in theory but everyone wants some level of differentiation. I'm not sure why.
spcelzrd 10y ago
I think the front end guys are thinking, I really hope for a standardized universal back end to emerge, maybe something like HAL or a Siri that works. I'm joking, of course. But I think front end and full stack developers are safe for a very long time.

digitalzombie 10y ago

Uh.. I was full stack engineer and I would rather stay mostly backend than touch front end. It's just wild wild west when I was still a full stack dev. There was these clientside rendering framework emberjs, angular, knockoutjs, etc... What the hell man, now the flavor is fluxjs and reactjs or whatever. This is on top of html and css being more of an art then a science. Then came along the grid system to fix most of the warts but cross browser compatibility, etc... I don't believe front end engineer is going away because there is just so much stuff in front end and back end to be for one person. You can be a fullstack but you can't be a master of all of it unless you got no life, no family, etc..

RUG3Y 10y ago
I do a little bit of everything, front-end, back-end, databases etc., and man, the front-end feels like such a janky disaster to me. I really miss the simplicity of the "old" internet that I had growing up (I'm in my 30's). I'm with you, I'd much rather be writing code on the back-end and spend my time solving interesting problems. My front-end problems are almost invariably styling/ display issues, etc. The kind of problems that are just labor to solve, not interesting.

et-al 10y ago

If you're talking about just constructing new JS views, creating templates, and styling them, yes I think that will be relegated a WYSIWYG editor for a designer to weld. I know people said this was going to happen when Dreamweaver came out, but the languages were still clunky. CSS had barely come out and layouts were done by nesting tables within tables. The machine-created code was shit and browsers were wildly inconsistent. Now we have decent browser consistency between Firefox/Chrome/Safari, CSS grids are arriving, and React component web views are gaining more traction. So in 5-10 years, why can't we have an editor that does all this for you? Yes, there will always be a need for custom interfaces. So a small amount of front-end folks will remain hand-crafting artisan components (and perhaps selling them on a Wordpress-like market place), while other people will either need to move into design/UX roles, or further down the stack.

RikNieu 10y ago

I don't think so. There would always be a need for specialists. Maybe full-stack engineers would have an easier time finding employment(as requiters keep on piling up those needs-to-know requirements), but some shops will always value someone who's shit-hot at one specific thing in particular, as opposed to merely competent at a lot.

dagw 10y ago

Depends what you mean by front-end engineer. If you are interested in front-end work I would focus on brushing up on your UX and design skill. I have no particular need for someone who only knows how to implement a front end based on an exact spec, I would however love to have a developer on my team who can actually both come up with and implement a good looking, easy to use front end.

responde 10y ago
This is not realistic. UX, design and HTML/CSS/JS(this one's a beast) Have all become complex such that it's rare to find someone who can handle all aforementioned roles efficiently. Web UI's are becoming complex everyday, and rightly so as the world has demanded more from the web. It is very unrealistic to handle all roles or find someone who does.
- eswat 10y ago
  It’s not that unrealistic if the team is willing to let go of the idea of finding someone that’s perfect in all three: UX, design and front-end. Teams just have to find a person that’s effective given their existing team and their immediate goals. I have broad skills across all three but double-down on whatever vertical the team I’m working with needs the most help with and this does not require me having to handle all three roles perfectly.
- dagw 10y ago
  I don't think it's any less realistic than hoping to find someone who understands front-end, back-end and databases, and yet 'we' ask for that all the time.
peterchon 10y ago
As a graphic designer turned developer, yes - there's an enormous amount of demand for designer/developer hybrid.

edimaudo 10y ago

There is still a demand for front end devs since there are so many frameworks that are coming out and so many to maintain. I would still go for full stack roles as it would give you better job security. Plus, it would gives you a better view of how the system works.

peterchon 10y ago

Since we're heading towards a AI-driven applications, perhaps front-end has plateaued. However, would full-stack still be so relevant if front end is no-longer a concern?