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That's the exact opposite of a cynical attitude. It's the attitude I hope all the participants will have. If everyone receiving BI are not trying to make someth

That's the exact opposite of a cynical attitude. It's the attitude I hope all the participants will have. If everyone receiving BI are not trying to make something better out of their lives, then UBI is no better at helping the poor then any other charity -- the old give a man a fish thing. No US citizen in California really has to worry about starving to death. They do have to worry about losing their benefits, and in some cases having to retroactively pay them back. I have my doubts about UBI, though. I lived in a poor neighborhood in Las Vegas. About a quarter of the residents were drug addicts, and living among them were the drug dealers. They all were on public assistance, and spent most of their time trying to steal anything they could from the people and shops around them. Ever wonder why so many poor people vote Republican? This is it. People there were afraid to leave their homes at night and the hope was a Republican government would clean up their neighborhood for them. But I digress...

marmot777 10y ago
Your concern is the moral hazard. What if automation and other changes make impossible to find jobs for everyone, a massive challenge already, maybe already impossible? And if everyone's included there doesn't need to be resentment as bob down the street isn't getting something you are not getting, right?
marmot777 10y ago
So no basic income just let them steal everything they need? If you're suggesting that everyone can just get a job, the idea is that we are moving toward a time when there simply won't be enough jobs to go around. By the time this program is ready for prime time if it is ever is, that gap between available work and people might be well underway. This in addition to how many people are ready for retirement? There are a lot of trends coming together that could generate the perfect storm that drops us into to utter dystopian chaos. I've probably spent way too much time on this thread today but this is the most hopeful thing I've seen a while. The news every day is relentlessly negative sometimes horrific. I don't think this idea would turn that neighborhood you lived in into a utopia, either.
skybrian 10y ago
Consider that if basic income isn't tied to a job, it makes it that much easier to move away from such places. (For example, look at all the retirees living in Florida.)

marmot777 10y ago

Your concern is the moral hazard. What if automation and other changes make impossible to find jobs for everyone, a massive challenge already, maybe already impossible? And if everyone's included there doesn't need to be resentment as bob down the street isn't getting something you are not getting, right?

marmot777 10y ago

So no basic income just let them steal everything they need? If you're suggesting that everyone can just get a job, the idea is that we are moving toward a time when there simply won't be enough jobs to go around. By the time this program is ready for prime time if it is ever is, that gap between available work and people might be well underway. This in addition to how many people are ready for retirement? There are a lot of trends coming together that could generate the perfect storm that drops us into to utter dystopian chaos. I've probably spent way too much time on this thread today but this is the most hopeful thing I've seen a while. The news every day is relentlessly negative sometimes horrific. I don't think this idea would turn that neighborhood you lived in into a utopia, either.

skybrian 10y ago

Consider that if basic income isn't tied to a job, it makes it that much easier to move away from such places. (For example, look at all the retirees living in Florida.)