8 ms·

People who eat 10 portions of fruit and vegetables a day

87 points by Mz 10y ago

M_Grey 10y ago
The people saying it isn't hard are right... it really isn't. What's hard is leaving everything you should be doing for the end of the day, then trying to cram in a whole head of broccoli with dinner. That said, fruit is delicious and nutritious... very nutritious. You have to think about any family risk of diabetes, and frankly think about the long-term health of your teeth. That said, 10 portions seems like moderation to me, assuming good dental hygiene. Edit: Oh, and if you're eating that kind of thing, it helps not to eat too much high-salt, high-sugar foods along with them. It's like... trying to look for a rainbow under a floodlight.
- dingleberry 10y ago
  Yudkin mentioned about dental hygiene in his book Pure, White and Deadly: The Problem of Sugar (1972) it's the form of sugar that matters. the sticky (think twinkie) sugar does more damage because it sticks to cavities, fueling bacteria producing acid. the stickiest, the sweetest fruit i can think of is fried dates. banana comes close. but fruits don't even compare to twinkie, so don't worry too much about it. chewing fibrous non-sweet veg should be enough to 'brush' teeth naturally. of course brushing your teeth won't hurt
  - stagbeetle 10y ago
    > chewing fibrous non-sweet veg should be enough to 'brush' teeth naturally Side-to-side, maybe. Check out Miswak, it's an alternative to the toothbrush + toothpaste combo.
    - contingencies 10y ago
      Check out Miswak Hey wow that looks pretty cool, I tried some Indian neem toothpaste before which wasn't bad, but I've never heard of this and am curious to try. Should be a fun shopping mission in Soi Arab on my next trip to Bangkok...
    - M_Grey 10y ago
      A Kuwaiti friend introduced me to miswak... amazing stuff. Hands down, it's the best portable toothbrush I've ever had. At home, in the mornings and at night I still use a Sonicare, but instead of picking my teeth or some other healthy, but unsightly activity, I take a minute out of side to use a miswak. My dentist can't believe how healthy my gums are. The single best thing you can do for oral hygiene, however you go about it, is to clear food out of teeth as soon as possible. Miswak really makes that possible and practical.
    - mrob 10y ago
      I've tried it, and it does clean your teeth effectively, but it's harder to use because the bristles point in the same direction as the handle instead of to the side. It doesn't work any better than a normal toothbrush so unless you're using it for religious reasons I don't see any reason to use it.
      - M_Grey 10y ago
        Few people I've met really worry about their dental hygiene beyond their daily brushing. In that regard, carrying around anything that keeps you engaged in that, is a good thing. In the morning and at night though... it's hard to beat a good modern electric brush.
- DanBC 10y ago
  > then trying to cram in a whole head of broccoli with dinner Two broccoli spears would be one portion. http://www.nhs.uk/Livewell/5ADAY/Pages/Portionsizes.aspx http://www.nhs.uk/Livewell/5ADAY/Pages/Portionsizes.aspx
  - M_Grey 10y ago
    I think you missed my point, which was that it's hard when you have to leave all of your portions for one meal, and of only one thing. https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/564x/8e/9b/d3/8e9bd3ee1992a6aeac590fcad5f9ac8a.jpg https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/564x/8e/9b/d3/8e9bd3ee1... I don't want 10 of those with dinner, do you?
    - DanBC 10y ago
      No one is suggesting you eat 10 portions of the same thing for one meal, or even in one day. That would be fucking stupid. What on earth makes you think that's what's being suggested? All the 5 a day / 10 a day guidance is very very clear: eat a wide range of different things.
      - M_Grey 10y ago
        You're right that no one is suggesting that, including me. "That would be fucking stupid." Yes, and I'm sorry that you've seemingly come to expect that level of stupidity from others, but in my world that moment is a cue to re-read the context.
        DanBC 10y ago
        Help me out. Your first post doesn't seem to be saying what I think it's saying. What did you mean? Specifically, why mention cramming a whole head of broccali into a meal?
        M_Grey 10y ago
