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Travis is such a coward. How is firing someone hired last month going to fix the rampant toxicity over at Uber? I think the biggest action Travis could take is

Travis is such a coward. How is firing someone hired last month going to fix the rampant toxicity over at Uber? I think the biggest action Travis could take is stepping down as CEO. It sounds like he is central to all of the reports of the culture of sexism and harassment over at Uber we've heard thus far. Travis needs to go, the entire HR team needs to go and all higher up executives and management staff needs to go as well.

hvass 10y ago
I recommend that you read Brad Stone's new book on Uber and Airbnb. You'd get a sense of how much Uber means to Travis. In my opinion, the last thing he'd do is to step down (I am not making a comment whether he should or shouldn't—it's just something that I clearly don't see happening voluntarily.)
- btian 10y ago
  Then the board should remove him, and his lieutenant Emil Michael who threatened to stalk journalists.
  - austenallred 10y ago
    They can't; he controls the board
- yeukhon 10y ago
  Well considered he built Uber Taxi two decades ago and then Uber almost a decade ago, this means a lot to him for sure. He must have waited years to get this rich get this much of influence.
  - ant6n 10y ago
    If he worked hard and waited long ... why threaten it all with this juvenile BS?
    - deleted 10y ago
      [deleted]
    - gpawl 10y ago
      the juvenile BS was always there, and was never a threat before?
      - chronicx0 10y ago
        It is not a threat now either. After a month, everyone will forget and move on with their lives. You remember that girl who made a blog post about sexual harassment at Google? Neither do I.
meowface 10y ago
I'm definitely not on Uber's side in this and would not be surprised if it's completely true, but is there clear evidence that Travis is the root of the problem? I see that HR doesn't want to fire people he's fond of, but is that on orders from Travis himself? I think he probably should resign anyway just as a good faith gesture, but I'm curious how culpable he is personally.
- chetanahuja 10y ago
  > I see that HR doesn't want to fire people he's fond of If the the descriptions we've read so far about Uber HR's response to sexual harassment and discrimination claims as well as Travis's role in them are corroborated, the board needs to do a major housecleaning at Uber starting from the CEO, many people in HR and many of these managers who were directly carrying out these actions. Anything short of that sends the signal that women are indeed considered second class citizens in the tech ecosystem. Anything short of this would leave Uber as a silicon valley pariah. Top engineers and managers would be reluctant to join the company. Those who stay in Uber long term will have their brands tarnished. If we, as a group (silicon valley startup ecosystem) fail to respond in this manner, the entire industry's brand will be tarnished forever. We claim to be a meritocratic and progressive bunch. It pains me to say this as a guy in this industry, I had never imagined how serious and ugly the sexism in some parts of the industry is. Yes I had known at a surface level that women have more obstacles to overcome to make it in this industry. But still Susan Fowler's blog was shocking to me. This new blogpost has doubled the shock. I hope my actions from this point on will be guided by this knowledge.
  - xkcd-sucks 10y ago
    >Anything short of this would leave Uber as a silicon valley pariah. Top engineers and managers would be reluctant to join the company In the era of alt-right ascendence and president trump? That would be nice...
  - vinceguidry 10y ago
    It's been stated here that Uber's board cannot fire Kalanick, they don't have the power to. Ultimately Uber is still a privately-held company so unless they're doing something illegal, justice has to come from the market. Then again, even if they were acting illegally, they have a lot of experience with that.
obstinate 10y ago
I'd fire someone if they'd been a harasser in the past, even if my image was already impeccable. As much as this move seems to be about improving image, it doesn't need to be (I mean: that's not the only good reason to fire someone who concealed past sexual harassment allegations).
- jimmywanger 10y ago
  > I'd fire someone if they'd been a harasser in the past This news of harassment comes not from Google, but from several anonymous sources. Google declined to comment, and the man himself said that the story wasn't true. If there was no definitive proof, and the openly stated reason is that he wanted to retire, why would you fire somebody who was merely accused of being a harasser? That makes you a larger coward than somebody who keeps somebody who's under fire. Even if the claims were substantiated, people do change, and I don't think that one sexual harassment claim should be sufficient to torpedo your entire career. What's next, putting them on a registry and making them wear a scarlet letter on their chest? This whole thing is a witch hunt.
  - ant6n 10y ago
    It seems like some of these people are repeat offenders, who are trying to destroy several innocent women's careers. That's kind of the actual witch hunt.
