4 ms·

I didn't watch the entire video, so maybe it happened by the end, but I feel like he's going to have a bad time with the law at some point. That said, it was p

I didn't watch the entire video, so maybe it happened by the end, but I feel like he's going to have a bad time with the law at some point. That said, it was pretty funny how he could just repeat "am I being detained?" until they all just gave up and let him go.

cameldrv 10y ago
This is because what they're doing is just barely legal. Generally, the police need to have a reasonable suspicion that you've committed a crime in order to stop you.
- MegaButts 10y ago
  Does this mean DUI checkpoints are unlawful?
  - cardiffspaceman 10y ago
    US Supreme court says a balancing test applies because there isn't much inconvenience. [0] [0] http://traffic.findlaw.com/traffic-stops/are-dui-checkpoints-legal-.html http://traffic.findlaw.com/traffic-stops/are-dui-checkpoints...
URSpider94 10y ago
What you have to understand is that these videos are taken at checkpoints set up many miles from the border by Homeland Security. The point is that they can't detain you, even for a brief time, or search you or you car without probable cause, which they don't have (and you can always refuse to answer questions). However, there's no law against asking you to consent to a search, and if you do it's perfectly legal. In fact, they can ask in such a way that you assume that you have no choice, and that's still ok. The videos (and there are tons of them) demonstrate over and over that if you refuse to answer questions and ask if you are being detained / are free to go, they will grudgingly admit that they can't stop you. On the one hand, i love seeing people exercising their constitutional rights. On the other hand, the fact that there's a sort of secret handshake to get out of the situation when police are gaslighting you plays into the worst of the "sovereign citizen" conspiracy theories that if you write some magic words on your tax return you are exempt from paying taxes, and the like.
- MegaButts 10y ago
  There are lots of things the police or federal law enforcement agents can't legally do but they do anyway. I'd rather not be the antagonist that pisses off the guy with a bad temper, mace, a taser, handcuffs, a gun, and the presumption of authority.
  - FabHK 10y ago
    Well, and border control in particular tend to have wider powers than regular domestic police, I believe, in many jurisdictions. In particular, they don't need reasonable cause to search you or your luggage or your computer/devices e.g. in the US, if I'm not mistaken.
    - uiri 10y ago
      In the US, Border Patrol only have the authority to do these things if you are attempting to enter the US. Apparently, that hasn't stopped them from asking politely on domestic flights: https://www.theatlantic.com/politics/archive/2017/02/papers-please/517887/ https://www.theatlantic.com/politics/archive/2017/02/papers-...
    - yardie 10y ago
      Hell yeah they do. Their powers begin and end with you crossing a border. Driving to the grocery store and they just happen to set up a check right outside? They can pound sand. You drove cross country and thy have a few questions? Ask if you're being detained and for what cause. Took a domestic flight from NYC to LA. Unless that flight had a stopover in Toronto you didn't cross a border.
      - trentmb 10y ago
        They operate within 100 miles of international borders.
        trentmb 10y ago
        Can't edit my comment, but here: https://www.aclu.org/other/constitution-100-mile-border-zone https://www.aclu.org/other/constitution-100-mile-border-zone
headShrinker 10y ago
This video only shows successes but you're pretty much at the mercy of the cop. If they get pissed off they will brake your window, tase you, drag your limp body from the car and arrest you. You can fight the action in court if you'd like. (Good luck with that) Source: https://youtu.be/NPtc_N9QiG8 https://youtu.be/NPtc_N9QiG8 NSFL Warning: This video will haunt you
- headShrinker 10y ago
  https://youtu.be/kjQc-2GBlYw https://youtu.be/kjQc-2GBlYw
- awfgylbcxhrey 10y ago
  The cop dropping him on his face was horrible, but AFAIK everything up until that point was the correct course of action. The kid was refusing lawful orders. If a cop asks you to do something (which is what all the 'border' checkpoints show, often with clever wording), you can refuse. If a cop orders you to do something, you can't refuse. Before someone comments about lawful orders, it's a complex topic and you're welcome to fight it in the Supreme Court, but in general I'm just going to obey police orders.

cameldrv 10y ago

This is because what they're doing is just barely legal. Generally, the police need to have a reasonable suspicion that you've committed a crime in order to stop you.

