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I don't see this getting better. In fact, I think the next big trick in web browsers will be to embed a full-blown GUI widget toolkit, so you can run what would

I don't see this getting better. In fact, I think the next big trick in web browsers will be to embed a full-blown GUI widget toolkit, so you can run what would effectively be a Visual Basic 6.0-type program, directly in the browser, allowing you to bypass all the HTML5/CSS/JS layers we slather on top of whatever framework we're using to make it approach the same UX as a desktop app. It's going to take even more bandwidth to deliver this kind of app, but no one seems to care about that anyway.

zackbloom 10y ago
I think you're dead wrong about this. Desktop developers have been thinking for decades all the web needs is a more-desktop-like environment. The general conclusion of web developers is that they like html, CSS and JavaScript and want them to improve, not disappear. Many people see them as the evolution of GUI development, not anything to be removed.
- zigzigzag 10y ago
  Only web developers that have never actually written desktop apps think that in my experience. The prevalence of hacks, frameworks and layers that try to make the web stack marginally less terrible suggest that no, they don't like html, css and javascript - they deal with them because they have no other choice and it's all they've ever known. Just take SASS as an example. Why does it exist?
  - fiatjaf 10y ago
    Because CSS is good enough to allow for some other language to be transpiled to it?
ashark 10y ago
There'll be desktop-style GUI toolkits that render to webGL not long after webassembly starts seeing serious adoption, I'd guess.
keypress 10y ago
Can pretty much do all that in a Java applet, and have been able to for a long time.
- fiatjaf 10y ago
  Java applets are not supported anymore anywhere, I think.
  - Silhouette 10y ago
    Business using IE and Safari are still running them fine, and they're still supported in the latest Firefox ESR (though it will reportedly be the last). However, with the recent changes in Firefox, no "evergreen" browser now supports them.
- Silhouette 10y ago
  Not any more... Meet the new boss: same as the old boss, but now you have to learn to deal with them all over again. :-(

zackbloom 10y ago

I think you're dead wrong about this. Desktop developers have been thinking for decades all the web needs is a more-desktop-like environment. The general conclusion of web developers is that they like html, CSS and JavaScript and want them to improve, not disappear. Many people see them as the evolution of GUI development, not anything to be removed.

zigzigzag 10y ago
Only web developers that have never actually written desktop apps think that in my experience. The prevalence of hacks, frameworks and layers that try to make the web stack marginally less terrible suggest that no, they don't like html, css and javascript - they deal with them because they have no other choice and it's all they've ever known. Just take SASS as an example. Why does it exist?
- fiatjaf 10y ago
  Because CSS is good enough to allow for some other language to be transpiled to it?

ashark 10y ago

There'll be desktop-style GUI toolkits that render to webGL not long after webassembly starts seeing serious adoption, I'd guess.

keypress 10y ago

Can pretty much do all that in a Java applet, and have been able to for a long time.

fiatjaf 10y ago
Java applets are not supported anymore anywhere, I think.
- Silhouette 10y ago
  Business using IE and Safari are still running them fine, and they're still supported in the latest Firefox ESR (though it will reportedly be the last). However, with the recent changes in Firefox, no "evergreen" browser now supports them.
Silhouette 10y ago
Not any more... Meet the new boss: same as the old boss, but now you have to learn to deal with them all over again. :-(