        "The people saying it isn't hard are right... it really isn't. What's hard is leaving everything you should be doing for the end of the day, then trying to cram in a whole head of broccoli with dinner." I'm saying it isn't hard to eat 10 servings a day, what's hard (and by implication what people who think it's hard are often doing in some form) is cramming their servings in at the end of the day, and from one source. I was marveling at how that would throw anyone off.
bryanlarsen 10y ago
It's really not that hard, a "portion" is quite a bit smaller than you think it is. For instance, a large apple is 3 portions.
- hourislate 10y ago
  I read somewhere that over the last 50 years or so an average apple has grown 2 to 3 times in size and sweetness and like you mentioned a large apple is 3 portions. We can be sure that other fruits and vegetables have also grown in size. So today having a serving of fruit could very well be 3 times the size of a serving of fruit was 50 years ago. Know wonder people eat healthy/well and still gain weight.
- 1wd 10y ago
  That terminology really seems more confusing and misleading than helpful then. Also this usage of "portion" kind of conflicts with the usage in advice about "smaller portion size". https://www.cdc.gov/healthyweight/healthy_eating/portion_size.html https://www.cdc.gov/healthyweight/healthy_eating/portion_siz...
  - DanBC 10y ago
    Here's what the UK means when it talks about portion size. http://www.nhs.uk/Livewell/5ADAY/Pages/Portionsizes.aspx http://www.nhs.uk/Livewell/5ADAY/Pages/Portionsizes.aspx > Small-sized fresh fruit > One portion is two or more small fruit, for example two plums, two satsumas, two kiwi fruit, three apricots, six lychees, seven strawberries or 14 cherries. > Medium-sized fresh fruit > One portion is one piece of fruit, such as one apple, banana, pear, orange or nectarine. > Large fresh fruit > One portion is half a grapefruit, one slice of papaya, one slice of melon (5cm slice), one large slice of pineapple or two slices of mango (5cm slices). Note that this is for fresh fruit, and definitely not juices or smoothies. > Unsweetened 100% fruit juice, vegetable juice and smoothies can only ever count as a maximum of one portion of your 5 A DAY. > For example, if you have two glasses of fruit juice and a smoothie in one day, that still only counts as one portion. A rough rule of thumb: one portion is what fits in a cupped hand.
DeBraid 10y ago
Plant-based food list I've compiled: https://github.com/DeBraid/medicine/blob/master/plant-based-diet.md https://github.com/DeBraid/medicine/blob/master/plant-based-... Nutrient density per calorie is the magic formula. High nutrient density, high ANDI scores. A good video on the topic of plant-based nutrition https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BZ8dkLYWrw0 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BZ8dkLYWrw0
- Mikeb85 10y ago
  Nice list. Do you have anything that rates vegetables by macros/calories?
  - DeBraid 10y ago
    Here is a list of foods ranked by Aggregate Nutrient Density Index (ANDI, aka nutrients per calorie). https://github.com/DeBraid/medicine/blob/master/nutrient-calorie-density-scores-ANDI.md https://github.com/DeBraid/medicine/blob/master/nutrient-cal...
    - Mikeb85 10y ago
      Not the answer I asked for. Macros (protein/fat/carbs) per calorie, not an aggregate nutrient score composed of vitamins and minerals.
- projectorlochsa 10y ago
  What does acid forming mean?
  - et-al 10y ago
    Foods cause your body to have a certain reaction. So the idea is that foods cause your body to lower its pH, which goes against our slightly alkaline nature. I think there may be some substance to this, but in general, it's save just to eat a variety of wholesome foods. It's tougher for most Americans to realise this since they're crunched for time, looking for shortcuts, and advertisers are always pushing a new diet or wonderfood every year.
lngnmn 10y ago
Let them run 5 km.
jpalomaki 10y ago
Blendtec. One Apple, one pear, couple of oranges, one kiwi and some green stuff results in a smoothie portion that is easy to drink along with morning coffee. For lunch throw in some cucumber, tomatoes, carrot and peppers and you get a gazpacho (Google for more detailed recipe). No need to do much chopping, just throw the stuff in and let machine do the work.
- orev 10y ago
  Putting stuff in a blender removes one of the primary things that makes them healthy: fiber. Or specifically the digestion of fiber. That's the "work" that makes fruit healthy, because it allows for the slow release of the sugar. Once you smash all the fiber, you're just consuming a sugar bomb with some smashed fiber on the backend. At that point, the sugar rush isn't any different than drinking soda.
  - eddietejeda 10y ago
