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> Tübingen who was hospitalized for depression and claimed that she normally kept her symptoms in check by taking all-night bike rides. He subsequently demonst

by update 10y ago

> Tübingen who was hospitalized for depression and claimed that she normally kept her symptoms in check by taking all-night bike rides. He subsequently demonstrated in a group of depressed patients that a night of complete sleep deprivation produced an immediate, significant improvement in mood in about 60 percent of the group. I thought this bit was neat. I'd heard that sleep deprivation can bring on a feeling of euphoria, and anecdotally, it has worked for me

rangibaby 10y ago
That sounds like bipolar to me
SCHiM 10y ago
I've noticed this too, I don't think this is specific for people with a depression though. If I have about 4/5 hours of sleep I will be less smart the next day, but engaging with others or completing tasks despite the tiredness results in a huge boost to mood and a feeling of exhilaration and happiness. That is not to say you don't feel tired, especially when the work has not yet been completed, and the day is just starting. YMMV, N=1 and all that...
sandworm101 10y ago
Mood yes. Ask the kids who rave all night. But cognition? Im not convinced. I find my memory and problem solving abilities really drop after 30+ hours without sleep. Maybe it is a good tool for the depressed, but i would not suggest it to those looking to boost otherwise healthy/normal minds.
- Ambroos 10y ago
  I sometimes go a whole night without sleep when I'm nervous about something important. I function much better on no sleep than on less than 5 hours of sleep (for one night only that is). What I've noticed is that without sleep, some of my abilities are stronger, but everything memory-related is much weaker. I notice everything extremely fast, think quickly and react much faster than normally. My focus is pretty crazy. But, I can't remember some things I know, and detailed memories of that day after a sleepless night are usually gone by the next day. I think it might be some sort of survival mode.
  - sandworm101 10y ago
    Sounds like a stressed prey animal dropping higher brain functions (memory, long-term planning) in favor of the more reactive minute-to-minute instincts needed to avoid being spotted and eaten by lions. I mean lions literally because four-legged things with the big teeth were a driving force of our evolution for millions of years. Those instincts/traits are very much with us today.
    - posterboy 10y ago
      Literally? Where do you live that lions would be a problem?! I'm joking, and sure there might be a trade off between higher and more basic brain functions, but I suppose those only really work for a short while, after which either will be impeded by exhaustion. Edit: what's the word for that state of mind, maybe frenzy?
      - sandworm101 10y ago
        Yes. Cougars (mountain lions) are a thing where i live. Also bear, black and brown. It is an extreemly rare event for anyone to be harmed, but i do run into bear regularly in the summer.
        posterboy 10y ago
        why wouldn't you build a fortification like a house to keep the beasts at bay?
        sandworm101 10y ago
        On garbage days you are much more likely to confront a bear around, even inside, your house than by randomly coming across one in the woods. I'm thinking about this because last week was "bear awareness day" in my area. Posters are up to remind people that they are coming out of hibernation.
  - posterboy 10y ago
- laumars 10y ago
  > Mood yes. Ask the kids who rave all night. I'm not sure if you're joking or not, but I think it's pretty safe to say there are bigger things contributing to "ravers" euphoria than sleep deprivation. Like the music, alcohol. Or in many popular European clubs, the recreational drugs. That's not to say I'm suggesting people need to on something to be having a good time, but your "raver" example is a pretty poor one if it's not meant as a joke.
