7 ms·

> When he married an American woman and could then apply for a green card, he figured with his legal background he’d have no trouble filling out the paperwork h

> When he married an American woman and could then apply for a green card, he figured with his legal background he’d have no trouble filling out the paperwork himself. But the forms were so overly complicated and frustratingly counterintuitive that he gave up and hired an immigration attorney. When I applied for my green card I thought the whole process was pretty simple and straightforward. I do think it might be harder for someone with more complicated circumstances, or who doesn't speak english as a first language. But I do find it surprising how hard many people with (what seem to me to be) simple cases think it is...

tptacek 10y ago
You may not be aware of this, but lawful permanent resident status in the US is based on a quota system by country of origin. Immigrants from Central America can experience wait times for LPR status approaching twenty years. I haven't kept a consistently non-expired drivers license or license plate tag for more than 2 years. But if you screw up any of the procedural details of an LPR application in the US --- for instance, failing to timely notify any time your residence changes for any reason --- the penalty isn't a ticket, but rather the likely forfeiture of your application. So no, the process is not pretty simple and straightforward for a great many applicants.
- matthewowen 10y ago
  As I mentioned in my original comment, I'm sure there are circumstances different from my own that are much more challenging. I can only speak to the experience coming from the UK (and I confess to assuming that the experience from Canada is comparable), and that's where I find surprise: people from the UK who presumably went through the same experience as me often claim that it's impossible to navigate without a lawyer. That's just not true.
  - tptacek 10y ago
    In fact, the overwhelming majority of resident aliens in this country seeking lawful permanent status face far more difficult challenges than you did. I'm not criticizing you, I'm just reporting a fact.
    - matthewowen 10y ago
      > So no, the process is not pretty simple and straightforward for a great many applicants. That read as a snarky criticism of a claim I never made. The fact that you're supplying isn't really a contradiction of or great addition to anything I said in my narrow comment: I explicitly acknowledged it myself. I wouldn't mind that, but it isn't very nice to accompany it with snark and misrepresentation.
      - tptacek 10y ago
        I'm sorry, I'm not seeing the snark, but I'm sorry my comment put you on the defensive.
  - charlesdm 10y ago
    Most people in general just don't have a mind for the law. The people hanging out on this board probably are smart enough to figure it out, given sufficient time and googling.
    - hackuser 10y ago
      Remember that the article says a lawyer from Canada had trouble doing it.
- pvg 10y ago
  The quotas don't apply to applicants who are immediate relatives (e.g. spouses) of US citizens.
- dragonwriter 10y ago
  > You may not be aware of this, but lawful permanent resident status in the US is based on a quota system by country of origin. To expand on this, immigrant visas in most (but not all) categories are actually what is limited; for people that don't get in on a dual intent visa like the H-1B first (i.e., the vast majority of prospective legal immigrants), that means entry is limited on that basis, not the status transition to an LPR from some other legally-present status.
  - ameen 10y ago
    Is an O1 Visa dual intent? Also is there a rough estimate of how long wait times are for different countries of Origin?
    - dragonwriter 10y ago
      > Is an O1 Visa dual intent? Maybe. US immigration law and the implementing regulation is complex and there's some confusing grey areas. This source seems to indicate that O-1 is (or was as of 2011) treated as dual intent in that you can apply for permanent residency while on it, but also seems to indicate that you still need to return to your country of origin rather than transition in place. [0] > Also is there a rough estimate of how long wait times are for different countries of Origin? This might help, though it's technically how long people now being admitted in each category/country have waited from establishing eligibility rather than how long people entering the queue now with wait. [1] [0] http://www.americanlaw.com/dintent.html http://www.americanlaw.com/dintent.html [1] http://www.immihelp.com/visa-bulletin-movement/ http://www.immihelp.com/visa-bulletin-movement/
chrismcb 10y ago
Because it is hard. Harder than it needs to be. Of course it has gotten easier recently. But it is more complicated than it needs to be.

tptacek 10y ago

You may not be aware of this, but lawful permanent resident status in the US is based on a quota system by country of origin. Immigrants from Central America can experience wait times for LPR status approaching twenty years. I haven't kept a consistently non-expired drivers license or license plate tag for more than 2 years. But if you screw up any of the procedural details of an LPR application in the US --- for instance, failing to timely notify any time your residence changes for any reason --- the penalty isn't a ticket, but rather the likely forfeiture of your application. So no, the process is not pretty simple and straightforward for a great many applicants.

matthewowen 10y ago
As I mentioned in my original comment, I'm sure there are circumstances different from my own that are much more challenging. I can only speak to the experience coming from the UK (and I confess to assuming that the experience from Canada is comparable), and that's where I find surprise: people from the UK who presumably went through the same experience as me often claim that it's impossible to navigate without a lawyer. That's just not true.
- tptacek 10y ago
  In fact, the overwhelming majority of resident aliens in this country seeking lawful permanent status face far more difficult challenges than you did. I'm not criticizing you, I'm just reporting a fact.
  - matthewowen 10y ago
    > So no, the process is not pretty simple and straightforward for a great many applicants. That read as a snarky criticism of a claim I never made. The fact that you're supplying isn't really a contradiction of or great addition to anything I said in my narrow comment: I explicitly acknowledged it myself. I wouldn't mind that, but it isn't very nice to accompany it with snark and misrepresentation.
    - tptacek 10y ago
      I'm sorry, I'm not seeing the snark, but I'm sorry my comment put you on the defensive.
- charlesdm 10y ago
  Most people in general just don't have a mind for the law. The people hanging out on this board probably are smart enough to figure it out, given sufficient time and googling.
  - hackuser 10y ago
    Remember that the article says a lawyer from Canada had trouble doing it.
pvg 10y ago
The quotas don't apply to applicants who are immediate relatives (e.g. spouses) of US citizens.
dragonwriter 10y ago
> You may not be aware of this, but lawful permanent resident status in the US is based on a quota system by country of origin. To expand on this, immigrant visas in most (but not all) categories are actually what is limited; for people that don't get in on a dual intent visa like the H-1B first (i.e., the vast majority of prospective legal immigrants), that means entry is limited on that basis, not the status transition to an LPR from some other legally-present status.
- ameen 10y ago
  Is an O1 Visa dual intent? Also is there a rough estimate of how long wait times are for different countries of Origin?
  - dragonwriter 10y ago
    > Is an O1 Visa dual intent? Maybe. US immigration law and the implementing regulation is complex and there's some confusing grey areas. This source seems to indicate that O-1 is (or was as of 2011) treated as dual intent in that you can apply for permanent residency while on it, but also seems to indicate that you still need to return to your country of origin rather than transition in place. [0] > Also is there a rough estimate of how long wait times are for different countries of Origin? This might help, though it's technically how long people now being admitted in each category/country have waited from establishing eligibility rather than how long people entering the queue now with wait. [1] [0] http://www.americanlaw.com/dintent.html http://www.americanlaw.com/dintent.html [1] http://www.immihelp.com/visa-bulletin-movement/ http://www.immihelp.com/visa-bulletin-movement/

chrismcb 10y ago

Because it is hard. Harder than it needs to be. Of course it has gotten easier recently. But it is more complicated than it needs to be.