    Juicing removes fiber but a blender does not impact the fiber content. More info: http://www.nytimes.com/2002/04/23/science/q-a-finer-fiber.html http://www.nytimes.com/2002/04/23/science/q-a-finer-fiber.ht...
    - mrfusion 10y ago
      All they did there was ask a "nutritionist". As far as I know no one has ever done a study to check for intact fiber after blending. That's what I'd need to see.
    - orev 10y ago
      It does not remove the fiber but it changes the structure. The natural structure is like a balloon with good stuff inside. The digestion process breaks down those balloons one at a time and liberates the contents. That process slows down the absorption of sugar. Blending pops all of the balloons so you everything can be accessed/absorbed at the same time, leading to sugar spikes, etc...
stagbeetle 10y ago
There are so many things wrong here. > 10 portions of fruit and veg a day You're comparing fruit to vegetables here. Vegetables contain much more flavenoids and micronutrients than fruits (unless you include berries). It's good to replace unhealthy food with a fruit, but health authorities should be wary of allowing fruit consumption to dominate over vegetable consumption (which it mostly certainly will). I'm not pedantic enough to post everything I have wrong with this, but nutritional authorities need to get with the times. Being health-conscious is great, but do not just eat "10 servings of fruit or vegetables" a day. Use a nutrient tracker and make sure you're getting what your body needs, and if needed, supplement everything else.
cylinder 10y ago
I love fruits and vegetables so the only real limiting reagent for me is having enough of them in the fridge. My thoughts: If you live in a seasonal climate, try to eat in tune with the seasons. Subscribe to a farmers co-op or some sort of delivery of a weekly box of whatever produce is being harvested now at a nearby farm. This is when I've had the best success eating lots of vegetables. Especially good value are "ugly" produce boxes of "reject" vegetables that won't make it to supermarkets due to insignificant cosmetic marks. Not a complete solution, as you may end up with too many of a vegetable you don't like / need. Less thinking and decision making is better, and I know I'm getting the fresh stuff, and I will be determined to just use whatever I have since I paid for it. If you have good cooking skills, and maintain "momentum" in cooking often, you will be able to just open your fridge and figure out what to cook based on what you have and how you feel. I find this better and more enjoyable than trying to plan out meals in advance. I find fresh vegetables inspiring. Moreso outside of winter of course. Blendtec or Vitamix grade blender: you can throw pretty much anything in these and it will blend with minimal water added. Allows you to consume a huge amount of vegetables and fruits. Soups: soups are so easy to make. Chop whatever you have, add a bit of chicken broth, water, turmeric, chicken drumsticks (optional), salt, pepper and whatever else you want. Usually you'll at least want carrots, celery, ginger, onion and mushroom. Bring to a boil then leave on low for a couple of hours.
- ppoint 10y ago
  +1 for "reject" fruit and vegetables. We would go to farmer's markets and ask for "seconds", which they usually have in abundance. It's much cheaper, perfectly good and most of the times more ripe/ready to be eaten now, hence very tasty.
- gajjanag 10y ago
  > Bring to a boil then leave on low for a couple of hours. Alternatively, since you mention this above, one can use a Blendtec or Vitamix grade blender to friction-heat the liquid. Apparently this is more energy efficient than microwaving for instance: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=11399036 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=11399036 . Obviously this won't work for soups where one desires very coarse pieces of vegetables; nonetheless I often find the above useful.
selmat 10y ago
Recently, i saw interesting speech about eating habits, by Michael Pollan: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c31cAdYUvT8 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c31cAdYUvT8
wodenokoto 10y ago
How much is 7 million annual premature deaths? I tried googling "Annual premature deaths" to get an idea of how many people die prematurely a year, but it doesn't look like it is a figure that is worked with. The closest I found was that WHO apparently considers the 7 million people who die annually of pollution to be 1/8th of total annual death. So apparently 12.5% of deaths can be avoided if we ate more fruit and vegetables.