  - sandworm101 10y ago
    Many ravers dont drink or use drugs. They are high on the energy associated with staying ot dancibg all night, exactly like the all-night bike rides in the OP.
    - laumars 10y ago
      Well as I said in my disclaimer, that would be the case for some. But I promise you it was only a minority of those who attended the club's I used to DJ at for the 10 years I was actively involved in the clubbing scene in the UK and mainland Europe. Most people there weren't sober. But who cares what adults get up to as long as they respect one another. :) You also cannot understate just how significant the effect music has on one's mood. I'd wager that alone would have a more significant affect than sleep deprivation alone. Plus exercise releases endorphins too So I really don't think raving is a good example here since there's a multitude of other significant and well studied effects also at play.
- deleted 10y ago
  [deleted]
pharrington 10y ago
Your anecdotal experience is far from uncommon. For the article to even imply this as any sort of cure for depression, though, massively misinterprets the small amount of research on this. edit: And as a sibling comment mentioned, we do know that cognition suffers immensely when sleep-deprived.
- erikpukinskis 10y ago
  Yea, it works when you want to trade cognition for action. If I don't need to make any tricky decisions, and would benefit from just moving a bunch of items forward, that's when sleep deprivation (all nighters) can work for me.
- hive_mind 10y ago
  I was thinking maybe the poorer cognition actually helps relieve the depression. Because a lot of depressives overthink (some past event, etc).
  - pharrington 10y ago
    While you are certainly less able to overthink in that state, the euphoria is a discrete phenomenon. The euphoria and poorer high-level cognition seem not to be caused by each other (obviously discounting any cyclical feedback effects once they're both in play), but instead caused by the same process.
    - Mouse47 10y ago
      >discrete 'Distinct' you mean? If only there was a way to get the euphoria without the reduction in function, huh?
      - pharrington 10y ago
        I mean discrete.
- Broken_Hippo 10y ago
Houshalter 10y ago
I noticed that stupid jokes and stuff seem much funnier to me when I am sleep deprived. One time I pulled an all nighter and then looked at some meme subreddits. I was laughing incredibly hard to stuff I wouldn't even normally find amusing. This seems to be a well known phenomenon. There's a whole subreddit called 3am jokes (https://www.reddit.com/r/3amjokes/ https://www.reddit.com/r/3amjokes/) for this.
- ThrustVectoring 10y ago
  I'm much better at making puns while sleep deprived.
  - posterboy 10y ago
    I do take that as argument against sleep deprivation.
- hannele 10y ago
  I've been there. I was missing the "I" tiles for a scrabble game and it was the funniest thing ever.
digi_owl 10y ago
From personal experience, sleep deprivation can be likened to alcoholic intoxication.
barrkel 10y ago
Extreme tiredness is similar to drunkeness, in most respects, to me.
jacquesm 10y ago
It works, until you try to drive a car. And then you'll find that your reaction times and coordination are not what you think they are. Personal experience, caused an accident when I was 23 this way and learned an important lesson: don't drive without having rested.
ClassyJacket 10y ago
Totally anecdotal, but I wonder if it's related. Two nights ago, I was out with friends drinking and playing pool. We normally go home at 3AM, but this time we went to another bar after and stayed there until 10AM. At some point, maybe around 8AM, I became incredibly happy. Euphoric is actually the word I used to describe it at the time. I wondered if I'd been slipped ecstacy or something, since I was so happy beyond anything alcohol usually does.

