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> Animals shouldn't suffer either if they're raised right. This is not possible at-scale. Also, do you really think that giant corporations, that would willin

by pyre 10y ago

> Animals shouldn't suffer either if they're raised right. This is not possible at-scale. Also, do you really think that giant corporations, that would willingly throw humans under the bus by the truckload to save a few dollars, give a crap about the suffering of an animal? Especially an animal that is slated for the slaughterhouse anyways? Just look at how they react to undercover videos that expose illegal practices behind their closed doors. They immediately start lobbying for industry-specific laws that make it illegal to do undercover investigative journalism of their industry (the so-called AgGag bills). They can't even stay within the letter of the current (and fairly lax) laws on how they are supposed to operate, and when exposed find it more logical to (attempt to) make it illegal to expose their crimes rather than to just stop committing said crimes.

soheil 10y ago
So to me this makes it even lesser of a problem namely all we have to do is fix the legal system and stop them from lobbying aggressively instead of most of the world population all of a sudden changing its diet entirely.
- pyre 10y ago
  Your solution here is laughable. A couple of points: 1. I mentioned that the current laws are lax for a reason. There really isn't much in the way of controls over animal agriculture other than things that might affect public health and safety. Getting all of these companies to play ball with the current legal environment will not get us anywhere near where we would need to be. 2. The idea that "all" we have to do is prevent them from lobbying and enforce the current laws is hopelessly naive and not a light undertaking. (Especially in areas where this industry is the main industry / employer). You're also ignoring all of the government subsidies that are already poured into this industry. The government has been in bed with this industry for a long time.
  - soheil 10y ago
    Why do you not believe in the political system and the power that comes with that? We the people can change laws if we choose to, to sit on the bench and cry foul however will not get you anywhere. You live in (presumably US) the freest country in the world and want to take things in your hand while not believing in democracy and convincing your fellow citizens to see eye to eye with you on issues like this? No one said changing the system is easy it takes dedication and effort if you truly believe evil companies are the problem force them to follow the law if you think the laws are in adequate lobby for new ones. Political passivity is not the answer. I highly recommend reading Beyond Fear by Bruce Schneier [1]. [1] https://www.schneier.com/books/beyond_fear/ https://www.schneier.com/books/beyond_fear/

by pyre 10y ago

soheil 10y ago

So to me this makes it even lesser of a problem namely all we have to do is fix the legal system and stop them from lobbying aggressively instead of most of the world population all of a sudden changing its diet entirely.

pyre 10y ago
Your solution here is laughable. A couple of points: 1. I mentioned that the current laws are lax for a reason. There really isn't much in the way of controls over animal agriculture other than things that might affect public health and safety. Getting all of these companies to play ball with the current legal environment will not get us anywhere near where we would need to be. 2. The idea that "all" we have to do is prevent them from lobbying and enforce the current laws is hopelessly naive and not a light undertaking. (Especially in areas where this industry is the main industry / employer). You're also ignoring all of the government subsidies that are already poured into this industry. The government has been in bed with this industry for a long time.
- soheil 10y ago
  Why do you not believe in the political system and the power that comes with that? We the people can change laws if we choose to, to sit on the bench and cry foul however will not get you anywhere. You live in (presumably US) the freest country in the world and want to take things in your hand while not believing in democracy and convincing your fellow citizens to see eye to eye with you on issues like this? No one said changing the system is easy it takes dedication and effort if you truly believe evil companies are the problem force them to follow the law if you think the laws are in adequate lobby for new ones. Political passivity is not the answer. I highly recommend reading Beyond Fear by Bruce Schneier [1]. [1] https://www.schneier.com/books/beyond_fear/ https://www.schneier.com/books/beyond_fear/