MegaButts 10y ago
Does this mean DUI checkpoints are unlawful?
- cardiffspaceman 10y ago
  US Supreme court says a balancing test applies because there isn't much inconvenience. [0] [0] http://traffic.findlaw.com/traffic-stops/are-dui-checkpoints-legal-.html http://traffic.findlaw.com/traffic-stops/are-dui-checkpoints...

URSpider94 10y ago

What you have to understand is that these videos are taken at checkpoints set up many miles from the border by Homeland Security. The point is that they can't detain you, even for a brief time, or search you or you car without probable cause, which they don't have (and you can always refuse to answer questions). However, there's no law against asking you to consent to a search, and if you do it's perfectly legal. In fact, they can ask in such a way that you assume that you have no choice, and that's still ok. The videos (and there are tons of them) demonstrate over and over that if you refuse to answer questions and ask if you are being detained / are free to go, they will grudgingly admit that they can't stop you. On the one hand, i love seeing people exercising their constitutional rights. On the other hand, the fact that there's a sort of secret handshake to get out of the situation when police are gaslighting you plays into the worst of the "sovereign citizen" conspiracy theories that if you write some magic words on your tax return you are exempt from paying taxes, and the like.

MegaButts 10y ago
There are lots of things the police or federal law enforcement agents can't legally do but they do anyway. I'd rather not be the antagonist that pisses off the guy with a bad temper, mace, a taser, handcuffs, a gun, and the presumption of authority.
- FabHK 10y ago
  Well, and border control in particular tend to have wider powers than regular domestic police, I believe, in many jurisdictions. In particular, they don't need reasonable cause to search you or your luggage or your computer/devices e.g. in the US, if I'm not mistaken.
  - uiri 10y ago
    In the US, Border Patrol only have the authority to do these things if you are attempting to enter the US. Apparently, that hasn't stopped them from asking politely on domestic flights: https://www.theatlantic.com/politics/archive/2017/02/papers-please/517887/ https://www.theatlantic.com/politics/archive/2017/02/papers-...
  - yardie 10y ago
    Hell yeah they do. Their powers begin and end with you crossing a border. Driving to the grocery store and they just happen to set up a check right outside? They can pound sand. You drove cross country and thy have a few questions? Ask if you're being detained and for what cause. Took a domestic flight from NYC to LA. Unless that flight had a stopover in Toronto you didn't cross a border.
    - trentmb 10y ago
      They operate within 100 miles of international borders.
      - trentmb 10y ago
        Can't edit my comment, but here: https://www.aclu.org/other/constitution-100-mile-border-zone https://www.aclu.org/other/constitution-100-mile-border-zone

headShrinker 10y ago

This video only shows successes but you're pretty much at the mercy of the cop. If they get pissed off they will brake your window, tase you, drag your limp body from the car and arrest you. You can fight the action in court if you'd like. (Good luck with that) Source: https://youtu.be/NPtc_N9QiG8 https://youtu.be/NPtc_N9QiG8 NSFL Warning: This video will haunt you

headShrinker 10y ago
https://youtu.be/kjQc-2GBlYw https://youtu.be/kjQc-2GBlYw
awfgylbcxhrey 10y ago
The cop dropping him on his face was horrible, but AFAIK everything up until that point was the correct course of action. The kid was refusing lawful orders. If a cop asks you to do something (which is what all the 'border' checkpoints show, often with clever wording), you can refuse. If a cop orders you to do something, you can't refuse. Before someone comments about lawful orders, it's a complex topic and you're welcome to fight it in the Supreme Court, but in general I'm just going to obey police orders.