87 points by Mz 10y ago

The people saying it isn't hard are right... it really isn't. What's hard is leaving everything you should be doing for the end of the day, then trying to cram in a whole head of broccoli with dinner. That said, fruit is delicious and nutritious... very nutritious. You have to think about any family risk of diabetes, and frankly think about the long-term health of your teeth. That said, 10 portions seems like moderation to me, assuming good dental hygiene. Edit: Oh, and if you're eating that kind of thing, it helps not to eat too much high-salt, high-sugar foods along with them. It's like... trying to look for a rainbow under a floodlight.

dingleberry 10y ago
Yudkin mentioned about dental hygiene in his book Pure, White and Deadly: The Problem of Sugar (1972) it's the form of sugar that matters. the sticky (think twinkie) sugar does more damage because it sticks to cavities, fueling bacteria producing acid. the stickiest, the sweetest fruit i can think of is fried dates. banana comes close. but fruits don't even compare to twinkie, so don't worry too much about it. chewing fibrous non-sweet veg should be enough to 'brush' teeth naturally. of course brushing your teeth won't hurt
- stagbeetle 10y ago
  > chewing fibrous non-sweet veg should be enough to 'brush' teeth naturally Side-to-side, maybe. Check out Miswak, it's an alternative to the toothbrush + toothpaste combo.
  - contingencies 10y ago
    Check out Miswak Hey wow that looks pretty cool, I tried some Indian neem toothpaste before which wasn't bad, but I've never heard of this and am curious to try. Should be a fun shopping mission in Soi Arab on my next trip to Bangkok...
  - M_Grey 10y ago
    A Kuwaiti friend introduced me to miswak... amazing stuff. Hands down, it's the best portable toothbrush I've ever had. At home, in the mornings and at night I still use a Sonicare, but instead of picking my teeth or some other healthy, but unsightly activity, I take a minute out of side to use a miswak. My dentist can't believe how healthy my gums are. The single best thing you can do for oral hygiene, however you go about it, is to clear food out of teeth as soon as possible. Miswak really makes that possible and practical.
  - mrob 10y ago
    I've tried it, and it does clean your teeth effectively, but it's harder to use because the bristles point in the same direction as the handle instead of to the side. It doesn't work any better than a normal toothbrush so unless you're using it for religious reasons I don't see any reason to use it.
    - M_Grey 10y ago
      Few people I've met really worry about their dental hygiene beyond their daily brushing. In that regard, carrying around anything that keeps you engaged in that, is a good thing. In the morning and at night though... it's hard to beat a good modern electric brush.
DanBC 10y ago
> then trying to cram in a whole head of broccoli with dinner Two broccoli spears would be one portion. http://www.nhs.uk/Livewell/5ADAY/Pages/Portionsizes.aspx http://www.nhs.uk/Livewell/5ADAY/Pages/Portionsizes.aspx
- M_Grey 10y ago
  I think you missed my point, which was that it's hard when you have to leave all of your portions for one meal, and of only one thing. https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/564x/8e/9b/d3/8e9bd3ee1992a6aeac590fcad5f9ac8a.jpg https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/564x/8e/9b/d3/8e9bd3ee1... I don't want 10 of those with dinner, do you?
  - DanBC 10y ago
    No one is suggesting you eat 10 portions of the same thing for one meal, or even in one day. That would be fucking stupid. What on earth makes you think that's what's being suggested? All the 5 a day / 10 a day guidance is very very clear: eat a wide range of different things.
    - M_Grey 10y ago
      You're right that no one is suggesting that, including me. "That would be fucking stupid." Yes, and I'm sorry that you've seemingly come to expect that level of stupidity from others, but in my world that moment is a cue to re-read the context.
      - DanBC 10y ago
        Help me out. Your first post doesn't seem to be saying what I think it's saying. What did you mean? Specifically, why mention cramming a whole head of broccali into a meal?
        M_Grey 10y ago
        "The people saying it isn't hard are right... it really isn't. What's hard is leaving everything you should be doing for the end of the day, then trying to cram in a whole head of broccoli with dinner." I'm saying it isn't hard to eat 10 servings a day, what's hard (and by implication what people who think it's hard are often doing in some form) is cramming their servings in at the end of the day, and from one source. I was marveling at how that would throw anyone off.

