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Popularity of Sony’s PlayStation VR Surprises Even the Company

250 points by Tiktaalik 10y ago

Fifer82 10y ago
I am too poor to access a rift or htc, the PSVR seems like it would soil my experience. Like those 720 HD ready TVs. How do HN people feel about VR?
- bitwize 10y ago
  PlayStation VR (and ordinary PS4) is currently the only platform on which Rez Infinite is available. Playing Rez Infinite in VR has been the most intense gaming experience of my life -- I'm not shitting you.
  - mquander 10y ago
    +1 to this. Rez Infinite was close to the best few hours I have ever spent with a computer. That said, most of my coworkers didn't seem to get the same thing out of it that I did.
    - musha68k 10y ago
      Die-hard Rez fan here as well :) so damn sweet, total flow state for me (surely not for everyone unfortunately).
- tchock23 10y ago
  If you don't have the money for rift or vive, PSVR is a solid choice. Doesn't have quite the content (yet), but what is there is high quality. The form factor is much more comfortable than the rift or vive...
  - ethbro 10y ago
    How is Sony with regards to indie developers? I haven't been following that, but I gather that Steam / Sony / Microsoft have all been trying to lower barriers to entry. Barring a major publisher (e.g. Capcom from the article) taking a leap of faith, I think that's where a lot of the quality first gen content is going to come from.
    - danso 10y ago
      For PSVR, Sony seems to be rather lenient. I say this because there's a high amount of shovelware on PSVR from indie developers, like this walking screensaver: http://pureplaystation.com/review-perfect-ps4psvr/2016/12/ http://pureplaystation.com/review-perfect-ps4psvr/2016/12/ I think it's good to have high-quality ports to help advance the platform (Arizona Sunshine, Fruit Ninja), but given the substantial technical challenges of VR and its relatively small audience, I think quality titles are going to require committed funding by Sony.
    - Tiktaalik 10y ago
      Typically Sony has been the best place to find indie games outside of Steam and I'm hoping to see a lot more indie games going forward. Super Hypercube is an indie game for PSVR that is considered to be quite good.
    - outworlder 10y ago
      It does not have an early access program though. Which means it is missing out on a bunch of things. For VR, Subnautica comes to mind.
    - kristofferR 10y ago
      Some would argue that they're too nice, as the Life of Black Tiger incident showed: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uM523jjrvf4 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uM523jjrvf4 http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/digitalfoundry-2017-life-of-black-tiger-is-the-worst-ps4-game-weve-ever-played http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/digitalfoundry-2017-life-o...
- drewrv 10y ago
  I love my vive but VR isn't quite ready for prime time yet. It's clunky and overpriced and there's a limited library. It feels like we're in the "Palm pilot" stage of the technology. Eventually an "iPhone" will come out, but there are technical and UI hurdles to overcome before that can happen. That being said, it's also an exciting time to get involved. VR owners get to experiment with different play styles and UIs and be part of a small dedicated community. Game devs hang out on /r/vive and accept feedback and ideas. And if you already know how to code, getting started in VR development is pretty easy.
  - andybak 10y ago
    Yep. If you've got an ounce of "early adopter" in you then it's a fantastic time to be involved. There's tons of great content if you're prepared for the odd rough edge and the lack of decent curation.
  - pvg 10y ago
    That sounds more like the Newton. The Palm pilot was a massive success - a smaller, cheaper PDA that wasn't just for gadget nerds.
  - stale2002 10y ago
    The VR technology is honestly very good right now, if we are talking about the actual hardware. What we don't have yet is content. We need 1 company to put out a triple A game, and it will hit mainstream.
- andybak 10y ago
  There is so much free and cheap content for the Vive that has provided me endless entertainment I have a feeling that you'll end up spending the same amount you'd save on PSVR buying content. It's similar to the PC vs console economics. I almost never buy games at full price. The money I spent over the cost a console is definitely cancelled out by the money I've saved with Steam sales, Humble Bundles etc.
- blhack 10y ago
  I have tried almost every iteration of consumer VR from the last few years. Oculus DK1, DK2, and CV1, Vive, PSVR, and cardboard. I want to say that Vive is by far the best experience, but I don't think that you're going to get ruined by trying the PSVR first, especially not if you have a bit of imagination/ability to dream about what the technology will become. Even back in the DK1 days, it was very very clear that this was going to be an incredible technology, and I think the PSVR is better than that was.
- jasonlotito 10y ago
  I have both the Rift and PSVR. I'm happy to have both. Of the two, Rift is technically superior, but not enough that I feel like the PSVR is a let down. In fact, the PSVR is much more comfortable than the Rift, hands down. If you already have a PS4, and want to get into VR, the PSVR is a solid choice.
camus2 10y ago
Well, in order for VR to be successful you ACTUALLY need good VR games. It seems Resident Evil 7 got a fair amount of positive reviews. I believe the VR mode for that game is currently supported only on PS4.
- esturk 10y ago
  Yes, there's a 1 year exclusive until it goes to PC.
- iamdave 10y ago
  Eve Valkyrie is also a full game worth talking about. Well, kind-of full. You don't get that "here's 30 minutes of an experience, now back to the start you go"; the multiplayer aspect of the game is amazing, but single player could have used a bit more attention. Overall though, the immersion, the unique control scheme for space dogfighting, upgrading and improving your ships, it's doing a VERY good job holding me over until the PS4 port of Elite Dangerous comes out.
  - rocky1138 10y ago
    Eve Valkyrie is good but without supersampling it is hard to see ships at a great distance away due to the screen-door effect. Alas, I've got only a GTX 970 graphics card, so supersampling is out for me.
- mordant 10y ago
  VR must be wireless in order to be successful.
  - jobigoud 10y ago
    This is solved and will start being implemented in headsets in the next few years, this year as an add-on. See the first to market here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z-CWz8nAFgs https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z-CWz8nAFgs
avar 10y ago
