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No. I've seen the statistics for how many birds are estimated to be killed by human-made objects. Buildings were the biggest killer of birds by far. Many milli

No. I've seen the statistics for how many birds are estimated to be killed by human-made objects. Buildings were the biggest killer of birds by far. Many millions of birds each year are killed by colliding with windows on buildings. They often don't realize the window is there. I'm guessing the bird sees through the window and doesn't realize there's a barrier or they see a reflection of the sky instead. Automobiles were also big killers of birds. Windmills were estimated to result in 0.1% of bird deaths by man-made objects or something really tiny like that. I don't understand why people freak out about birds being killed by wind turbines when vastly larger numbers are being killed by buildings and cars. Nobody is yelling about saving the birds by getting rid of buildings and cars.

timthelion 10y ago
I'm not freeking out. I'm pointing something out. However, you really need to understand these statistics better. There are three types of bird mating pattern: First year breaders. These tend to be small birds who lay eggs, feed the young, teach them to fly and forget about them. First year breaders die at an enormous rate. I think that more than half don't survive the first year. But they lay a lot of eggs and if a few billion of them are eaten by cats and hit by cars it doesn't matter. Seccond year birds. These are almost as expendable as first year breaders, however, they teach their young how to find food and some cultural things as well. Far fewer of these die, but they are smarter and they don't hit windows as much. Large birds which bread at older ages. These birds spend even more time with their parents, and there are only one or two eggs per year! They rarely die before they reach maturity but every life counts. They basically NEVER die from running into windows, but they aren't smart enough to not get killed by wind turbines. So the numerical statistics are meaningless. It is like saying that the death of a single human doesn't mean anything at all, because we tend to swat a lot of mosquitoes.
rodgerd 10y ago
> I don't understand why people freak out about birds being killed by wind turbines when vastly larger numbers are being killed by buildings and cars. Nobody is yelling about saving the birds by getting rid of buildings and cars. Because they don't care about the birds. But they do hate anything that smacks of clean energy.
- edw 10y ago
  Invoking Mr Burns isn't necessary; the people screaming "bird murderers!" are often members of the NIMBY set.
- deleted 10y ago
  [deleted]
pradn 10y ago
Although the percentage of birds killed by wind turbines may be low compared to other hazards, each wind turbine might kill a higher number of birds compared to a single building. That's probably why people are worried about them. That said, I don't know the numbers so I'm just speculating.
- cr1895 10y ago
  Buildings, cats, etc. kill many orders of magnitude more birds than wind turbines. Have a look at Table 1 on pg 4: http://sci-hub.cc/10.1146/annurev-ecolsys-112414-054133 http://sci-hub.cc/10.1146/annurev-ecolsys-112414-054133 It does get a bit misleading to generalize, because there may indeed be localized instances where turbines unduly affect a specific sensitive bird population.

timthelion 10y ago

I'm not freeking out. I'm pointing something out. However, you really need to understand these statistics better. There are three types of bird mating pattern: First year breaders. These tend to be small birds who lay eggs, feed the young, teach them to fly and forget about them. First year breaders die at an enormous rate. I think that more than half don't survive the first year. But they lay a lot of eggs and if a few billion of them are eaten by cats and hit by cars it doesn't matter. Seccond year birds. These are almost as expendable as first year breaders, however, they teach their young how to find food and some cultural things as well. Far fewer of these die, but they are smarter and they don't hit windows as much. Large birds which bread at older ages. These birds spend even more time with their parents, and there are only one or two eggs per year! They rarely die before they reach maturity but every life counts. They basically NEVER die from running into windows, but they aren't smart enough to not get killed by wind turbines. So the numerical statistics are meaningless. It is like saying that the death of a single human doesn't mean anything at all, because we tend to swat a lot of mosquitoes.

rodgerd 10y ago

> I don't understand why people freak out about birds being killed by wind turbines when vastly larger numbers are being killed by buildings and cars. Nobody is yelling about saving the birds by getting rid of buildings and cars. Because they don't care about the birds. But they do hate anything that smacks of clean energy.

edw 10y ago
Invoking Mr Burns isn't necessary; the people screaming "bird murderers!" are often members of the NIMBY set.
deleted 10y ago
[deleted]

pradn 10y ago

Although the percentage of birds killed by wind turbines may be low compared to other hazards, each wind turbine might kill a higher number of birds compared to a single building. That's probably why people are worried about them. That said, I don't know the numbers so I'm just speculating.

cr1895 10y ago
Buildings, cats, etc. kill many orders of magnitude more birds than wind turbines. Have a look at Table 1 on pg 4: http://sci-hub.cc/10.1146/annurev-ecolsys-112414-054133 http://sci-hub.cc/10.1146/annurev-ecolsys-112414-054133 It does get a bit misleading to generalize, because there may indeed be localized instances where turbines unduly affect a specific sensitive bird population.