bryanlarsen 10y ago

It's really not that hard, a "portion" is quite a bit smaller than you think it is. For instance, a large apple is 3 portions.

hourislate 10y ago
I read somewhere that over the last 50 years or so an average apple has grown 2 to 3 times in size and sweetness and like you mentioned a large apple is 3 portions. We can be sure that other fruits and vegetables have also grown in size. So today having a serving of fruit could very well be 3 times the size of a serving of fruit was 50 years ago. Know wonder people eat healthy/well and still gain weight.
1wd 10y ago
That terminology really seems more confusing and misleading than helpful then. Also this usage of "portion" kind of conflicts with the usage in advice about "smaller portion size". https://www.cdc.gov/healthyweight/healthy_eating/portion_size.html https://www.cdc.gov/healthyweight/healthy_eating/portion_siz...
- DanBC 10y ago
  Here's what the UK means when it talks about portion size. http://www.nhs.uk/Livewell/5ADAY/Pages/Portionsizes.aspx http://www.nhs.uk/Livewell/5ADAY/Pages/Portionsizes.aspx > Small-sized fresh fruit > One portion is two or more small fruit, for example two plums, two satsumas, two kiwi fruit, three apricots, six lychees, seven strawberries or 14 cherries. > Medium-sized fresh fruit > One portion is one piece of fruit, such as one apple, banana, pear, orange or nectarine. > Large fresh fruit > One portion is half a grapefruit, one slice of papaya, one slice of melon (5cm slice), one large slice of pineapple or two slices of mango (5cm slices). Note that this is for fresh fruit, and definitely not juices or smoothies. > Unsweetened 100% fruit juice, vegetable juice and smoothies can only ever count as a maximum of one portion of your 5 A DAY. > For example, if you have two glasses of fruit juice and a smoothie in one day, that still only counts as one portion. A rough rule of thumb: one portion is what fits in a cupped hand.

DeBraid 10y ago

Plant-based food list I've compiled: https://github.com/DeBraid/medicine/blob/master/plant-based-diet.md https://github.com/DeBraid/medicine/blob/master/plant-based-... Nutrient density per calorie is the magic formula. High nutrient density, high ANDI scores. A good video on the topic of plant-based nutrition https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BZ8dkLYWrw0 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BZ8dkLYWrw0

Mikeb85 10y ago
Nice list. Do you have anything that rates vegetables by macros/calories?
- DeBraid 10y ago
  Here is a list of foods ranked by Aggregate Nutrient Density Index (ANDI, aka nutrients per calorie). https://github.com/DeBraid/medicine/blob/master/nutrient-calorie-density-scores-ANDI.md https://github.com/DeBraid/medicine/blob/master/nutrient-cal...
  - Mikeb85 10y ago
    Not the answer I asked for. Macros (protein/fat/carbs) per calorie, not an aggregate nutrient score composed of vitamins and minerals.
projectorlochsa 10y ago
What does acid forming mean?
- et-al 10y ago
  Foods cause your body to have a certain reaction. So the idea is that foods cause your body to lower its pH, which goes against our slightly alkaline nature. I think there may be some substance to this, but in general, it's save just to eat a variety of wholesome foods. It's tougher for most Americans to realise this since they're crunched for time, looking for shortcuts, and advertisers are always pushing a new diet or wonderfood every year.

lngnmn 10y ago

Let them run 5 km.

jpalomaki 10y ago

Blendtec. One Apple, one pear, couple of oranges, one kiwi and some green stuff results in a smoothie portion that is easy to drink along with morning coffee. For lunch throw in some cucumber, tomatoes, carrot and peppers and you get a gazpacho (Google for more detailed recipe). No need to do much chopping, just throw the stuff in and let machine do the work.

