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I interview probably two to three people a week for a DS job. It's a really difficult role to hire for. I'm basically looking for mathematicians with some knowl

I interview probably two to three people a week for a DS job. It's a really difficult role to hire for. I'm basically looking for mathematicians with some knowledge of stats who also enjoy coding and follow best practices in coding (i.e. They didn't just pick it up and hack something that works but care enough to document and structure so others can follow it at a minimum) but we also need the MBA component as well, a large part of this industry is how do you take what a DS does and deploy it in a business and ensure the business derives value from it. But I think coming at it from a mathematical background puts you in a much stronger footing than the cs guys who try to learn the math later. I rarely find strong candidates without a formal mathematical background.

kriro 10y ago
Interesting, thanks. It obviously depends a lot on the job but I would have thought that a good math background (which typically CS grads should have) would be enough for many applications. Especially since you mention the business problem aspect. I think that you can actually get quite far in DS (at least in deep learning) with rather "basic math". Unless you're innovating at the bleeding edge it's usually enough to reproduce existing ideas and applying them to interesting problems is the real key. So my hiring would have focused on CS grads with a natural interest in math, ideally very rigorous/meticulous.
- laichzeit0 10y ago
  It makes me almost feel sad for the people that followed the "why bother doing a CS degree, you can learn to code without one" trend that probably peaked and is now maybe beginning to die a slow death as the market is flooded with people who can write code. If they ever want to transition into DS they're going to have to skill up and do the equivalent of undergrad CS math curriculum (discrete, calculus, linear algebra, math stats, etc.), which let's be honest, you cannot pick this up in any meaningful way in a "few months" of after hours/weekend study like you can when learning to program or learning some new "framework"; either that or just remain another dime-a-dozen code-cutter. It's sad because if you just did the 4 years of computer science and all the math and the stats that go with it you'd be so close to pivoting right now if you wanted to.
  - Almaviva 10y ago
    > you cannot pick this up in any meaningful way in a "few months" of after hours/weekend study You can't pick up coding like this either. See Peter Norvig's famous "Teach yourself programming in 10 years" article. The delta in the wisdom you obtain, between a few side projects over months and battle hardened experience with real products and code bases over years, is immense.
- throwaway729 10y ago
  Exactly. This is one place where the "good school" heuristic is actually a good one -- those programs almost uniformly demand some mathematical maturity of their students. I've known many CS undergrads who are better mathematicians than people with graduate Mathematics training.
ianai 10y ago
Your comment makes me feel better about myself. I've got a BS in math, some programming chops in python/swift/objc/c/sql/etc, and I quit an MA in economics.

kriro 10y ago

Interesting, thanks. It obviously depends a lot on the job but I would have thought that a good math background (which typically CS grads should have) would be enough for many applications. Especially since you mention the business problem aspect. I think that you can actually get quite far in DS (at least in deep learning) with rather "basic math". Unless you're innovating at the bleeding edge it's usually enough to reproduce existing ideas and applying them to interesting problems is the real key. So my hiring would have focused on CS grads with a natural interest in math, ideally very rigorous/meticulous.

laichzeit0 10y ago
It makes me almost feel sad for the people that followed the "why bother doing a CS degree, you can learn to code without one" trend that probably peaked and is now maybe beginning to die a slow death as the market is flooded with people who can write code. If they ever want to transition into DS they're going to have to skill up and do the equivalent of undergrad CS math curriculum (discrete, calculus, linear algebra, math stats, etc.), which let's be honest, you cannot pick this up in any meaningful way in a "few months" of after hours/weekend study like you can when learning to program or learning some new "framework"; either that or just remain another dime-a-dozen code-cutter. It's sad because if you just did the 4 years of computer science and all the math and the stats that go with it you'd be so close to pivoting right now if you wanted to.
- Almaviva 10y ago
  > you cannot pick this up in any meaningful way in a "few months" of after hours/weekend study You can't pick up coding like this either. See Peter Norvig's famous "Teach yourself programming in 10 years" article. The delta in the wisdom you obtain, between a few side projects over months and battle hardened experience with real products and code bases over years, is immense.
throwaway729 10y ago
Exactly. This is one place where the "good school" heuristic is actually a good one -- those programs almost uniformly demand some mathematical maturity of their students. I've known many CS undergrads who are better mathematicians than people with graduate Mathematics training.

ianai 10y ago

Your comment makes me feel better about myself. I've got a BS in math, some programming chops in python/swift/objc/c/sql/etc, and I quit an MA in economics.