The reason I'm not buying the PSRV is that it's really hard to figure out if it'll even work for me vis-a-vis the tracking camera. I have a projector setup, so the PSRV camera has some propriterary cable running to it that I'd need to buy a third-party extension cord for, and who knows if that'll work. Even if I have that I can't find any information on Sony's site about where it's acceptable to mount the camera relative to where you're standing. Is it only OK if it's directly in front of you, how about at a 45° incline etc? Then, if I get all of that right I don't have a lot of floor space in front of the projector (maybe 2x2 meters), they don't say how far you're expected to move around in the games you can buy.
- iamdave 10y ago
  how about at a 45° incline etc? It works. I have mine on my mounted tv, which sits roughly at that angle from where my seat is. The PS Camera can tilt and swivel down so it doesn't need directly parallel vision. Edit: The biggest knock I have (and this might be a problem with Occulus and Vive but I don't own either to know) is the issue of screen drift. Some games - like Eve Valkyrie - switch from a 2D/flat loading screen to fully rendered 3D environments.In those loading areas I may pull off the headset to check my phone or take a sip of water, put it back on and have to reorient the screen. It's not a burdensome task to adjust, just press and hold options and it pops back into place. It's also not a terrible amount of drift that it impacts gameplay, but it is something I've noticed occurring with a frequency that's a little nagging.
jxcole 10y ago
There is a known strategy in politics to intentionally book rooms for speeches that are too small for the number of people who will show up. That way the next day the newspapers will talk about how people were standing in the aisles just to see the politician. You have to wonder whether Sony is using the same strategy to generate more long term interest in a product that was "sold out" and "scarce".
- AlphaSite 10y ago
  A million sold is a lot for a $300 peripheral.
  - SeanBoocock 10y ago
    $400 actually. Also most(?) people probably had to buy the $500 bundle as PSVR requires a Sony Playstation camera to function and many games utilize the bundled Move controllers as input devices.
  - haydenlee 10y ago
    A million sold is a lot for a $300 gen 1 peripheral without a proven content lineup.
  - MegaButts 10y ago
    It's enough to make me think it could go either way, but I still think VR will grow slowly over a period of several years before finding its niche in the market. To put things in perspective, Microsoft sold tens of millions of Kinect devices before abandoning it - within the first 60 days they had sold 8 million. http://www.businessinsider.com/why-microsoft-xbox-kinect-didnt-take-off-2015-9 http://www.businessinsider.com/why-microsoft-xbox-kinect-did...
  - kabdib 10y ago
    Sheer quantity shipped is not a guarantee that a platform will be viable. The Kinect sold ten or twelve million in the first couple of months. (That may have been the number manufactured, but it still sold in the many-millions on launch). That didn't help it succeed. There are a bunch of reasons why it didn't, and why it was eventually all but deprecated from the Xbox One. I believe that user interaction design driven by management-imposed ideology, rather than user testing, was a big factor.
danso 10y ago
I bought PSVR last year and have purchased most of the games that have come out since. I've never used the other VR systems so don't know how PSVR compares, nor have I ever owned a HD TV (I play off a monitor) so the low-res doesn't deeply bother me. But the truth is is that while there are great experiences, there aren't many great games. By great experiences, I mean, games that make you go "Wow" for the first 10 minutes, but after you've completed the game, there's not much reason to go back. The VR games aren't often designed with replayability or player freedom in mind. This coupled with the fact that putting on the headset is substantially more work than just picking up a controller means I've barely used the VR setup compared to just playing regular PS4 games. Maybe things will change after the popular success of Resident Evil 7. But the problem with RE7 is that a pants-shitting experience is not the gaming for everyone. I don't blame developers in general for not putting the effort in making great, polished VR games -- the audience just isn't there in comparison to the 50 million PS4 systems in general. For PSVR to become truly successful, Sony had to throw money at developers to make games that will be loss leaders at first. Right now, PSVR is mostly shovelware and ports from other VR platforms. One of only developers to build a AAA-game for PSVR, RIGS, was supported by and then shut down by Sony [0]. I don't have a lot of faith that VR won't go down the route of PSMove, PS Camera, Xbox's Kinect, and other such unsupported peripherals. edit: A couple of other things to point out. I haven't used Rift or Vive but the general consensus is that PSVR tracking is inferior. That has to be another disincentive for developers to make distinctive, polished games. Right now, the most fun VR game is Fruit Ninja, but that allows for sloppy tracking and is a fairly simple game. The challenge of translating player gestures, and also not making the player super-sick, are the kind of challenges that require first-party support/investment by Sony...third-party indie developers can't do it on their own. All that said, for games that can be played fully as either VR or non-VR -- this includes RE7, Rez, and Bound -- the VR experience is so much more superior that you can't imagine playing the non-VR versions. [0] http://metro.co.uk/2017/01/12/sony-shuts-down-rigs-developer-guerrilla-cambridge-6377707/ http://metro.co.uk/2017/01/12/sony-shuts-down-rigs-developer...
- Tiktaalik 10y ago
  At a recent earnings announcement Capcom said that RE7 was a big VR success and they were going to focus more on VR in the future. Hopefully other large games companies have noticed how well RE7 VR is doing and will give the platform a deeper look. Personally I've been very impressed with RE7 in VR and it does feel like the "killer app" that VR has needed to create consumer excitement for the medium, at least for hardcore gamers. You're right that horror isn't going to appeal to everyone, though Capcom has a deep library of IPs and constantly creates new IPs. I think they have the ability to create a deep, AAA, VR experience for a wider hardcore gamer audience.
donum 10y ago
Reading the comments I realized there are currently three main issues: 1. VR costs a lot 2. The technology needs to be better (higher resolution) 3. There's not a lot of VR content available yet. Two weeks ago, Gabe Newell and his SteamVR team talked openly about these issues in an interview. [1] They say: - The price will go down and the tech will become better. He said VR will be a new reason for CPU/GPU manufacturers to up their game again. (2018/2019) - Valve is currently making three different full VR games (2017/2018) - There should be an open VR standard [1] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kMpQWSqQFK0 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kMpQWSqQFK0