orev 10y ago
Putting stuff in a blender removes one of the primary things that makes them healthy: fiber. Or specifically the digestion of fiber. That's the "work" that makes fruit healthy, because it allows for the slow release of the sugar. Once you smash all the fiber, you're just consuming a sugar bomb with some smashed fiber on the backend. At that point, the sugar rush isn't any different than drinking soda.
- eddietejeda 10y ago
  Juicing removes fiber but a blender does not impact the fiber content. More info: http://www.nytimes.com/2002/04/23/science/q-a-finer-fiber.html http://www.nytimes.com/2002/04/23/science/q-a-finer-fiber.ht...
  - mrfusion 10y ago
    All they did there was ask a "nutritionist". As far as I know no one has ever done a study to check for intact fiber after blending. That's what I'd need to see.
  - orev 10y ago
    It does not remove the fiber but it changes the structure. The natural structure is like a balloon with good stuff inside. The digestion process breaks down those balloons one at a time and liberates the contents. That process slows down the absorption of sugar. Blending pops all of the balloons so you everything can be accessed/absorbed at the same time, leading to sugar spikes, etc...

stagbeetle 10y ago

There are so many things wrong here. > 10 portions of fruit and veg a day You're comparing fruit to vegetables here. Vegetables contain much more flavenoids and micronutrients than fruits (unless you include berries). It's good to replace unhealthy food with a fruit, but health authorities should be wary of allowing fruit consumption to dominate over vegetable consumption (which it mostly certainly will). I'm not pedantic enough to post everything I have wrong with this, but nutritional authorities need to get with the times. Being health-conscious is great, but do not just eat "10 servings of fruit or vegetables" a day. Use a nutrient tracker and make sure you're getting what your body needs, and if needed, supplement everything else.

cylinder 10y ago

I love fruits and vegetables so the only real limiting reagent for me is having enough of them in the fridge. My thoughts: If you live in a seasonal climate, try to eat in tune with the seasons. Subscribe to a farmers co-op or some sort of delivery of a weekly box of whatever produce is being harvested now at a nearby farm. This is when I've had the best success eating lots of vegetables. Especially good value are "ugly" produce boxes of "reject" vegetables that won't make it to supermarkets due to insignificant cosmetic marks. Not a complete solution, as you may end up with too many of a vegetable you don't like / need. Less thinking and decision making is better, and I know I'm getting the fresh stuff, and I will be determined to just use whatever I have since I paid for it. If you have good cooking skills, and maintain "momentum" in cooking often, you will be able to just open your fridge and figure out what to cook based on what you have and how you feel. I find this better and more enjoyable than trying to plan out meals in advance. I find fresh vegetables inspiring. Moreso outside of winter of course. Blendtec or Vitamix grade blender: you can throw pretty much anything in these and it will blend with minimal water added. Allows you to consume a huge amount of vegetables and fruits. Soups: soups are so easy to make. Chop whatever you have, add a bit of chicken broth, water, turmeric, chicken drumsticks (optional), salt, pepper and whatever else you want. Usually you'll at least want carrots, celery, ginger, onion and mushroom. Bring to a boil then leave on low for a couple of hours.

ppoint 10y ago
+1 for "reject" fruit and vegetables. We would go to farmer's markets and ask for "seconds", which they usually have in abundance. It's much cheaper, perfectly good and most of the times more ripe/ready to be eaten now, hence very tasty.
gajjanag 10y ago
> Bring to a boil then leave on low for a couple of hours. Alternatively, since you mention this above, one can use a Blendtec or Vitamix grade blender to friction-heat the liquid. Apparently this is more energy efficient than microwaving for instance: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=11399036 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=11399036 . Obviously this won't work for soups where one desires very coarse pieces of vegetables; nonetheless I often find the above useful.

selmat 10y ago

Recently, i saw interesting speech about eating habits, by Michael Pollan: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c31cAdYUvT8 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c31cAdYUvT8

wodenokoto 10y ago

How much is 7 million annual premature deaths? I tried googling "Annual premature deaths" to get an idea of how many people die prematurely a year, but it doesn't look like it is a figure that is worked with. The closest I found was that WHO apparently considers the 7 million people who die annually of pollution to be 1/8th of total annual death. So apparently 12.5% of deaths can be avoided if we ate more fruit and vegetables.