by update 10y ago

rangibaby 10y ago

That sounds like bipolar to me

SCHiM 10y ago

I've noticed this too, I don't think this is specific for people with a depression though. If I have about 4/5 hours of sleep I will be less smart the next day, but engaging with others or completing tasks despite the tiredness results in a huge boost to mood and a feeling of exhilaration and happiness. That is not to say you don't feel tired, especially when the work has not yet been completed, and the day is just starting. YMMV, N=1 and all that...

sandworm101 10y ago

Mood yes. Ask the kids who rave all night. But cognition? Im not convinced. I find my memory and problem solving abilities really drop after 30+ hours without sleep. Maybe it is a good tool for the depressed, but i would not suggest it to those looking to boost otherwise healthy/normal minds.

Ambroos 10y ago
I sometimes go a whole night without sleep when I'm nervous about something important. I function much better on no sleep than on less than 5 hours of sleep (for one night only that is). What I've noticed is that without sleep, some of my abilities are stronger, but everything memory-related is much weaker. I notice everything extremely fast, think quickly and react much faster than normally. My focus is pretty crazy. But, I can't remember some things I know, and detailed memories of that day after a sleepless night are usually gone by the next day. I think it might be some sort of survival mode.
- sandworm101 10y ago
  Sounds like a stressed prey animal dropping higher brain functions (memory, long-term planning) in favor of the more reactive minute-to-minute instincts needed to avoid being spotted and eaten by lions. I mean lions literally because four-legged things with the big teeth were a driving force of our evolution for millions of years. Those instincts/traits are very much with us today.
  - posterboy 10y ago
    Literally? Where do you live that lions would be a problem?! I'm joking, and sure there might be a trade off between higher and more basic brain functions, but I suppose those only really work for a short while, after which either will be impeded by exhaustion. Edit: what's the word for that state of mind, maybe frenzy?
    - sandworm101 10y ago
      Yes. Cougars (mountain lions) are a thing where i live. Also bear, black and brown. It is an extreemly rare event for anyone to be harmed, but i do run into bear regularly in the summer.
      - posterboy 10y ago
        why wouldn't you build a fortification like a house to keep the beasts at bay?
        sandworm101 10y ago
        On garbage days you are much more likely to confront a bear around, even inside, your house than by randomly coming across one in the woods. I'm thinking about this because last week was "bear awareness day" in my area. Posters are up to remind people that they are coming out of hibernation.
- posterboy 10y ago
laumars 10y ago
> Mood yes. Ask the kids who rave all night. I'm not sure if you're joking or not, but I think it's pretty safe to say there are bigger things contributing to "ravers" euphoria than sleep deprivation. Like the music, alcohol. Or in many popular European clubs, the recreational drugs. That's not to say I'm suggesting people need to on something to be having a good time, but your "raver" example is a pretty poor one if it's not meant as a joke.
- sandworm101 10y ago
  Many ravers dont drink or use drugs. They are high on the energy associated with staying ot dancibg all night, exactly like the all-night bike rides in the OP.
  - laumars 10y ago
    Well as I said in my disclaimer, that would be the case for some. But I promise you it was only a minority of those who attended the club's I used to DJ at for the 10 years I was actively involved in the clubbing scene in the UK and mainland Europe. Most people there weren't sober. But who cares what adults get up to as long as they respect one another. :) You also cannot understate just how significant the effect music has on one's mood. I'd wager that alone would have a more significant affect than sleep deprivation alone. Plus exercise releases endorphins too So I really don't think raving is a good example here since there's a multitude of other significant and well studied effects also at play.
deleted 10y ago
[deleted]

pharrington 10y ago

Your anecdotal experience is far from uncommon. For the article to even imply this as any sort of cure for depression, though, massively misinterprets the small amount of research on this. edit: And as a sibling comment mentioned, we do know that cognition suffers immensely when sleep-deprived.

erikpukinskis 10y ago
Yea, it works when you want to trade cognition for action. If I don't need to make any tricky decisions, and would benefit from just moving a bunch of items forward, that's when sleep deprivation (all nighters) can work for me.
hive_mind 10y ago
I was thinking maybe the poorer cognition actually helps relieve the depression. Because a lot of depressives overthink (some past event, etc).
- pharrington 10y ago
  While you are certainly less able to overthink in that state, the euphoria is a discrete phenomenon. The euphoria and poorer high-level cognition seem not to be caused by each other (obviously discounting any cyclical feedback effects once they're both in play), but instead caused by the same process.
  - Mouse47 10y ago
    >discrete 'Distinct' you mean? If only there was a way to get the euphoria without the reduction in function, huh?
    - pharrington 10y ago
      I mean discrete.
Broken_Hippo 10y ago

Houshalter 10y ago

I noticed that stupid jokes and stuff seem much funnier to me when I am sleep deprived. One time I pulled an all nighter and then looked at some meme subreddits. I was laughing incredibly hard to stuff I wouldn't even normally find amusing. This seems to be a well known phenomenon. There's a whole subreddit called 3am jokes (https://www.reddit.com/r/3amjokes/ https://www.reddit.com/r/3amjokes/) for this.

ThrustVectoring 10y ago
I'm much better at making puns while sleep deprived.
- posterboy 10y ago
  I do take that as argument against sleep deprivation.
hannele 10y ago
I've been there. I was missing the "I" tiles for a scrabble game and it was the funniest thing ever.

digi_owl 10y ago

From personal experience, sleep deprivation can be likened to alcoholic intoxication.

barrkel 10y ago

Extreme tiredness is similar to drunkeness, in most respects, to me.

jacquesm 10y ago

It works, until you try to drive a car. And then you'll find that your reaction times and coordination are not what you think they are. Personal experience, caused an accident when I was 23 this way and learned an important lesson: don't drive without having rested.

ClassyJacket 10y ago

Totally anecdotal, but I wonder if it's related. Two nights ago, I was out with friends drinking and playing pool. We normally go home at 3AM, but this time we went to another bar after and stayed there until 10AM. At some point, maybe around 8AM, I became incredibly happy. Euphoric is actually the word I used to describe it at the time. I wondered if I'd been slipped ecstacy or something, since I was so happy beyond anything alcohol usually does.