- stephengillie 10y ago
  VR needs a GoldenEye moment. VR needs the kind of revolutionary blockbuster that Doom was, to make people sit up and take notice. Something that really pushes the possibilities of the technology, and pushes us into a new era of gaming, the way FarCry pushed the limits of video technology. Instead, it's not quite getting dumped in the sand the way Atari dumped ET in 1982, but it's not far off - major supporters are giving half-hearted statements, and the biggest application I've heard about receiving VR investment is a desktop replacement - not exactly something from which I'd expect a compelling VR experience. So far, my most mind-blowing VR experience has merely been Google Earth. Where are the Wii-game clones? Where are the DDR-clones and, like, retro arcades? Where are the games that have co-op in the same space? Why can't you invite your friends into your Google Earth, to look at the same scenes? We're roughly a year out, with multiple platforms, and almost every game is still a tech demo. Where are the news reports of people breaking their TV with their Vive-mote? - Nobody has been so preoccupied with a VR game that that they flung the controller into the TV yet. I'm worried that investors were so preoccupied with whether or not they could make money off of this, that they didn't stop to think if they should make it fun. How many consoles have successfully gone their first year without a compelling release, and later recovered?
  - jclardy 10y ago
    It is really a chicken and egg problem. We need more affordable hardware to create a market for the software, but to create the software we need that market to already exist. The only real solution is for the VR hardware manufacturers to invest in development of software until they get something good. I own a vive and there are some really cool experiences, but in my library of games there is not really anything that i'm itching to come back to. It mostly just sits put away till something new releases, or I want to show it to a friend. Further complicating the issue is the hardware split. Vive/Oculus can somewhat share things if you are dedicated and willing to accept poor control schemes, but PSVR is out on its own. Then you get into the whole seated/roomscale issue, and things like motion sickness from locomotion and you find that it is really hard to develop something that can apply to a large population right now.
DigitalSea 10y ago
I got the PSVR as a day one pre-order. I was so excited, I preordered months before its release (when they first announced it). I had it for 2.5 months and then I sold it. It was cool at first, but the technology just isn't quite there. The limiting depth of field, limited choice of decent games (Rush of Blood was great) and Wii style graphics for a few of the experiences (especially Playstation VR Worlds). It's a fun platform, but it definitely has the gimick aspect to it. I've experienced Oculus Rift, HTC Vive, Gear VR and PSVR. In all honesty, nothing has really wowed me just yet. I believe we'll need 4k VR for the technology to truly take it up a notch, it's getting there. My favourite is definitely the Vive, just peripherials and the resolution is great. No doubt, the PSVR 2.0 is going to be amazing and I will buy that again.
- supercoder 10y ago
  I dunno, the games get better every week with the PSVR. Sure they were a bit thin on the ground to start with, but now there's something new to play quite regularly .
- bitwize 10y ago
  Rez Infinite -- alone -- easily justified the multi-hectobuck asking price of PSVR. If you didn't try it, man did you miss out. One of the things about Rez is that it's an update of a 2001 Dreamcast and PS2 game. The simpler graphics mean that head tracking in the VR version is very close to perfect, even on a first-gen PS4. I noticed judder in the head tracking when I was at the system menu in "virtual screen in front of you" mode; there was none in Rez Infinite, even in full VR in Area X.
- psyc 10y ago
  I have a PSVR and I think it's simply amazing. Room scale and better visuals will be great, sure. But PSVR as it is today is already what I've been waiting 25 years for.
  - musha68k 10y ago
    Same here :) I've extended experience with all major VR headsets and I actually prefer the PSVR because of Sony's top-notch vertical integration. That said, I get the general criticism for the current state in VR ("low" resolution yadda yadda) and PSVR in particular (lack of full room control / limited motion tracking yadda yadda). I really don't mind as presence works across the board today and I actually love the "subtractive" design and simple controller based experiences of most PSVR titles. In any case, even with the most high-end graphics card on a 4K+ display and the most ambitious titles, games still look very far from photo realistic (ask any non gamer to watch you play and evaluate). It will take us still a very long time to get to that somewhat questionable goal, especially in VR where all those "shortcomings" get even more pronounced. We will probably need completely new paradigms in game development as well as whole new classes of technology in general. So, it's still called "playing" right? Let's continue using our imagination while enjoying the most creative efforts of our time in ever more engaging ways. REZ and BattleZone VR alone.. my 14 year old me still can't believe that this exists and is available for normal people for essentially a summer holiday amount of work :O All that considered, VR clearly is not for everyone. Many people can't get used to it for lots of reasons. One should also always get enough sleep and take breaks even when accustomed to VR – it is taxing. Another reason why I prefer more "simple" arcade style experiences actually, 20 min bouts of highly enjoyable escapism after which I get back to real life yay ;)
karmakaze 10y ago
I had trouble taking the article seriously when it repeatedly called the PSVR premium, coming off like a PR piece. It's strictly on the mainstream/low-end. Also, it didn't mention how much of the sales were in Japan other than to say 'especially', which doesn't often reflect reception elsewhere.
- supercoder 10y ago
  Premium when compared to those stupid bits of cardboard you put your phone in.
skywhopper 10y ago
They compare sales to the iPhone's first three months which they call a huge feat, but at the time iPhone sales were actually considered somewhat lackluster until Apple switched to standard subsidy pricing. Only then did the iPhone become a phenomenon. A million units in four months is still impressive, but please get the historical references right.
- deleted 10y ago
  [deleted]
- musha68k 10y ago
