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I find it baffling that you'd assume morality is at all involved in this for those who subscribe to the more nationalist / anti-immigrant / anti-outsourcing ide

I find it baffling that you'd assume morality is at all involved in this for those who subscribe to the more nationalist / anti-immigrant / anti-outsourcing ideas. It's about money. If I'm an American developer, I want as few developers to be available so that my wages rise. If I'm BigCo, I want as few competitors selling the same products so that my prices can rise. What's hard to understand about why people would support these types of movements? It's as simple as "I want more money and I don't really care about other people who's lives I'm not experiencing."

kamaal 10y ago
>>If I'm an American developer, I want as few developers to be available so that my wages rise. The door for this has closed quite a while ago. These days with a laptop and a internet connection there are a lot of things you can learn and do. Basically we lowered the barrier to entry big time. In fact many of us have a job today because of this low barrier to entry. Now to expect the door be shut right behind us is in a way morally wrong. Nor the way how things work.
- scarface74 10y ago
  If you are in your career for more than 5-10 years and the only thing that you can offer to a potential company is the ability to Sling code, why shouldn't your job be outsourced? Being able to sling code is a commodity. It took me a while, but I think I've developed enough architectural and soft skills to not be lumped in the pool of easily outsource code slingers.
  - AstralStorm 10y ago
    So now you'd be outsourced to a manager, analyst and a "code slinger" in India? (and your manager too) It is always a question of price and achievable quality. One works against the other, partly.
    - scarface74 10y ago
      Realistically, do you see management and architects being outsourced to India en masse?
      - gech 10y ago
        Yes
      - mannykannot 10y ago
        I can imagine a 1960s steel-industry manager making a similar statement.
        scarface74 10y ago
        You can relatively easy draw a schematic and decide exactly how you want a piece of steel to be made. Have you ever seen a successful software project development and maintained based on a spec and not based on constant interaction between the customer and some tech lead?
        mannykannot 10y ago
        Have you noticed how the customers are moving their work to other countries? Your argument becomes one for moving the software development, including its management, with it. This is somewhat beside the point, however. The people my hypothetical steel-industry manager is based on failed to imagine how the world was going to change and could not imagine that people in less-developed countries could be as competent as themselves. Then there is AI. It has taken a long time, but it is coming.

kamaal 10y ago

>>If I'm an American developer, I want as few developers to be available so that my wages rise. The door for this has closed quite a while ago. These days with a laptop and a internet connection there are a lot of things you can learn and do. Basically we lowered the barrier to entry big time. In fact many of us have a job today because of this low barrier to entry. Now to expect the door be shut right behind us is in a way morally wrong. Nor the way how things work.

scarface74 10y ago
If you are in your career for more than 5-10 years and the only thing that you can offer to a potential company is the ability to Sling code, why shouldn't your job be outsourced? Being able to sling code is a commodity. It took me a while, but I think I've developed enough architectural and soft skills to not be lumped in the pool of easily outsource code slingers.
- AstralStorm 10y ago
  So now you'd be outsourced to a manager, analyst and a "code slinger" in India? (and your manager too) It is always a question of price and achievable quality. One works against the other, partly.
  - scarface74 10y ago
    Realistically, do you see management and architects being outsourced to India en masse?
    - gech 10y ago
      Yes
    - mannykannot 10y ago
      I can imagine a 1960s steel-industry manager making a similar statement.
      - scarface74 10y ago
        You can relatively easy draw a schematic and decide exactly how you want a piece of steel to be made. Have you ever seen a successful software project development and maintained based on a spec and not based on constant interaction between the customer and some tech lead?
        mannykannot 10y ago
        Have you noticed how the customers are moving their work to other countries? Your argument becomes one for moving the software development, including its management, with it. This is somewhat beside the point, however. The people my hypothetical steel-industry manager is based on failed to imagine how the world was going to change and could not imagine that people in less-developed countries could be as competent as themselves. Then there is AI. It has taken a long time, but it is coming.