5 ms·

I read in a subsequent article that ZeniMax was upset about John Carmack taking five of his best guys with him to Oculus, one of whom violated his NDA agreement

by danm07 10y ago

I read in a subsequent article that ZeniMax was upset about John Carmack taking five of his best guys with him to Oculus, one of whom violated his NDA agreement. I presume that's what led to this debacle.

Arnt 10y ago
I don't get it. Wasn't that four years after the sale? Was Zenimax supposed to pay for the sale ≥5 years after it happened?
- danm07 10y ago
  Typical acquisition also includes an employment contract, and a significant portion of that settlement is paid upon the contract's completion.
  - dogma1138 10y ago
    Yep, this is especially true when you are buying a company where much of it's worth is derived from it's human capital. With all respect to "id" software, the majority of their value was JC and the tech leads. Whilst id is still remembered fondly it's not like they were a major brand and had a large portfolio of technical and franchised intellectual property that was worth anything close to what ZeniMax paid for it. ZeniMax bought the brains not the doom franchise.
    - flor1s 10y ago
      The human capital of id was valuable, but I think you are underselling their brands and technology. 150 million for the ownership of some of the most iconic brands (Doom, Quake, Wolfenstein) in FPS gaming doesn't seem that expensive, especially considering that it's much easier to sell many copies of a game in a well known franchise than to to sell games in a new franchise. The latest Doom sold over a million copies, Wolfenstein; The New Order sold over a million copies, the latest "Quake" (Enemy Territory: QUAKE Wars) probably sold over a million copies as well. In terms of human capital, Carmack is one of the most respected technologists in gaming, but I'm sure ZeniMax didn't expect him to stay with them for a very long period. At the time id was bought by ZeniMax it seemed like Carmack was spending a lot of time on Armadillo Aerospace too. In terms of tech it seems id wasn't the leader it used to be anymore (their early engines were used by Half-Life and CoD), taking into consideration Unreal Engine 3, Crytek Engine (being used for Bethesda's own Prey, the previous installment running on idTech) and Unity. On the other side, Activision bought Infinity Ward (developer of Call of Duty) for just 5 million [1]... http://venturebeat.com/2010/03/04/lawsuit-details-activision-bought-infinity-ward-for-5m-went-on-to-generate-3-billion-in-revenues-from-call-of-duty-games/ http://venturebeat.com/2010/03/04/lawsuit-details-activision...
    - fnordfnordfnord 10y ago
      I think you're right, but the Doom name has a lot of marketing value.
    - thrillgore 10y ago
      I'm inclined to agree, but having played Doom 2016, its clear the creative and technical mindshare is still intact. Especially since the other ZeniMax companies are (more than likely) going to use that same technology.
  - Arnt 10y ago
    Sure. Five years is oddly long, though, especially if the contract allows the employee to leave earlier.
edem 10y ago
If Carmack takes their best guys it is not JC's fault. They go because they see more value in their new position. That's all.

by danm07 10y ago

Arnt 10y ago

I don't get it. Wasn't that four years after the sale? Was Zenimax supposed to pay for the sale ≥5 years after it happened?

danm07 10y ago
Typical acquisition also includes an employment contract, and a significant portion of that settlement is paid upon the contract's completion.
- dogma1138 10y ago
  Yep, this is especially true when you are buying a company where much of it's worth is derived from it's human capital. With all respect to "id" software, the majority of their value was JC and the tech leads. Whilst id is still remembered fondly it's not like they were a major brand and had a large portfolio of technical and franchised intellectual property that was worth anything close to what ZeniMax paid for it. ZeniMax bought the brains not the doom franchise.
  - flor1s 10y ago
    The human capital of id was valuable, but I think you are underselling their brands and technology. 150 million for the ownership of some of the most iconic brands (Doom, Quake, Wolfenstein) in FPS gaming doesn't seem that expensive, especially considering that it's much easier to sell many copies of a game in a well known franchise than to to sell games in a new franchise. The latest Doom sold over a million copies, Wolfenstein; The New Order sold over a million copies, the latest "Quake" (Enemy Territory: QUAKE Wars) probably sold over a million copies as well. In terms of human capital, Carmack is one of the most respected technologists in gaming, but I'm sure ZeniMax didn't expect him to stay with them for a very long period. At the time id was bought by ZeniMax it seemed like Carmack was spending a lot of time on Armadillo Aerospace too. In terms of tech it seems id wasn't the leader it used to be anymore (their early engines were used by Half-Life and CoD), taking into consideration Unreal Engine 3, Crytek Engine (being used for Bethesda's own Prey, the previous installment running on idTech) and Unity. On the other side, Activision bought Infinity Ward (developer of Call of Duty) for just 5 million [1]... http://venturebeat.com/2010/03/04/lawsuit-details-activision-bought-infinity-ward-for-5m-went-on-to-generate-3-billion-in-revenues-from-call-of-duty-games/ http://venturebeat.com/2010/03/04/lawsuit-details-activision...
  - fnordfnordfnord 10y ago
    I think you're right, but the Doom name has a lot of marketing value.
  - thrillgore 10y ago
    I'm inclined to agree, but having played Doom 2016, its clear the creative and technical mindshare is still intact. Especially since the other ZeniMax companies are (more than likely) going to use that same technology.
- Arnt 10y ago
  Sure. Five years is oddly long, though, especially if the contract allows the employee to leave earlier.

edem 10y ago

If Carmack takes their best guys it is not JC's fault. They go because they see more value in their new position. That's all.