  The iPhone was a general "internet" device and a "phone" and the PSVR is a "video game" — nytimes is comparing apples with oranges ;)
- deleted 10y ago
  [deleted]
greggman 10y ago
Apparently people have managed to get PSVR to work with Windows and OSX even going so far as to get a few Oculus games to run http://vrheads.com/do-you-really-need-ps4-playstation-vr http://vrheads.com/do-you-really-need-ps4-playstation-vr I've been trying to get one since they shipped in October. I'm in Japan. They have a raffle every 2 weeks or so to decide who gets to buy them at list price.
partiallypro 10y ago
I'd like to see the usage numbers. Ownership is great for Sony, this generation, but on the next? I'm thinking of Kinect when I hear this. Kinect broke records on the 360 for sales. Once the Xbox One was launched, with the Kinect bundled (which was reasonable seeing as the Kinect v1 sales were amazing), people scoffed. I honestly don't think VR is going to be where it needs to be for a while. It's going to be great for therapeutic uses, but for general consumers, I am just not convinced that it's more than a gimmick item you show to your friends but never really use much. There will be exceptions, but I think usage numbers would back me up.
- musha68k 10y ago
  Have you tried PSVR yourself? If so, which games?
exabrial 10y ago
I would be happy if we [USA] never bought another drop of oil from the middle east until they learn a few lessons about human rights. And actually, exploitation of domestic resources has dramatically reduced our dependency on foreign oil. /Firey opinion off, apologies
- hamandcheese 10y ago
  I believe you are in the wrong thread :)
  - exabrial 10y ago
    Yes, I was replying to Saudi oil? How on earth
  - deleted 10y ago
    [deleted]
timothycrosley 10y ago
Personally, I think the biggest problem with VR is that it's downright dangerous. I tried a professionally setup and monitored demo of HTC vive inside of a Microsoft store, and walked into the wall. They needed somebody with you to help make sure you didn't get tangled in the wires - during a 15 minute demo! And people still did, repeatedly. Until there aren't cords and something like the Omni treadmill comes around to handle movement without physically moving - I just think it's not practical or safe as a technology for games other then flight and driving simulators.
- robertfw 10y ago
  If you walked into a wall, they must not have had the chaperone settings setup properly, either miscalibrated or not appearing brightly enough. I have a 2.5m x 2.5m space, with walls an inch or so past the edge of the space on two sides. There's only been a small handful of hits, and those were mostly at the beginning. My experience, both for myself and watching my friends try things out, is that the wire is annoying, but it's not dangerous. I think part of the problem here could be that it's best to play without shoes on - it's easier to tell when you are standing on the cord, which is when you can get the most tangled up. Obviously people are not taking their shoes off for store demos. Wireless is definitely going to be a massive improvement, but I think saying it is dangerous is a bit of a stretch.
  - timothycrosley 10y ago
    I could def see being shoeless helping things out. However, by definition most of these VR systems are wired into a computer on or near desk. I could easily see someone tangle and then trip over the wire and then hit their head on the desk.
    - timothycrosley 10y ago
      In fact, just google "VR Injuries" and you'll see way more examples then say happened with the nintendo wii, pre strap, a change they made because they concluded without it the wii was too dangerous and lawsuit prone. The original wii has nothing on current state VR. If it became any where near as widespread as the wii did with it's current implementation, there would certainly be a few more entries to the Darwin awards...
wenbert 10y ago
Is it just me or is VR involves a lot unnecessary effort for the user? ie: I don't want to walk around. I want to sit comfortably without straining my arm or walking into walls.
- musha68k 10y ago
  That's actually why I love the PSVR – I prefer the haptics and general setup of traditional video/computer gaming. Still, I also love the VIVE for what it could do in terms of creativity / productivity applications.
- lebek 10y ago
  For non-games I agree. I'm working on a VR design tool and I've given myself the constraint that user are sitting in a swivel chair with elbows on armrests most of the time. I'm hoping that it'll give enough room to do interesting stuff without straying too far from keyboard-level laziness. For games, I've been playing VR archery since I got the Vive almost a year ago and I still love it. It is tiring but so are traditional sports and people do those.
- rocky1138 10y ago
  Are you saying there's no hope for my gardening simulator?
dghughes 10y ago
I remember the 3D VFX in the 1990s and thinking that in a few years it will be cheap and everywhere. Nope.
cdevs 10y ago
I have it , it's awesome BUT...it's pretty exhausting to use - like once a week. Resolution is low but then again there are these holy cow this is amazing get lost in what your seeing because of the depth of certain things and the awesome head tracking. Definitely needs more content I check every week for some new experience no matter how small.
jcoffland 10y ago
Humans finally get inexpensive VR and what's the first popular VR experience? A game where you kill other humans with guns. Oh we're going to be fine, just fine.
kleiba 10y ago
That actually surprises me as well. I would have thought that VR was going to be like 3D-TV: hyped very much for a certain amount of time but then mostly forgotten again. And I'm still not sure VR won't go down the same route.
- godzillabrennus 10y ago
  I thought that till I tried it. The experience is impressive, not at all like the gimmicky 3D TV.
  - kleiba 10y ago
    My skepticism mostly comes from reflecting on how I'm currently experiencing video games most of the time: together with a friend, sitting on the couch in front of the TV in the living room. This is a social setting: when we play a game together, we don't just look at the screen, we talk to each, look at each other, get up and get a drink from the kitchen, etc. And most often, we spend a few hours doing exactly that. I know that not everyone shares my feeling, but somehow I have troubles imagining doing the same with VR headsets on. I don't really want to be completely removed from this social setting, completely emerged in the VR environment -- I want both, plus the ability to switch between them quickly. Don't get me wrong, I think VR is a super cool technology. My point is that I just don't think it plays well with the social setting of a bunch of buddies hanging out together.
rrajdev 10y ago
http://krishna-kanaiya-photos-images.blogspot.com/2017/02/holi-ki-shubhkamnaye.html http://krishna-kanaiya-photos-images.blogspot.com/2017/02/ho...

