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I think building a wall will increase the net flow of illegal immigrants as currently more people are leaving than entering. http://www.pewhispanic.org/2015/11

I think building a wall will increase the net flow of illegal immigrants as currently more people are leaving than entering. http://www.pewhispanic.org/2015/11/19/more-mexicans-leaving-than-coming-to-the-u-s/ http://www.pewhispanic.org/2015/11/19/more-mexicans-leaving-... I don't think you need >3x the annual median income (that's top 10%) for immigrants to benefit. Economics research says high wage immigrants benefit while low wage immigrants benefit the natives on net, although it may harm some natives. In my opinion, even if it may harm some natives, due to the poverty alleviating effects of immigration, we should open immigration to anyone who doesn't have a criminal record. This isn't that crazy, till 1914 in the U.S.: "Generally, those immigrants who were approved spent from two to five hours at Ellis Island. Arrivals were asked 29 questions including name, occupation, and the amount of money carried. It was important to the American government that the new arrivals could support themselves and have money to get started. The average the government wanted the immigrants to have was between 18 and 25 dollars ($600 in 2015 adjusted for inflation). Those with visible health problems or diseases were sent home or held in the island's hospital facilities for long periods of time. More than three thousand would-be immigrants died on Ellis Island while being held in the hospital facilities. Some unskilled workers were rejected because they were considered "likely to become a public charge." About 2 percent were denied admission to the U.S. and sent back to their countries of origin for reasons such as having a chronic contagious disease, criminal background, or insanity." (from https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ellis_Island#Primary_inspection https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ellis_Island#Primary_inspectio... ) What I want is this minus the racism and disqualification for health problems except maybe for contagious diseases.

falsestprophet 10y ago
"This isn't that crazy, till 1914 in the U.S." Are you sure nothing has changed about the economy since 1914?
- witty_username 10y ago
  I am not saying that and I think the only relevant change is welfare programs—which we can remove/limit for immigrants to stop it from being excessively costly. Tell me a relevant change that affects my case. Take a look at https://openborders.info https://openborders.info for lots of reasons.
Oxitendwe 10y ago
>In my opinion, even if it may harm some natives, due to the poverty alleviating effects of immigration, we should open immigration to anyone who doesn't have a criminal record. What is the point of government if not to act in the best interests of its citizens? Why are our governments now apparently obligated to act in the best interests of foreign nationals? This has nothing to do with alleviating poverty or humanitarian ideals. It's blatantly obvious that this advocacy for open borders is part of a power grab by the left to ensure that they stay in power for decades to come, at the expense of the people who actually built the society that they want to invite everyone else to live in. What party do they think these people are going to overwhelmingly vote for? I don't understand how people can openly advocate for destroying our society just for political gain.
- witty_username 10y ago
  > What is the point of government if not to act in the best interests of its citizens? Why are our governments now apparently obligated to act in the best interests of foreign nationals? This has nothing to do with alleviating poverty or humanitarian ideals. It's blatantly obvious that this advocacy for open borders is part of a power grab by the left to ensure that they stay in power for decades to come, at the expense of the people who actually built the society that they want to invite everyone else to live in. What party do they think these people are going to overwhelmingly vote for? I don't understand how people can openly advocate for destroying our society just for political gain. I self-identify as a neoliberal (fiscally conservative); is that part of the left? Economics research says low wage immigrants are a net economic benefit, so it is in the interest of its citizens, but not completely objectively as some people are harmed. Also, I think the extreme poverty in parts of the world can justify help, just like how 1000$ is more to a poor person than a millionaire. No, immigration alleviates poverty as Americans are much richer than the average person. Why do you think so many people want to immigrate? I don't think it's a power grab by the left (open borders are not popular, as you can see right here) and that's irrelevant to the merits of open borders. > the people who actually built the society that they want to invite everyone else to live in This criticism seems to be for leftists. Well, I am against forcing racial diversity, so you can stay with your ethnic group/society in my proposal.

falsestprophet 10y ago

"This isn't that crazy, till 1914 in the U.S." Are you sure nothing has changed about the economy since 1914?

witty_username 10y ago
I am not saying that and I think the only relevant change is welfare programs—which we can remove/limit for immigrants to stop it from being excessively costly. Tell me a relevant change that affects my case. Take a look at https://openborders.info https://openborders.info for lots of reasons.

Oxitendwe 10y ago

>In my opinion, even if it may harm some natives, due to the poverty alleviating effects of immigration, we should open immigration to anyone who doesn't have a criminal record. What is the point of government if not to act in the best interests of its citizens? Why are our governments now apparently obligated to act in the best interests of foreign nationals? This has nothing to do with alleviating poverty or humanitarian ideals. It's blatantly obvious that this advocacy for open borders is part of a power grab by the left to ensure that they stay in power for decades to come, at the expense of the people who actually built the society that they want to invite everyone else to live in. What party do they think these people are going to overwhelmingly vote for? I don't understand how people can openly advocate for destroying our society just for political gain.

witty_username 10y ago
> What is the point of government if not to act in the best interests of its citizens? Why are our governments now apparently obligated to act in the best interests of foreign nationals? This has nothing to do with alleviating poverty or humanitarian ideals. It's blatantly obvious that this advocacy for open borders is part of a power grab by the left to ensure that they stay in power for decades to come, at the expense of the people who actually built the society that they want to invite everyone else to live in. What party do they think these people are going to overwhelmingly vote for? I don't understand how people can openly advocate for destroying our society just for political gain. I self-identify as a neoliberal (fiscally conservative); is that part of the left? Economics research says low wage immigrants are a net economic benefit, so it is in the interest of its citizens, but not completely objectively as some people are harmed. Also, I think the extreme poverty in parts of the world can justify help, just like how 1000$ is more to a poor person than a millionaire. No, immigration alleviates poverty as Americans are much richer than the average person. Why do you think so many people want to immigrate? I don't think it's a power grab by the left (open borders are not popular, as you can see right here) and that's irrelevant to the merits of open borders. > the people who actually built the society that they want to invite everyone else to live in This criticism seems to be for leftists. Well, I am against forcing racial diversity, so you can stay with your ethnic group/society in my proposal.