    - jimmywanger 10y ago
      > It seems like some of these people are repeat offenders The people mentioned in the allegations have not been named and have not had their identities revealed, and also have not had any evidence presented, except for two unsubstantiated accounts. It's probably not even the same people in Fowler's article and this most recent anonymous one. Instead, somebody got information leaked (information that Google refuses to confirm) about something that happened in the past, at another company, gets fired because any appearance of impropriety must be squashed, and his name and career gets dragged through the mud for real evidence at all. Isn't that a witch hunt?
alphonsegaston 10y ago
This will only happen if he's forced out or there's a massive internal strike at Uber. I imagine he has to have something over on the board (e.g. proof of their knowledge/complicity in covering up sexual harassment), given how obviously toxic he is. And from the interactions I've had with Uber employees on this forum, there are no lengths they won't go to rationalize the most obviously horrific behavior on the part of Uber's leadership. I'm not optimistic, but then again we seem to be living in quite the era for black swans.
- hkmurakami 10y ago
  I've been at a company where the CEO is the source of a toxic culture. The board will never kick them out pre IPO if the company is growing. They might go for a coup post exit though.
  - nojvek 10y ago
    Old Microsoft was super aggressive and alpha. Not sure about the harassment though. It's now a calmer behemoth. If travis is the hero of Uber who employees rejoice then him stepping down would be a death blow to the Company. At this point Uber has got fuck you money to keep on burning employees. Employees have golden handcuffs that don't come off until IPO. The best people can do is not get a job at Uber. The existing employees start quitting en-masse or a major internal data leak. The revolution needs to come within Uber.
    - jschwartzi 10y ago
      The best people can do is actually to stop using Uber. Vote with your wallet, and go to a different service. It's what I'm doing.
      - akoncius 10y ago
        I was voting against Uber by not using it from the beginning: it seems to me unethical to dump entire taxi industry by not being profitable, but by attracting investments from VC and decreasing prices below profitability just to screw others.
lcw 10y ago
I agree that something drastic has to happen to show goodwill to Uber's current employees, but I think what you are asking for, practically speaking, is for them to shutdown. I don't know what the best option is, but shaking up management that much, from what I have experienced, is a death sentence for a company. I feel bad for Susan and Amy; I also feel for the good employees at Uber. It would be good to get a little more context from Susan and Amy to see how systemic this harassment really is/was. Some of it reads like lots of people were complicit, but I have to imagine there are/were a good portion of good people there who were not. As a man I embarrassingly feel like I am completely oblivious to harassment of women in the workplace, because I'm not complicit in it, and I don't have close enough relationships with woman colleagues for them to divulge this kind of personal information. I would hope there are a lot of people that were innocuously oblivious to it... if not that would be sickening.
- throwanem 10y ago
  I've never seen sexual harassment play out in front of me, but I have seen several other sorts, and my experience suggests that you don't need binoculars and a field guide to know what's going on.
  - lcw 10y ago
    Well yes if it's systemic, I agree, but if it's committed by a few bad actors then I think it is difficult for anyone not involved to tell how bad it is. If I was on Susan's team and my manager was the only perpetrator and he did so through private messages, and Susan didn't divulge what happen to her to me then I feel like I would never know, and that would be reasonable. Now if her manager was being outwardly inappropriate (bordering on harassment), and it was being condoned by colleagues that's a different story, and I would agree with you. That's all I really want to know about Uber's culture, because harassment where I have worked is more secretive and nuanced then the latter example, and the reason I haven't been aware of it while it's happening. I'm only aware when the people involved take appropriate action.
madeofpalk 10y ago
> It sounds like he is central to all of the reports of the culture of sexism and harassment over at Uber we've heard thus far I mean, he's the CEO. He's probably going to be the one common thread between _everything_ that happens at Uber. Not to say that he isn't at fault for anything, but it seems disingenuous to try and make this connection.
georgespencer 10y ago
> Travis is such a coward. How is firing someone hired last month going to fix the rampant toxicity over at Uber? There's no suggestion that he believes it will. But in the event that somebody withheld information about the reason for their dismissal or exit from a previous role, he's within his rights to terminate their employment. (And probably correct to do so IMO.)