250 points by Tiktaalik 10y ago

I am too poor to access a rift or htc, the PSVR seems like it would soil my experience. Like those 720 HD ready TVs. How do HN people feel about VR?

bitwize 10y ago
PlayStation VR (and ordinary PS4) is currently the only platform on which Rez Infinite is available. Playing Rez Infinite in VR has been the most intense gaming experience of my life -- I'm not shitting you.
- mquander 10y ago
  +1 to this. Rez Infinite was close to the best few hours I have ever spent with a computer. That said, most of my coworkers didn't seem to get the same thing out of it that I did.
  - musha68k 10y ago
    Die-hard Rez fan here as well :) so damn sweet, total flow state for me (surely not for everyone unfortunately).
tchock23 10y ago
If you don't have the money for rift or vive, PSVR is a solid choice. Doesn't have quite the content (yet), but what is there is high quality. The form factor is much more comfortable than the rift or vive...
- ethbro 10y ago
  How is Sony with regards to indie developers? I haven't been following that, but I gather that Steam / Sony / Microsoft have all been trying to lower barriers to entry. Barring a major publisher (e.g. Capcom from the article) taking a leap of faith, I think that's where a lot of the quality first gen content is going to come from.
  - danso 10y ago
    For PSVR, Sony seems to be rather lenient. I say this because there's a high amount of shovelware on PSVR from indie developers, like this walking screensaver: http://pureplaystation.com/review-perfect-ps4psvr/2016/12/ http://pureplaystation.com/review-perfect-ps4psvr/2016/12/ I think it's good to have high-quality ports to help advance the platform (Arizona Sunshine, Fruit Ninja), but given the substantial technical challenges of VR and its relatively small audience, I think quality titles are going to require committed funding by Sony.
  - Tiktaalik 10y ago
    Typically Sony has been the best place to find indie games outside of Steam and I'm hoping to see a lot more indie games going forward. Super Hypercube is an indie game for PSVR that is considered to be quite good.
  - outworlder 10y ago
    It does not have an early access program though. Which means it is missing out on a bunch of things. For VR, Subnautica comes to mind.
  - kristofferR 10y ago
    Some would argue that they're too nice, as the Life of Black Tiger incident showed: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uM523jjrvf4 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uM523jjrvf4 http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/digitalfoundry-2017-life-of-black-tiger-is-the-worst-ps4-game-weve-ever-played http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/digitalfoundry-2017-life-o...
drewrv 10y ago
I love my vive but VR isn't quite ready for prime time yet. It's clunky and overpriced and there's a limited library. It feels like we're in the "Palm pilot" stage of the technology. Eventually an "iPhone" will come out, but there are technical and UI hurdles to overcome before that can happen. That being said, it's also an exciting time to get involved. VR owners get to experiment with different play styles and UIs and be part of a small dedicated community. Game devs hang out on /r/vive and accept feedback and ideas. And if you already know how to code, getting started in VR development is pretty easy.
- andybak 10y ago
  Yep. If you've got an ounce of "early adopter" in you then it's a fantastic time to be involved. There's tons of great content if you're prepared for the odd rough edge and the lack of decent curation.
- pvg 10y ago
  That sounds more like the Newton. The Palm pilot was a massive success - a smaller, cheaper PDA that wasn't just for gadget nerds.
- stale2002 10y ago
  The VR technology is honestly very good right now, if we are talking about the actual hardware. What we don't have yet is content. We need 1 company to put out a triple A game, and it will hit mainstream.
andybak 10y ago
There is so much free and cheap content for the Vive that has provided me endless entertainment I have a feeling that you'll end up spending the same amount you'd save on PSVR buying content. It's similar to the PC vs console economics. I almost never buy games at full price. The money I spent over the cost a console is definitely cancelled out by the money I've saved with Steam sales, Humble Bundles etc.
blhack 10y ago
I have tried almost every iteration of consumer VR from the last few years. Oculus DK1, DK2, and CV1, Vive, PSVR, and cardboard. I want to say that Vive is by far the best experience, but I don't think that you're going to get ruined by trying the PSVR first, especially not if you have a bit of imagination/ability to dream about what the technology will become. Even back in the DK1 days, it was very very clear that this was going to be an incredible technology, and I think the PSVR is better than that was.
jasonlotito 10y ago
I have both the Rift and PSVR. I'm happy to have both. Of the two, Rift is technically superior, but not enough that I feel like the PSVR is a let down. In fact, the PSVR is much more comfortable than the Rift, hands down. If you already have a PS4, and want to get into VR, the PSVR is a solid choice.

camus2 10y ago

Well, in order for VR to be successful you ACTUALLY need good VR games. It seems Resident Evil 7 got a fair amount of positive reviews. I believe the VR mode for that game is currently supported only on PS4.

esturk 10y ago
Yes, there's a 1 year exclusive until it goes to PC.
iamdave 10y ago
Eve Valkyrie is also a full game worth talking about. Well, kind-of full. You don't get that "here's 30 minutes of an experience, now back to the start you go"; the multiplayer aspect of the game is amazing, but single player could have used a bit more attention. Overall though, the immersion, the unique control scheme for space dogfighting, upgrading and improving your ships, it's doing a VERY good job holding me over until the PS4 port of Elite Dangerous comes out.
- rocky1138 10y ago
  Eve Valkyrie is good but without supersampling it is hard to see ships at a great distance away due to the screen-door effect. Alas, I've got only a GTX 970 graphics card, so supersampling is out for me.
mordant 10y ago
VR must be wireless in order to be successful.
- jobigoud 10y ago
  This is solved and will start being implemented in headsets in the next few years, this year as an add-on. See the first to market here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z-CWz8nAFgs https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z-CWz8nAFgs

avar 10y ago

The reason I'm not buying the PSRV is that it's really hard to figure out if it'll even work for me vis-a-vis the tracking camera. I have a projector setup, so the PSRV camera has some propriterary cable running to it that I'd need to buy a third-party extension cord for, and who knows if that'll work. Even if I have that I can't find any information on Sony's site about where it's acceptable to mount the camera relative to where you're standing. Is it only OK if it's directly in front of you, how about at a 45° incline etc? Then, if I get all of that right I don't have a lot of floor space in front of the projector (maybe 2x2 meters), they don't say how far you're expected to move around in the games you can buy.

