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There are two points to my argument: 1) the administration cannot properly value IT because they (likely) do not understand how it works 2) the administration

by trendia 10y ago

There are two points to my argument: 1) the administration cannot properly value IT because they (likely) do not understand how it works 2) the administration likely values their own staff and their athletics much more than the revenue they generate, and thus would never outsource those staff even if it was costing the school a lot Regarding (1), I would point out that it's unlikely they realize how inefficient having remote IT can be, but they'd realize how inefficient it would be to have remote coaching. For instance, the reason that you wouldn't outsource a football coach is that they need to have direct, personal communication with their team. Having someone in a foreign country "coach" your team would be very unproductive. Likewise, a President in another country would never be able to keep up with the many meetings with professors, deans, and bureaucrats that keep the school running. So, my point is more that a President would easily recognize the problems in outsourcing certain jobs, but not realize that many of the same problems will occur when you outsource IT. The truth is that infrastructure is often extremely complicated, with many interdependent features. But when you aren't in the same location, you cannot as easily manage it.

dpark 10y ago
> the administration cannot properly value IT because they (likely) do not understand how it works If they cannot value IT then you should expect them to contract it to the lowest bidder. You don't pay a premium for something you don't value.
- orbitingpluto 10y ago
  Well it's a university. Maybe the president should put in some effort? Outsourcing IT is one of those things that seriously diminishes the academic credibility of a educational institution. Outsourcing IT is something I would expect from, say, ITT Technical Institute or Trump University.
  - dpark 10y ago
    I'm not saying they should outsource. I'm saying that if you start with the claim that "the administration cannot properly value IT", the logical conclusion is outsourcing. Don't start by assuming incompetence if the goal is to argue in favor of a sound decision. Make a real argument in favor of in-house staff. Basically calling the administration incompetent is not an argument against the decision.
    - orbitingpluto 10y ago
      I already did in my second paragraph. But if you need the obvious answer: Outsourcing IT in an academic institution where ostensibly the operation of said infrastructure should be a valuable topic for research means that somebody isn't thinking. Not to mention the issue of outsourcing out of country private data. There are more obvious answers also. It all depends whether you're thinking about long term success or just the next quarter.
      - dpark 10y ago
        > Outsourcing IT in an academic institution where ostensibly the operation of said infrastructure should be a valuable topic for research means that somebody isn't thinking. IT is not a viable research topic for a medical institution. https://www.ucsf.edu/ https://www.ucsf.edu/
        orbitingpluto 10y ago
        That is the sort of attitude I would have expected to encounter from someone in the 1990s. This link is only two clicks away from the link that you provided. https://www.ucsf.edu/news/2016/12/405331/ucsf-joins-multi-university-collaboration-agreement-facebooks-building-8 https://www.ucsf.edu/news/2016/12/405331/ucsf-joins-multi-un...
        dpark 10y ago
        > That is the sort of attitude I would have expected to encounter from someone in the 1990s. This is not a rebuttal. > This link is only two clicks away from the link that you provided. I fail to see the relevance of this. UCSF literally has no school of computer science or engineering. It's absurd to suggest that they should create one in order to handle their IT needs. Also, FYI, many (most?) schools' IT departments are separate from their actual research departments. If UCSF decides to partner with Johnson & Johnson, will you take that as evidence that UCSF should start a school of janitorial studies to handle their housekeeping needs?

by trendia 10y ago

dpark 10y ago

> the administration cannot properly value IT because they (likely) do not understand how it works If they cannot value IT then you should expect them to contract it to the lowest bidder. You don't pay a premium for something you don't value.

orbitingpluto 10y ago
Well it's a university. Maybe the president should put in some effort? Outsourcing IT is one of those things that seriously diminishes the academic credibility of a educational institution. Outsourcing IT is something I would expect from, say, ITT Technical Institute or Trump University.
- dpark 10y ago
  I'm not saying they should outsource. I'm saying that if you start with the claim that "the administration cannot properly value IT", the logical conclusion is outsourcing. Don't start by assuming incompetence if the goal is to argue in favor of a sound decision. Make a real argument in favor of in-house staff. Basically calling the administration incompetent is not an argument against the decision.
  - orbitingpluto 10y ago
    I already did in my second paragraph. But if you need the obvious answer: Outsourcing IT in an academic institution where ostensibly the operation of said infrastructure should be a valuable topic for research means that somebody isn't thinking. Not to mention the issue of outsourcing out of country private data. There are more obvious answers also. It all depends whether you're thinking about long term success or just the next quarter.
    - dpark 10y ago
      > Outsourcing IT in an academic institution where ostensibly the operation of said infrastructure should be a valuable topic for research means that somebody isn't thinking. IT is not a viable research topic for a medical institution. https://www.ucsf.edu/ https://www.ucsf.edu/
      - orbitingpluto 10y ago
        That is the sort of attitude I would have expected to encounter from someone in the 1990s. This link is only two clicks away from the link that you provided. https://www.ucsf.edu/news/2016/12/405331/ucsf-joins-multi-university-collaboration-agreement-facebooks-building-8 https://www.ucsf.edu/news/2016/12/405331/ucsf-joins-multi-un...
        dpark 10y ago
        > That is the sort of attitude I would have expected to encounter from someone in the 1990s. This is not a rebuttal. > This link is only two clicks away from the link that you provided. I fail to see the relevance of this. UCSF literally has no school of computer science or engineering. It's absurd to suggest that they should create one in order to handle their IT needs. Also, FYI, many (most?) schools' IT departments are separate from their actual research departments. If UCSF decides to partner with Johnson & Johnson, will you take that as evidence that UCSF should start a school of janitorial studies to handle their housekeeping needs?