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> Cloud computing is the mainframe model. It really, really isn't. It shares one characteristic (computation done on behalf of one client by another remote cli

> Cloud computing is the mainframe model. It really, really isn't. It shares one characteristic (computation done on behalf of one client by another remote client), but pretty much nothing else. The need to pigeonhole all developments in terms of historical patterns is just revisionism.

trevyn 10y ago
Computation done on behalf of one client by another (more powerful) remote client, with a timesharing model, is kind of the defining characteristic of both, though. ;)
- jdminhbg 10y ago
  That's not at all the defining characteristic of modern cloud computing; if it were, you would call VR systems (laptop or phone does computation on behalf of video system on your face) "cloud computing." What's different about cloud computing is the persistent connection and availability, combined with the ownership model and the resulting implied scalability.
  - acoard 10y ago
    >persistent connection and availability I can't really comment on the ownership model, but surely a persistent connection and availability is an incremental change.
    - jdminhbg 10y ago
      If always-on-from-everywhere is incremental, then what isn't incremental? Are smart phones an incremental change from desktops?
      - nickpsecurity 10y ago
        If we give you that, they have one breakthrough over mainframes. That makes them "mainframes that are always on from everywhere." Mainframe apps were already doing that with terminal, thin clients, web apps, and so on. It was part of modernization efforts to give workers or customers better access to data or business logic on mainframes by putting better interfaces in front of them. Situation is improved today with cloud stuff but core capability was there.
nickpsecurity 10y ago
Mainframes combined most of the muscle in centralized location for weaker, thin clients (eg terminals) to use remotely. Alleged security and efficiency benefits of centralization with one set of staff handling issues for third parties. The CPU, memory, and I/O was metered with many locations charging departments per use. Used VM/370 to virtualize OS's that could run in parallel for various workloads. Scale up quickly. Later clustering and Sysplex for high availability with multiple datacenters. Specialist packages (aka platforms) for various languages or use cases. Hardware accelerators for I/O, databases, crypto, and so on. Was I just reading a list of benefits and features of modern clouds? Young folks would think so but that was all mainframe stuff from 1960's to 1980's with key hardware & VM tech done by early to mid 70's.
- deleted 10y ago
  [deleted]

trevyn 10y ago

Computation done on behalf of one client by another (more powerful) remote client, with a timesharing model, is kind of the defining characteristic of both, though. ;)

jdminhbg 10y ago
That's not at all the defining characteristic of modern cloud computing; if it were, you would call VR systems (laptop or phone does computation on behalf of video system on your face) "cloud computing." What's different about cloud computing is the persistent connection and availability, combined with the ownership model and the resulting implied scalability.
- acoard 10y ago
  >persistent connection and availability I can't really comment on the ownership model, but surely a persistent connection and availability is an incremental change.
  - jdminhbg 10y ago
    If always-on-from-everywhere is incremental, then what isn't incremental? Are smart phones an incremental change from desktops?
    - nickpsecurity 10y ago
      If we give you that, they have one breakthrough over mainframes. That makes them "mainframes that are always on from everywhere." Mainframe apps were already doing that with terminal, thin clients, web apps, and so on. It was part of modernization efforts to give workers or customers better access to data or business logic on mainframes by putting better interfaces in front of them. Situation is improved today with cloud stuff but core capability was there.

nickpsecurity 10y ago

Mainframes combined most of the muscle in centralized location for weaker, thin clients (eg terminals) to use remotely. Alleged security and efficiency benefits of centralization with one set of staff handling issues for third parties. The CPU, memory, and I/O was metered with many locations charging departments per use. Used VM/370 to virtualize OS's that could run in parallel for various workloads. Scale up quickly. Later clustering and Sysplex for high availability with multiple datacenters. Specialist packages (aka platforms) for various languages or use cases. Hardware accelerators for I/O, databases, crypto, and so on. Was I just reading a list of benefits and features of modern clouds? Young folks would think so but that was all mainframe stuff from 1960's to 1980's with key hardware & VM tech done by early to mid 70's.

deleted 10y ago
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