4 ms·

alimony and child support 6 million cash 10 percent of his stock in Tesla 5 percent of his stock in SpaceX (and he retains all voting rights) and a Te

by Aetius 16y ago

alimony and child support 6 million cash 10 percent of his stock in Tesla 5 percent of his stock in SpaceX (and he retains all voting rights) and a Tesla Roadster (I really, really want one...) I don't want to go through the trouble of normalizing this wish list into a scalar percentage, but it seems like a lot less than half of his assets... Would you take the deal?

lionhearted 16y ago
> I don't want to go through the trouble of normalizing this wish list into a scalar percentage, but it seems like a lot less than half of his assets... Yeah, I thought so too, so I figured she must be really, really cool and grateful to be with such an amazing guy and have kids with him and an amazing life, so she wanted to keep it friendly and not try to take him to the cleaners. Then I read a couple of her blog posts, and no, she doesn't seem like she wants to keep it friendly. So I was confused, and did some Googling: "The case highlights an aspect of Orange County and other Southern California divorce proceedings that is not often publicized: the post-marital agreement (which is less well-known, at least to the public, than are prenuptial agreements). Justine contends that the agreement she signed shortly after the couple wed is "extremely harsh" and has asked the California divorce court to throw it out." http://www.orangecountydivorcelawyerblog.com/prenuptial-agreements/2010/05/ http://www.orangecountydivorcelawyerblog.com/prenuptial-agre... So, maybe that sheds some light on it.
- jacquesm 16y ago
  Then she probably shouldn't have signed it.
  - sethg 16y ago
    I am not a lawyer and, not having read the Musks’ post-nup, I have no opinion about whether or not it is valid. However, every real-world legal system since the beginning of time has put limits on what kinds of signed agreements between two people can be enforced as contracts under the law, and everyone who has run a multimillion-dollar businesses is aware of this. If the contract that Mrs. Musk signed was unconscionably unfair to her, Mr. Musk probably should not have drafted it in the first place.
    - jacquesm 16y ago
      I take it she had a lawyer review it before signing it, as is customary in such situations.
- sethg 16y ago
  If my wife got rich and, God forbid, we got a divorce, and I offered to let her keep a lot more than half of the marital assets, and she demanded an even larger share, I might lose my motivation to “keep it friendly”.
- jcnnghm 16y ago
  Bingo. She's not asking for more because she's trying to make it cheaper for him to just pay her, than it would be for him to fight her. Why does she deserve anything for his work?
  - DaniFong 16y ago
    Spouses bare a significant amount of the risks and emotional hardships of founders. They can be up late, discussing ideas into dawn, making food, or educating/entertaining their five children as one digs in. Being married to a founder could represent a moral weight that's probably equivalent to that of the earliest early employees -- if they truly do support it.
  - erikpukinskis 16y ago
    She ostensibly raised his kids, and made a lot of sacrifices for "his" work. I don't know, but I would guess there were a lot of nights alone with the kids. That's work too. She could've married someone who would work 9 to 5 and come up and help with the household. She didn't, she took on that extra burden, just as he took on the extra burden of his startups. They both took on a burden to make that possible.
- quickpost 16y ago
  "The irony of this whole thing is that I don't want hundreds of millions of dollars. I think my ex-husband is brilliant and works like a demon and deserves his success and his wealth. But I also think -- after eight years of marriage and six kids (five surviving) -- that I am entitled to a fair settlement..." http://moschus.livejournal.com/140502.html http://moschus.livejournal.com/140502.html I think her demands are surprisingly reasonable, with the exceptions being the stakes in Tesla and SpaceX, which I think Elon doesn't want to give her for understandable reasons (IPO Complications, Pride, etc.).
_delirium 16y ago
Those numbers and the article don't seem to make the "ran out of cash" part due to a divorce add up. He made $17m per year on average for years, and having to pay $6m is what bankrupted him? I.e. losing a mere four months' income? It seems the worst it could've done is advanced his impending cash crunch by a few months, if he was already burning through cash at such a rate.
- Aetius 16y ago
  If you reread, it says he reinvested all of his proceeds, so a sudden lien on illiquid assets could definitely cause a lot of problems.
daniel-cussen 16y ago
She also has five of his kids, so yes, I would.

