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Indeed it was. But you say that (emphasizing was) as though I used the word "major," which I did not.

by natch 10y ago

dredmorbius 10y ago
Noted, though "normal" and "major" are somewhat semantic. The main spillway is the mechanism by which, when needed on a normal basis, major discharges can be accomplished. That is: its design intent is to accommodate such flows, without failure of itself or incapacitating damage. To that extent, the spillway damage was a massive management failure. The emergency spillway, as I've only learnt reading up on this story within the past day, was designed as a "use once" capability. It isn't designed for repeated usage, requires massive reconstruction after such uses, and (in conjunction with the parking lot), provides the basis for a "soft failure" of the dam as a whole, as opposed to the prospect of the entire dam face collapsing. The Auburn Coffer Dam engineered failure has been mentioned (though not linked -- it's easy enough to find on YouTube) elsewhere in this thread. That was a 1986 event during an extreme rain event. The dam, also an earthen structure, was designed with an intentionally soft "plug", that could and would erode before the main dam face, but in a slow fashion, such that the dam would fail over the course of hours, rather than minutes. The rate of occurrence of things matters, and a factor of 60 or so (as above) is tremendous. As a comparison, you're in a car moving at 100 kph, and are later moving at 0 kph. How do you feel? If the interval is 20s, probably pretty good. If it's 0.02s, likely not so hot. That's a rate difference of 1,000 fold. Something to keep in mind in the context of other stories, such as, say, the fact that climate is change at a rate of roughly 1,000,000x faster than normal, presently. A point Tucker Carlson apparently cannot grasp, given a recent appearance of Bill Nye on his programme.
- natch 10y ago
  The normal way water flows out of the dam is entirely different from the major way in which water was flowing out of the dam during the specific event. The normal way water flows out of that dam has nothing whatsoever to do with either the spillway, or the emergency spillway, and was not shown in the series of photos. Semantic means "relating to meaning" and indeed different words have different meanings. Meanings actually matter, it turns out. In this case, the meanings are different enough that you would have to take a two minute or so walk to get from one water outlet (the normal one) to another (either of the two spillways).

Indeed it was. But you say that (emphasizing was) as though I used the word "major," which I did not.

by natch 10y ago

Indeed it was. But you say that (emphasizing was) as though I used the word "major," which I did not.

Noted, though "normal" and "major" are somewhat semantic. The main spillway is the mechanism by which, when needed on a normal basis, major discharges can be accomplished. That is: its design intent is to accommodate such flows, without failure of itself or incapacitating damage. To that extent, the spillway damage was a massive management failure. The emergency spillway, as I've only learnt reading up on this story within the past day, was designed as a "use once" capability. It isn't designed for repeated usage, requires massive reconstruction after such uses, and (in conjunction with the parking lot), provides the basis for a "soft failure" of the dam as a whole, as opposed to the prospect of the entire dam face collapsing. The Auburn Coffer Dam engineered failure has been mentioned (though not linked -- it's easy enough to find on YouTube) elsewhere in this thread. That was a 1986 event during an extreme rain event. The dam, also an earthen structure, was designed with an intentionally soft "plug", that could and would erode before the main dam face, but in a slow fashion, such that the dam would fail over the course of hours, rather than minutes. The rate of occurrence of things matters, and a factor of 60 or so (as above) is tremendous. As a comparison, you're in a car moving at 100 kph, and are later moving at 0 kph. How do you feel? If the interval is 20s, probably pretty good. If it's 0.02s, likely not so hot. That's a rate difference of 1,000 fold. Something to keep in mind in the context of other stories, such as, say, the fact that climate is change at a rate of roughly 1,000,000x faster than normal, presently. A point Tucker Carlson apparently cannot grasp, given a recent appearance of Bill Nye on his programme.

natch 10y ago
The normal way water flows out of the dam is entirely different from the major way in which water was flowing out of the dam during the specific event. The normal way water flows out of that dam has nothing whatsoever to do with either the spillway, or the emergency spillway, and was not shown in the series of photos. Semantic means "relating to meaning" and indeed different words have different meanings. Meanings actually matter, it turns out. In this case, the meanings are different enough that you would have to take a two minute or so walk to get from one water outlet (the normal one) to another (either of the two spillways).