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> This is a solved problem. Not … really. Yes, we "know" the solution, but the terrible APIs that compose so many language's standard string type goads the pro

> This is a solved problem. Not … really. Yes, we "know" the solution, but the terrible APIs that compose so many language's standard string type goads the programmer into choosing the wrong method or type. JavaScript has — to an extent — the excuse of age. But the language still really (to my knowledge) lacks an effective way to deal with text that doesn't involve dragging in third-party libraries. You are not a high-level language if your standard library struggles with Unicode. Even recent additions to the language, such as the recent inclusion of leftPad, ignore Unicode (and, in that particular example, render the function mostly useless).

danbruc 10y ago
That is what I meant, there is an existing algorithm to do this because the author tried to come up with one. That JavaScript fails to provide an implementation, well, too bad, but this is of course a problem one may have to solve in any language. And while other languages provide the necessary support at the language or standard library level, I would guess there are quite a few developers out there that are not even aware that they are looking for enumerating grapheme clusters. But now some more know and if they made a good language choice, it is now a solved problem for them.
- klodolph 10y ago
  It's not a problem that comes up that often, to be fair. Many of the cases where you think you'd need to split a string like that, you have some library doing the work for you. One of the main purposes is to figure out where valid cursor locations are in text editors... but in JavaScript, you just put a text field in your web page and let the browser do the heavy lifting. Same with text rendering... hand it off to a library which does the right thing.
paulddraper 10y ago
> You are not a high-level language if your standard library struggles with Unicode So C++, Lisp, Java, Python, Ruby, PHP, and JS are not high-level languages. HN teaches me something new every day.
- nathancahill 10y ago
  Python 3 does pretty good.
  - paulddraper 10y ago
    It does better than most, though Python 3 lacks grapheme support in the standard library, requiring developers to use a library like uniseg. I.e. it "lacks an effective way to deal with text that doesn't involve dragging in third-party libraries", and is thus evidently not a "high-level language".
  - deleted 10y ago
    [deleted]
- nurettin 10y ago
  How does Ruby struggle with unicode?
  - lucaspiller 10y ago
    This is from a couple of weeks ago, there's a few things broken still, but what languages do have full support out of the box? http://blog.honeybadger.io/ruby-s-unicode-support/ http://blog.honeybadger.io/ruby-s-unicode-support/
    - slobotron 10y ago
      Perl6 https://perl6advent.wordpress.com/2015/12/07/day-7-unicode-perl-6-and-you/ https://perl6advent.wordpress.com/2015/12/07/day-7-unicode-p...
    - Immortalin 10y ago
      Go
      - Sean1708 10y ago
        Doesn't look like Go does: https://github.com/golang/go/issues/14820 https://github.com/golang/go/issues/14820
libeclipse 10y ago
I didn't know perfect unicode support in the stdlib was a requirement for being a high-level language.

danbruc 10y ago

That is what I meant, there is an existing algorithm to do this because the author tried to come up with one. That JavaScript fails to provide an implementation, well, too bad, but this is of course a problem one may have to solve in any language. And while other languages provide the necessary support at the language or standard library level, I would guess there are quite a few developers out there that are not even aware that they are looking for enumerating grapheme clusters. But now some more know and if they made a good language choice, it is now a solved problem for them.

klodolph 10y ago
It's not a problem that comes up that often, to be fair. Many of the cases where you think you'd need to split a string like that, you have some library doing the work for you. One of the main purposes is to figure out where valid cursor locations are in text editors... but in JavaScript, you just put a text field in your web page and let the browser do the heavy lifting. Same with text rendering... hand it off to a library which does the right thing.

paulddraper 10y ago

> You are not a high-level language if your standard library struggles with Unicode So C++, Lisp, Java, Python, Ruby, PHP, and JS are not high-level languages. HN teaches me something new every day.

nathancahill 10y ago
Python 3 does pretty good.
- paulddraper 10y ago
  It does better than most, though Python 3 lacks grapheme support in the standard library, requiring developers to use a library like uniseg. I.e. it "lacks an effective way to deal with text that doesn't involve dragging in third-party libraries", and is thus evidently not a "high-level language".
- deleted 10y ago
  [deleted]
nurettin 10y ago
How does Ruby struggle with unicode?
- lucaspiller 10y ago
  This is from a couple of weeks ago, there's a few things broken still, but what languages do have full support out of the box? http://blog.honeybadger.io/ruby-s-unicode-support/ http://blog.honeybadger.io/ruby-s-unicode-support/
  - slobotron 10y ago
    Perl6 https://perl6advent.wordpress.com/2015/12/07/day-7-unicode-perl-6-and-you/ https://perl6advent.wordpress.com/2015/12/07/day-7-unicode-p...
  - Immortalin 10y ago
    Go
    - Sean1708 10y ago
      Doesn't look like Go does: https://github.com/golang/go/issues/14820 https://github.com/golang/go/issues/14820

libeclipse 10y ago

I didn't know perfect unicode support in the stdlib was a requirement for being a high-level language.