hvass 10y ago

I recommend that you read Brad Stone's new book on Uber and Airbnb. You'd get a sense of how much Uber means to Travis. In my opinion, the last thing he'd do is to step down (I am not making a comment whether he should or shouldn't—it's just something that I clearly don't see happening voluntarily.)

btian 10y ago
Then the board should remove him, and his lieutenant Emil Michael who threatened to stalk journalists.
- austenallred 10y ago
  They can't; he controls the board
yeukhon 10y ago
Well considered he built Uber Taxi two decades ago and then Uber almost a decade ago, this means a lot to him for sure. He must have waited years to get this rich get this much of influence.
- ant6n 10y ago
  If he worked hard and waited long ... why threaten it all with this juvenile BS?
  - deleted 10y ago
    [deleted]
  - gpawl 10y ago
    the juvenile BS was always there, and was never a threat before?
    - chronicx0 10y ago
      It is not a threat now either. After a month, everyone will forget and move on with their lives. You remember that girl who made a blog post about sexual harassment at Google? Neither do I.

meowface 10y ago

I'm definitely not on Uber's side in this and would not be surprised if it's completely true, but is there clear evidence that Travis is the root of the problem? I see that HR doesn't want to fire people he's fond of, but is that on orders from Travis himself? I think he probably should resign anyway just as a good faith gesture, but I'm curious how culpable he is personally.

chetanahuja 10y ago
> I see that HR doesn't want to fire people he's fond of If the the descriptions we've read so far about Uber HR's response to sexual harassment and discrimination claims as well as Travis's role in them are corroborated, the board needs to do a major housecleaning at Uber starting from the CEO, many people in HR and many of these managers who were directly carrying out these actions. Anything short of that sends the signal that women are indeed considered second class citizens in the tech ecosystem. Anything short of this would leave Uber as a silicon valley pariah. Top engineers and managers would be reluctant to join the company. Those who stay in Uber long term will have their brands tarnished. If we, as a group (silicon valley startup ecosystem) fail to respond in this manner, the entire industry's brand will be tarnished forever. We claim to be a meritocratic and progressive bunch. It pains me to say this as a guy in this industry, I had never imagined how serious and ugly the sexism in some parts of the industry is. Yes I had known at a surface level that women have more obstacles to overcome to make it in this industry. But still Susan Fowler's blog was shocking to me. This new blogpost has doubled the shock. I hope my actions from this point on will be guided by this knowledge.
- xkcd-sucks 10y ago
  >Anything short of this would leave Uber as a silicon valley pariah. Top engineers and managers would be reluctant to join the company In the era of alt-right ascendence and president trump? That would be nice...
- vinceguidry 10y ago
  It's been stated here that Uber's board cannot fire Kalanick, they don't have the power to. Ultimately Uber is still a privately-held company so unless they're doing something illegal, justice has to come from the market. Then again, even if they were acting illegally, they have a lot of experience with that.

obstinate 10y ago

I'd fire someone if they'd been a harasser in the past, even if my image was already impeccable. As much as this move seems to be about improving image, it doesn't need to be (I mean: that's not the only good reason to fire someone who concealed past sexual harassment allegations).

jimmywanger 10y ago
> I'd fire someone if they'd been a harasser in the past This news of harassment comes not from Google, but from several anonymous sources. Google declined to comment, and the man himself said that the story wasn't true. If there was no definitive proof, and the openly stated reason is that he wanted to retire, why would you fire somebody who was merely accused of being a harasser? That makes you a larger coward than somebody who keeps somebody who's under fire. Even if the claims were substantiated, people do change, and I don't think that one sexual harassment claim should be sufficient to torpedo your entire career. What's next, putting them on a registry and making them wear a scarlet letter on their chest? This whole thing is a witch hunt.
- ant6n 10y ago
  It seems like some of these people are repeat offenders, who are trying to destroy several innocent women's careers. That's kind of the actual witch hunt.
  - jimmywanger 10y ago
    > It seems like some of these people are repeat offenders The people mentioned in the allegations have not been named and have not had their identities revealed, and also have not had any evidence presented, except for two unsubstantiated accounts. It's probably not even the same people in Fowler's article and this most recent anonymous one. Instead, somebody got information leaked (information that Google refuses to confirm) about something that happened in the past, at another company, gets fired because any appearance of impropriety must be squashed, and his name and career gets dragged through the mud for real evidence at all. Isn't that a witch hunt?

