4 ms·

There's an argument that isn't racism here. In AU->US outsourcing, the motivation for outsourcing is not to drive down labor costs, because labor costs are cle

by jordanb 10y ago

There's an argument that isn't racism here. In AU->US outsourcing, the motivation for outsourcing is not to drive down labor costs, because labor costs are clearly higher in the US. The only reason to outsource from AU to US is if people in the US can do it better. This is the opposite when we talk about outsourcing from an advanced country to a developing country. The rationale is always cost, and specifically cost of labor. It's always about driving the cost of labor downwards. And so workers in the outsourcing country resist---absolutely---because the ultimate aim is to undermine their wages and living standards.

p_ 10y ago
> reason to outsource from AU to US is if people in the US can do it better. That's rarely the case More often it's about follow-the-sun
atonse 10y ago
Are you talking about the cultural definition of outsourcing? Then you're just bolstering my point. In fact, in just making the assumption that people only outsource to the US because the US does it better, and the reverse (only because it's cheaper) to developing countries, there is an implicit bias in assuming that. Here's the dictionary definition. (There's no mention of developing country.) out·source ˈoutˌsôrs/ verb gerund or present participle: outsourcing obtain (goods or a service) from an outside or foreign supplier, especially in place of an internal source. "outsourcing components from other countries" contract (work) out or abroad. "you may choose to outsource this function to another company or do it yourself" synonyms: contract out, farm out, subcontract, delegate "maintenance jobs are outsourced" Outsourcing is the same no matter which country you do it with. If you outsource to India trying to get a .NET developer for $20k, you get garbage, same as you would get if you wanted to pay $20k for a .NET programmer in the US. If you pay good rates, you get good people, developing country or not.
- jordanb 10y ago
  I'm not talking about culture, I'm talking about wage rate. Outsourcing from AU to US is not a threat to AU wages because US wages are higher. The US can not compete with the AU on the price of labor, it can only compete on quality. Conversely when work is outsourced from a country with high wages to one with lower wages, this is a threat to the wage rate in the higher wage country.
kamaal 10y ago
>>In AU->US outsourcing, the motivation for outsourcing is not to drive down labor costs, because labor costs are clearly higher in the US. The only reason to outsource from AU to US is if people in the US can do it better. As an Indian who was in the trenches during the call center craze during the 2000's. Let me tell you our American managers used to often tell us the real reason for outsourcing to India was rarely if ever cost. It was scale, it was really hard to find college degree holders, and many times engineers in thousands of numbers to work on doing things like taking calls all night in the US. Apparently a lot of people in the US won't do jobs like these because they think its beneath their station.
- AstralStorm 10y ago
  Not true. They won't do the job at the salary offered as it is a soul crushing job. If it were properly salaried according to that... Also why would a phone and script operator need a degree? You heard a nice excuse and feel good lie.
  - kamaal 10y ago
    >>why would a phone and script operator need a degree? Your resume won't even go past the screening phase if you don't have a degree for a call center job in India. I had a Bachelor's in Electronics and Communication Engineering.

by jordanb 10y ago

p_ 10y ago

> reason to outsource from AU to US is if people in the US can do it better. That's rarely the case More often it's about follow-the-sun

atonse 10y ago

Are you talking about the cultural definition of outsourcing? Then you're just bolstering my point. In fact, in just making the assumption that people only outsource to the US because the US does it better, and the reverse (only because it's cheaper) to developing countries, there is an implicit bias in assuming that. Here's the dictionary definition. (There's no mention of developing country.) out·source ˈoutˌsôrs/ verb gerund or present participle: outsourcing obtain (goods or a service) from an outside or foreign supplier, especially in place of an internal source. "outsourcing components from other countries" contract (work) out or abroad. "you may choose to outsource this function to another company or do it yourself" synonyms: contract out, farm out, subcontract, delegate "maintenance jobs are outsourced" Outsourcing is the same no matter which country you do it with. If you outsource to India trying to get a .NET developer for $20k, you get garbage, same as you would get if you wanted to pay $20k for a .NET programmer in the US. If you pay good rates, you get good people, developing country or not.

jordanb 10y ago
I'm not talking about culture, I'm talking about wage rate. Outsourcing from AU to US is not a threat to AU wages because US wages are higher. The US can not compete with the AU on the price of labor, it can only compete on quality. Conversely when work is outsourced from a country with high wages to one with lower wages, this is a threat to the wage rate in the higher wage country.

kamaal 10y ago

>>In AU->US outsourcing, the motivation for outsourcing is not to drive down labor costs, because labor costs are clearly higher in the US. The only reason to outsource from AU to US is if people in the US can do it better. As an Indian who was in the trenches during the call center craze during the 2000's. Let me tell you our American managers used to often tell us the real reason for outsourcing to India was rarely if ever cost. It was scale, it was really hard to find college degree holders, and many times engineers in thousands of numbers to work on doing things like taking calls all night in the US. Apparently a lot of people in the US won't do jobs like these because they think its beneath their station.

AstralStorm 10y ago
Not true. They won't do the job at the salary offered as it is a soul crushing job. If it were properly salaried according to that... Also why would a phone and script operator need a degree? You heard a nice excuse and feel good lie.
- kamaal 10y ago
  >>why would a phone and script operator need a degree? Your resume won't even go past the screening phase if you don't have a degree for a call center job in India. I had a Bachelor's in Electronics and Communication Engineering.