iamdave 10y ago
how about at a 45° incline etc? It works. I have mine on my mounted tv, which sits roughly at that angle from where my seat is. The PS Camera can tilt and swivel down so it doesn't need directly parallel vision. Edit: The biggest knock I have (and this might be a problem with Occulus and Vive but I don't own either to know) is the issue of screen drift. Some games - like Eve Valkyrie - switch from a 2D/flat loading screen to fully rendered 3D environments.In those loading areas I may pull off the headset to check my phone or take a sip of water, put it back on and have to reorient the screen. It's not a burdensome task to adjust, just press and hold options and it pops back into place. It's also not a terrible amount of drift that it impacts gameplay, but it is something I've noticed occurring with a frequency that's a little nagging.

jxcole 10y ago

There is a known strategy in politics to intentionally book rooms for speeches that are too small for the number of people who will show up. That way the next day the newspapers will talk about how people were standing in the aisles just to see the politician. You have to wonder whether Sony is using the same strategy to generate more long term interest in a product that was "sold out" and "scarce".

AlphaSite 10y ago
A million sold is a lot for a $300 peripheral.
- SeanBoocock 10y ago
  $400 actually. Also most(?) people probably had to buy the $500 bundle as PSVR requires a Sony Playstation camera to function and many games utilize the bundled Move controllers as input devices.
- haydenlee 10y ago
  A million sold is a lot for a $300 gen 1 peripheral without a proven content lineup.
- MegaButts 10y ago
  It's enough to make me think it could go either way, but I still think VR will grow slowly over a period of several years before finding its niche in the market. To put things in perspective, Microsoft sold tens of millions of Kinect devices before abandoning it - within the first 60 days they had sold 8 million. http://www.businessinsider.com/why-microsoft-xbox-kinect-didnt-take-off-2015-9 http://www.businessinsider.com/why-microsoft-xbox-kinect-did...
- kabdib 10y ago
  Sheer quantity shipped is not a guarantee that a platform will be viable. The Kinect sold ten or twelve million in the first couple of months. (That may have been the number manufactured, but it still sold in the many-millions on launch). That didn't help it succeed. There are a bunch of reasons why it didn't, and why it was eventually all but deprecated from the Xbox One. I believe that user interaction design driven by management-imposed ideology, rather than user testing, was a big factor.

danso 10y ago

I bought PSVR last year and have purchased most of the games that have come out since. I've never used the other VR systems so don't know how PSVR compares, nor have I ever owned a HD TV (I play off a monitor) so the low-res doesn't deeply bother me. But the truth is is that while there are great experiences, there aren't many great games. By great experiences, I mean, games that make you go "Wow" for the first 10 minutes, but after you've completed the game, there's not much reason to go back. The VR games aren't often designed with replayability or player freedom in mind. This coupled with the fact that putting on the headset is substantially more work than just picking up a controller means I've barely used the VR setup compared to just playing regular PS4 games. Maybe things will change after the popular success of Resident Evil 7. But the problem with RE7 is that a pants-shitting experience is not the gaming for everyone. I don't blame developers in general for not putting the effort in making great, polished VR games -- the audience just isn't there in comparison to the 50 million PS4 systems in general. For PSVR to become truly successful, Sony had to throw money at developers to make games that will be loss leaders at first. Right now, PSVR is mostly shovelware and ports from other VR platforms. One of only developers to build a AAA-game for PSVR, RIGS, was supported by and then shut down by Sony [0]. I don't have a lot of faith that VR won't go down the route of PSMove, PS Camera, Xbox's Kinect, and other such unsupported peripherals. edit: A couple of other things to point out. I haven't used Rift or Vive but the general consensus is that PSVR tracking is inferior. That has to be another disincentive for developers to make distinctive, polished games. Right now, the most fun VR game is Fruit Ninja, but that allows for sloppy tracking and is a fairly simple game. The challenge of translating player gestures, and also not making the player super-sick, are the kind of challenges that require first-party support/investment by Sony...third-party indie developers can't do it on their own. All that said, for games that can be played fully as either VR or non-VR -- this includes RE7, Rez, and Bound -- the VR experience is so much more superior that you can't imagine playing the non-VR versions. [0] http://metro.co.uk/2017/01/12/sony-shuts-down-rigs-developer-guerrilla-cambridge-6377707/ http://metro.co.uk/2017/01/12/sony-shuts-down-rigs-developer...

