14 ms·

What tech company has ever been at the top and acted nicely?

greenhouse_gas 10y ago
Honestly, even Google is more ethical. Google is at the top in Mobile. Yet Android is 90% Open Source. It's not that even that. If I want to install an APK, I can do it. No need to be a Enterprise or pay $100 for a developer license, anyone can install FDroid. And they let people write competitive software (Firefox, etc.) and set them as default. Actually, as a user, I don't have to see anything be Google if I don't want to. And don't forget open sourcing TensorFlow.
- Dayshine 10y ago
  And then there's Chrome...
  - blibble 10y ago
    which is 99.99% open source (Chromium), and forms the basis of several competitors to Chrome? compared to the openness of Edge/IE, Google are saints with Chrome
    - nacs 10y ago
      > (Chromium), and forms the basis of several competitors to Chrome Chromium was based on Webkit which actually came from Apple (and who forked it from KHTML from the KDE project). It's not Chromium that's the "basis" of competitors, it's Webkit that was the base.
      - Nullabillity 10y ago
        By that logic, KHTML/Konqueror should get all the credit. But AFAIK V8 (which most of those forks use) also has pretty much nothing to do with JSCore.
  - MertsA 10y ago
    What are your objections to Chrome? Chromium seems like a reasonable project and everything that's not in Chromium seems to be pretty well Google specific and probably shouldn't be in Chromium IMHO.
  - deleted 10y ago
    [deleted]
- Ludd1t3 10y ago
  Is Android any different from Windows in that sense? It's open source in name only. All development is done behind closed doors and essentially dumped out in the open when Google determines it's ready for a release. No one else has say in the development process and you can't contribute changes either. All the other things you mentioned, can also be done on Windows. I am not sure how that's different than what Windows does/is doing.
  - Nullabillity 10y ago
    Openness is about being able to modify it and share it with people, not about being able to get Android to adopt it. For a long time even the GNU project had a similar cathedral-style approach of secretive development processes and no outside contributions. You might have a point when there is a CyanogenMod/LineageOS equivalent for Windows.
  - greenhouse_gas 10y ago
    1. Most of Android is Open Source - see Amazon Fire, for example. Is there an equivalent of that on windows? 2. MS took apple's approach that everything (on their new platform) must go through the store. Even if right now they give exceptions, it's as I said above an example of them trying to build market share. Will they have an "Unknown Sources" button when they get 80% of the market?
sangnoir 10y ago
> What tech company has ever been at the top and acted nicely? It's not a binary option (nice vs. not nice) but a range from nice to not nice. Companies fall at different points on that spectrum. As examples; Apple, Google, Microsoft, IBM and Oracle all fall on very different points on this not-nice spectrum when they are/were at the top. The relative positions are subjective depending on who you relate to each (developer, competitor, user, recipient of legal threat or bystander), but in my circles there is a general consensus on the relative positions.
deleted 10y ago
[deleted]
r00fus 10y ago
While there are a few counter-examples, for the most part, as Lord Acton said "power tends to corrupt, and absolute power corrupts absolutely". We need to prevent companies from controlling the market, and keep the powerful ones honest and accountable. Hating IBM, Microsoft and AT&T is all about fighting tyranny.
cm2187 10y ago
Amazon has remained customer focused
- mrmondo 10y ago
  I would say they are purely sales focus and any remaining energy / time is spent saving face and convincing C(E/I)Os they're not just the best option, they're the only option.
  - cm2187 10y ago
    You think AWS. I think amazon ecommerce. I don't have much experience about AWS.
- greenhouse_gas 10y ago
  That's not "Ethics", it's not being Tone Deaf. Apple was not Tone Deaf under Jobs, but weren't really ethical. If Google would block Amazon on search, there'd be such a scream.
burnbabyburn 10y ago
mozilla
mrmondo 10y ago
RedHat came to mind very quickly, Mozilla too...

Honestly, even Google is more ethical. Google is at the top in Mobile. Yet Android is 90% Open Source. It's not that even that. If I want to install an APK, I can do it. No need to be a Enterprise or pay $100 for a developer license, anyone can install FDroid. And they let people write competitive software (Firefox, etc.) and set them as default. Actually, as a user, I don't have to see anything be Google if I don't want to. And don't forget open sourcing TensorFlow.

Dayshine 10y ago
And then there's Chrome...
- blibble 10y ago
  which is 99.99% open source (Chromium), and forms the basis of several competitors to Chrome? compared to the openness of Edge/IE, Google are saints with Chrome
  - nacs 10y ago
    > (Chromium), and forms the basis of several competitors to Chrome Chromium was based on Webkit which actually came from Apple (and who forked it from KHTML from the KDE project). It's not Chromium that's the "basis" of competitors, it's Webkit that was the base.
    - Nullabillity 10y ago
      By that logic, KHTML/Konqueror should get all the credit. But AFAIK V8 (which most of those forks use) also has pretty much nothing to do with JSCore.
- MertsA 10y ago
  What are your objections to Chrome? Chromium seems like a reasonable project and everything that's not in Chromium seems to be pretty well Google specific and probably shouldn't be in Chromium IMHO.
- deleted 10y ago
  [deleted]
Ludd1t3 10y ago
Is Android any different from Windows in that sense? It's open source in name only. All development is done behind closed doors and essentially dumped out in the open when Google determines it's ready for a release. No one else has say in the development process and you can't contribute changes either. All the other things you mentioned, can also be done on Windows. I am not sure how that's different than what Windows does/is doing.
- Nullabillity 10y ago
  Openness is about being able to modify it and share it with people, not about being able to get Android to adopt it. For a long time even the GNU project had a similar cathedral-style approach of secretive development processes and no outside contributions. You might have a point when there is a CyanogenMod/LineageOS equivalent for Windows.
- greenhouse_gas 10y ago
  1. Most of Android is Open Source - see Amazon Fire, for example. Is there an equivalent of that on windows? 2. MS took apple's approach that everything (on their new platform) must go through the store. Even if right now they give exceptions, it's as I said above an example of them trying to build market share. Will they have an "Unknown Sources" button when they get 80% of the market?

sangnoir 10y ago

> What tech company has ever been at the top and acted nicely? It's not a binary option (nice vs. not nice) but a range from nice to not nice. Companies fall at different points on that spectrum. As examples; Apple, Google, Microsoft, IBM and Oracle all fall on very different points on this not-nice spectrum when they are/were at the top. The relative positions are subjective depending on who you relate to each (developer, competitor, user, recipient of legal threat or bystander), but in my circles there is a general consensus on the relative positions.

deleted 10y ago

[deleted]

r00fus 10y ago

While there are a few counter-examples, for the most part, as Lord Acton said "power tends to corrupt, and absolute power corrupts absolutely". We need to prevent companies from controlling the market, and keep the powerful ones honest and accountable. Hating IBM, Microsoft and AT&T is all about fighting tyranny.

cm2187 10y ago

Amazon has remained customer focused

mrmondo 10y ago
I would say they are purely sales focus and any remaining energy / time is spent saving face and convincing C(E/I)Os they're not just the best option, they're the only option.
- cm2187 10y ago
  You think AWS. I think amazon ecommerce. I don't have much experience about AWS.
greenhouse_gas 10y ago
That's not "Ethics", it's not being Tone Deaf. Apple was not Tone Deaf under Jobs, but weren't really ethical. If Google would block Amazon on search, there'd be such a scream.

burnbabyburn 10y ago

mozilla

mrmondo 10y ago

RedHat came to mind very quickly, Mozilla too...