alphonsegaston 10y ago

This will only happen if he's forced out or there's a massive internal strike at Uber. I imagine he has to have something over on the board (e.g. proof of their knowledge/complicity in covering up sexual harassment), given how obviously toxic he is. And from the interactions I've had with Uber employees on this forum, there are no lengths they won't go to rationalize the most obviously horrific behavior on the part of Uber's leadership. I'm not optimistic, but then again we seem to be living in quite the era for black swans.

hkmurakami 10y ago
I've been at a company where the CEO is the source of a toxic culture. The board will never kick them out pre IPO if the company is growing. They might go for a coup post exit though.
- nojvek 10y ago
  Old Microsoft was super aggressive and alpha. Not sure about the harassment though. It's now a calmer behemoth. If travis is the hero of Uber who employees rejoice then him stepping down would be a death blow to the Company. At this point Uber has got fuck you money to keep on burning employees. Employees have golden handcuffs that don't come off until IPO. The best people can do is not get a job at Uber. The existing employees start quitting en-masse or a major internal data leak. The revolution needs to come within Uber.
  - jschwartzi 10y ago
    The best people can do is actually to stop using Uber. Vote with your wallet, and go to a different service. It's what I'm doing.
    - akoncius 10y ago
      I was voting against Uber by not using it from the beginning: it seems to me unethical to dump entire taxi industry by not being profitable, but by attracting investments from VC and decreasing prices below profitability just to screw others.

lcw 10y ago

I agree that something drastic has to happen to show goodwill to Uber's current employees, but I think what you are asking for, practically speaking, is for them to shutdown. I don't know what the best option is, but shaking up management that much, from what I have experienced, is a death sentence for a company. I feel bad for Susan and Amy; I also feel for the good employees at Uber. It would be good to get a little more context from Susan and Amy to see how systemic this harassment really is/was. Some of it reads like lots of people were complicit, but I have to imagine there are/were a good portion of good people there who were not. As a man I embarrassingly feel like I am completely oblivious to harassment of women in the workplace, because I'm not complicit in it, and I don't have close enough relationships with woman colleagues for them to divulge this kind of personal information. I would hope there are a lot of people that were innocuously oblivious to it... if not that would be sickening.

throwanem 10y ago
I've never seen sexual harassment play out in front of me, but I have seen several other sorts, and my experience suggests that you don't need binoculars and a field guide to know what's going on.
- lcw 10y ago
  Well yes if it's systemic, I agree, but if it's committed by a few bad actors then I think it is difficult for anyone not involved to tell how bad it is. If I was on Susan's team and my manager was the only perpetrator and he did so through private messages, and Susan didn't divulge what happen to her to me then I feel like I would never know, and that would be reasonable. Now if her manager was being outwardly inappropriate (bordering on harassment), and it was being condoned by colleagues that's a different story, and I would agree with you. That's all I really want to know about Uber's culture, because harassment where I have worked is more secretive and nuanced then the latter example, and the reason I haven't been aware of it while it's happening. I'm only aware when the people involved take appropriate action.

madeofpalk 10y ago

> It sounds like he is central to all of the reports of the culture of sexism and harassment over at Uber we've heard thus far I mean, he's the CEO. He's probably going to be the one common thread between _everything_ that happens at Uber. Not to say that he isn't at fault for anything, but it seems disingenuous to try and make this connection.

georgespencer 10y ago

> Travis is such a coward. How is firing someone hired last month going to fix the rampant toxicity over at Uber? There's no suggestion that he believes it will. But in the event that somebody withheld information about the reason for their dismissal or exit from a previous role, he's within his rights to terminate their employment. (And probably correct to do so IMO.)