Tiktaalik 10y ago
At a recent earnings announcement Capcom said that RE7 was a big VR success and they were going to focus more on VR in the future. Hopefully other large games companies have noticed how well RE7 VR is doing and will give the platform a deeper look. Personally I've been very impressed with RE7 in VR and it does feel like the "killer app" that VR has needed to create consumer excitement for the medium, at least for hardcore gamers. You're right that horror isn't going to appeal to everyone, though Capcom has a deep library of IPs and constantly creates new IPs. I think they have the ability to create a deep, AAA, VR experience for a wider hardcore gamer audience.

donum 10y ago

Reading the comments I realized there are currently three main issues: 1. VR costs a lot 2. The technology needs to be better (higher resolution) 3. There's not a lot of VR content available yet. Two weeks ago, Gabe Newell and his SteamVR team talked openly about these issues in an interview. [1] They say: - The price will go down and the tech will become better. He said VR will be a new reason for CPU/GPU manufacturers to up their game again. (2018/2019) - Valve is currently making three different full VR games (2017/2018) - There should be an open VR standard [1] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kMpQWSqQFK0 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kMpQWSqQFK0

stephengillie 10y ago
VR needs a GoldenEye moment. VR needs the kind of revolutionary blockbuster that Doom was, to make people sit up and take notice. Something that really pushes the possibilities of the technology, and pushes us into a new era of gaming, the way FarCry pushed the limits of video technology. Instead, it's not quite getting dumped in the sand the way Atari dumped ET in 1982, but it's not far off - major supporters are giving half-hearted statements, and the biggest application I've heard about receiving VR investment is a desktop replacement - not exactly something from which I'd expect a compelling VR experience. So far, my most mind-blowing VR experience has merely been Google Earth. Where are the Wii-game clones? Where are the DDR-clones and, like, retro arcades? Where are the games that have co-op in the same space? Why can't you invite your friends into your Google Earth, to look at the same scenes? We're roughly a year out, with multiple platforms, and almost every game is still a tech demo. Where are the news reports of people breaking their TV with their Vive-mote? - Nobody has been so preoccupied with a VR game that that they flung the controller into the TV yet. I'm worried that investors were so preoccupied with whether or not they could make money off of this, that they didn't stop to think if they should make it fun. How many consoles have successfully gone their first year without a compelling release, and later recovered?
- jclardy 10y ago
  It is really a chicken and egg problem. We need more affordable hardware to create a market for the software, but to create the software we need that market to already exist. The only real solution is for the VR hardware manufacturers to invest in development of software until they get something good. I own a vive and there are some really cool experiences, but in my library of games there is not really anything that i'm itching to come back to. It mostly just sits put away till something new releases, or I want to show it to a friend. Further complicating the issue is the hardware split. Vive/Oculus can somewhat share things if you are dedicated and willing to accept poor control schemes, but PSVR is out on its own. Then you get into the whole seated/roomscale issue, and things like motion sickness from locomotion and you find that it is really hard to develop something that can apply to a large population right now.

DigitalSea 10y ago

I got the PSVR as a day one pre-order. I was so excited, I preordered months before its release (when they first announced it). I had it for 2.5 months and then I sold it. It was cool at first, but the technology just isn't quite there. The limiting depth of field, limited choice of decent games (Rush of Blood was great) and Wii style graphics for a few of the experiences (especially Playstation VR Worlds). It's a fun platform, but it definitely has the gimick aspect to it. I've experienced Oculus Rift, HTC Vive, Gear VR and PSVR. In all honesty, nothing has really wowed me just yet. I believe we'll need 4k VR for the technology to truly take it up a notch, it's getting there. My favourite is definitely the Vive, just peripherials and the resolution is great. No doubt, the PSVR 2.0 is going to be amazing and I will buy that again.

supercoder 10y ago
I dunno, the games get better every week with the PSVR. Sure they were a bit thin on the ground to start with, but now there's something new to play quite regularly .
bitwize 10y ago
Rez Infinite -- alone -- easily justified the multi-hectobuck asking price of PSVR. If you didn't try it, man did you miss out. One of the things about Rez is that it's an update of a 2001 Dreamcast and PS2 game. The simpler graphics mean that head tracking in the VR version is very close to perfect, even on a first-gen PS4. I noticed judder in the head tracking when I was at the system menu in "virtual screen in front of you" mode; there was none in Rez Infinite, even in full VR in Area X.
psyc 10y ago
I have a PSVR and I think it's simply amazing. Room scale and better visuals will be great, sure. But PSVR as it is today is already what I've been waiting 25 years for.
- musha68k 10y ago
  Same here :) I've extended experience with all major VR headsets and I actually prefer the PSVR because of Sony's top-notch vertical integration. That said, I get the general criticism for the current state in VR ("low" resolution yadda yadda) and PSVR in particular (lack of full room control / limited motion tracking yadda yadda). I really don't mind as presence works across the board today and I actually love the "subtractive" design and simple controller based experiences of most PSVR titles. In any case, even with the most high-end graphics card on a 4K+ display and the most ambitious titles, games still look very far from photo realistic (ask any non gamer to watch you play and evaluate). It will take us still a very long time to get to that somewhat questionable goal, especially in VR where all those "shortcomings" get even more pronounced. We will probably need completely new paradigms in game development as well as whole new classes of technology in general. So, it's still called "playing" right? Let's continue using our imagination while enjoying the most creative efforts of our time in ever more engaging ways. REZ and BattleZone VR alone.. my 14 year old me still can't believe that this exists and is available for normal people for essentially a summer holiday amount of work :O All that considered, VR clearly is not for everyone. Many people can't get used to it for lots of reasons. One should also always get enough sleep and take breaks even when accustomed to VR – it is taxing. Another reason why I prefer more "simple" arcade style experiences actually, 20 min bouts of highly enjoyable escapism after which I get back to real life yay ;)

karmakaze 10y ago

I had trouble taking the article seriously when it repeatedly called the PSVR premium, coming off like a PR piece. It's strictly on the mainstream/low-end. Also, it didn't mention how much of the sales were in Japan other than to say 'especially', which doesn't often reflect reception elsewhere.

supercoder 10y ago
Premium when compared to those stupid bits of cardboard you put your phone in.

skywhopper 10y ago

They compare sales to the iPhone's first three months which they call a huge feat, but at the time iPhone sales were actually considered somewhat lackluster until Apple switched to standard subsidy pricing. Only then did the iPhone become a phenomenon. A million units in four months is still impressive, but please get the historical references right.