by Aetius 16y ago

lionhearted 16y ago

> I don't want to go through the trouble of normalizing this wish list into a scalar percentage, but it seems like a lot less than half of his assets... Yeah, I thought so too, so I figured she must be really, really cool and grateful to be with such an amazing guy and have kids with him and an amazing life, so she wanted to keep it friendly and not try to take him to the cleaners. Then I read a couple of her blog posts, and no, she doesn't seem like she wants to keep it friendly. So I was confused, and did some Googling: "The case highlights an aspect of Orange County and other Southern California divorce proceedings that is not often publicized: the post-marital agreement (which is less well-known, at least to the public, than are prenuptial agreements). Justine contends that the agreement she signed shortly after the couple wed is "extremely harsh" and has asked the California divorce court to throw it out." http://www.orangecountydivorcelawyerblog.com/prenuptial-agreements/2010/05/ http://www.orangecountydivorcelawyerblog.com/prenuptial-agre... So, maybe that sheds some light on it.

jacquesm 16y ago
Then she probably shouldn't have signed it.
- sethg 16y ago
  I am not a lawyer and, not having read the Musks’ post-nup, I have no opinion about whether or not it is valid. However, every real-world legal system since the beginning of time has put limits on what kinds of signed agreements between two people can be enforced as contracts under the law, and everyone who has run a multimillion-dollar businesses is aware of this. If the contract that Mrs. Musk signed was unconscionably unfair to her, Mr. Musk probably should not have drafted it in the first place.
  - jacquesm 16y ago
    I take it she had a lawyer review it before signing it, as is customary in such situations.
sethg 16y ago
If my wife got rich and, God forbid, we got a divorce, and I offered to let her keep a lot more than half of the marital assets, and she demanded an even larger share, I might lose my motivation to “keep it friendly”.
jcnnghm 16y ago
Bingo. She's not asking for more because she's trying to make it cheaper for him to just pay her, than it would be for him to fight her. Why does she deserve anything for his work?
- DaniFong 16y ago
  Spouses bare a significant amount of the risks and emotional hardships of founders. They can be up late, discussing ideas into dawn, making food, or educating/entertaining their five children as one digs in. Being married to a founder could represent a moral weight that's probably equivalent to that of the earliest early employees -- if they truly do support it.
- erikpukinskis 16y ago
  She ostensibly raised his kids, and made a lot of sacrifices for "his" work. I don't know, but I would guess there were a lot of nights alone with the kids. That's work too. She could've married someone who would work 9 to 5 and come up and help with the household. She didn't, she took on that extra burden, just as he took on the extra burden of his startups. They both took on a burden to make that possible.
quickpost 16y ago
"The irony of this whole thing is that I don't want hundreds of millions of dollars. I think my ex-husband is brilliant and works like a demon and deserves his success and his wealth. But I also think -- after eight years of marriage and six kids (five surviving) -- that I am entitled to a fair settlement..." http://moschus.livejournal.com/140502.html http://moschus.livejournal.com/140502.html I think her demands are surprisingly reasonable, with the exceptions being the stakes in Tesla and SpaceX, which I think Elon doesn't want to give her for understandable reasons (IPO Complications, Pride, etc.).

_delirium 16y ago

Those numbers and the article don't seem to make the "ran out of cash" part due to a divorce add up. He made $17m per year on average for years, and having to pay $6m is what bankrupted him? I.e. losing a mere four months' income? It seems the worst it could've done is advanced his impending cash crunch by a few months, if he was already burning through cash at such a rate.

Aetius 16y ago
If you reread, it says he reinvested all of his proceeds, so a sudden lien on illiquid assets could definitely cause a lot of problems.

daniel-cussen 16y ago

She also has five of his kids, so yes, I would.