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musha68k 10y ago
The iPhone was a general "internet" device and a "phone" and the PSVR is a "video game" — nytimes is comparing apples with oranges ;)
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greggman 10y ago

Apparently people have managed to get PSVR to work with Windows and OSX even going so far as to get a few Oculus games to run http://vrheads.com/do-you-really-need-ps4-playstation-vr http://vrheads.com/do-you-really-need-ps4-playstation-vr I've been trying to get one since they shipped in October. I'm in Japan. They have a raffle every 2 weeks or so to decide who gets to buy them at list price.

partiallypro 10y ago

I'd like to see the usage numbers. Ownership is great for Sony, this generation, but on the next? I'm thinking of Kinect when I hear this. Kinect broke records on the 360 for sales. Once the Xbox One was launched, with the Kinect bundled (which was reasonable seeing as the Kinect v1 sales were amazing), people scoffed. I honestly don't think VR is going to be where it needs to be for a while. It's going to be great for therapeutic uses, but for general consumers, I am just not convinced that it's more than a gimmick item you show to your friends but never really use much. There will be exceptions, but I think usage numbers would back me up.

musha68k 10y ago
Have you tried PSVR yourself? If so, which games?

exabrial 10y ago

I would be happy if we [USA] never bought another drop of oil from the middle east until they learn a few lessons about human rights. And actually, exploitation of domestic resources has dramatically reduced our dependency on foreign oil. /Firey opinion off, apologies

hamandcheese 10y ago
I believe you are in the wrong thread :)
- exabrial 10y ago
  Yes, I was replying to Saudi oil? How on earth
- deleted 10y ago
  [deleted]

timothycrosley 10y ago

Personally, I think the biggest problem with VR is that it's downright dangerous. I tried a professionally setup and monitored demo of HTC vive inside of a Microsoft store, and walked into the wall. They needed somebody with you to help make sure you didn't get tangled in the wires - during a 15 minute demo! And people still did, repeatedly. Until there aren't cords and something like the Omni treadmill comes around to handle movement without physically moving - I just think it's not practical or safe as a technology for games other then flight and driving simulators.

robertfw 10y ago
If you walked into a wall, they must not have had the chaperone settings setup properly, either miscalibrated or not appearing brightly enough. I have a 2.5m x 2.5m space, with walls an inch or so past the edge of the space on two sides. There's only been a small handful of hits, and those were mostly at the beginning. My experience, both for myself and watching my friends try things out, is that the wire is annoying, but it's not dangerous. I think part of the problem here could be that it's best to play without shoes on - it's easier to tell when you are standing on the cord, which is when you can get the most tangled up. Obviously people are not taking their shoes off for store demos. Wireless is definitely going to be a massive improvement, but I think saying it is dangerous is a bit of a stretch.
- timothycrosley 10y ago
  I could def see being shoeless helping things out. However, by definition most of these VR systems are wired into a computer on or near desk. I could easily see someone tangle and then trip over the wire and then hit their head on the desk.
  - timothycrosley 10y ago
    In fact, just google "VR Injuries" and you'll see way more examples then say happened with the nintendo wii, pre strap, a change they made because they concluded without it the wii was too dangerous and lawsuit prone. The original wii has nothing on current state VR. If it became any where near as widespread as the wii did with it's current implementation, there would certainly be a few more entries to the Darwin awards...

wenbert 10y ago

Is it just me or is VR involves a lot unnecessary effort for the user? ie: I don't want to walk around. I want to sit comfortably without straining my arm or walking into walls.

musha68k 10y ago
That's actually why I love the PSVR – I prefer the haptics and general setup of traditional video/computer gaming. Still, I also love the VIVE for what it could do in terms of creativity / productivity applications.
lebek 10y ago
For non-games I agree. I'm working on a VR design tool and I've given myself the constraint that user are sitting in a swivel chair with elbows on armrests most of the time. I'm hoping that it'll give enough room to do interesting stuff without straying too far from keyboard-level laziness. For games, I've been playing VR archery since I got the Vive almost a year ago and I still love it. It is tiring but so are traditional sports and people do those.
rocky1138 10y ago
Are you saying there's no hope for my gardening simulator?

dghughes 10y ago

I remember the 3D VFX in the 1990s and thinking that in a few years it will be cheap and everywhere. Nope.

cdevs 10y ago

I have it , it's awesome BUT...it's pretty exhausting to use - like once a week. Resolution is low but then again there are these holy cow this is amazing get lost in what your seeing because of the depth of certain things and the awesome head tracking. Definitely needs more content I check every week for some new experience no matter how small.

jcoffland 10y ago

Humans finally get inexpensive VR and what's the first popular VR experience? A game where you kill other humans with guns. Oh we're going to be fine, just fine.

kleiba 10y ago

That actually surprises me as well. I would have thought that VR was going to be like 3D-TV: hyped very much for a certain amount of time but then mostly forgotten again. And I'm still not sure VR won't go down the same route.

godzillabrennus 10y ago
I thought that till I tried it. The experience is impressive, not at all like the gimmicky 3D TV.
- kleiba 10y ago
  My skepticism mostly comes from reflecting on how I'm currently experiencing video games most of the time: together with a friend, sitting on the couch in front of the TV in the living room. This is a social setting: when we play a game together, we don't just look at the screen, we talk to each, look at each other, get up and get a drink from the kitchen, etc. And most often, we spend a few hours doing exactly that. I know that not everyone shares my feeling, but somehow I have troubles imagining doing the same with VR headsets on. I don't really want to be completely removed from this social setting, completely emerged in the VR environment -- I want both, plus the ability to switch between them quickly. Don't get me wrong, I think VR is a super cool technology. My point is that I just don't think it plays well with the social setting of a bunch of buddies hanging out together.

rrajdev 10y ago

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