5 ms·

Froyo looks like a great update, but I'm not clear on why it's the game-changer/straw that breaks the iPhone's back that everybody seems to think it is. Is ther

by rufo 16y ago

Froyo looks like a great update, but I'm not clear on why it's the game-changer/straw that breaks the iPhone's back that everybody seems to think it is. Is there something I'm missing here?

elblanco 16y ago
Simple, look at the feature list for Froyo. All things the iPhone most clearly does not do. Even discounting flash, these things are among the most requested things that people want their iPhones to do: like tethering, wi-fi hotspots, jit, media sync OTA, media streaming OTA, flash 10.1, web app access to the compass and camera, voice to voice language translation, etc. It's not necessarily that it's "better" than the iPhone. It's that it squarely does all of the things that Jobs artificially prevents the iPhone from doing that consumers actually want.
- kaiser 16y ago
  sorry, my iphone tethers since 3.0 (depends on the carrier :) the media sync and streaming sound lie an awesome feature. Considering flash ... I find it sad, that google is actually supporting it. Where is the open standards idea there?? Other than that, I'm happy about the competition. Hopefully makes Apple to include some of this features. Yet, I don't see the UI on Android getting any notable improvements in Froyo :( Maybe I need to play with it, as soon as it's available.
  - detst 16y ago
    > Considering flash ... I find it sad, that google is actually supporting it. Where is the open standards idea there?? That should be my choice as a user. I love open standards but why is it sad that they would support it if users want it? Why should it be up to Google (or Apple)? Shouldn't it ultimately be up to Adobe and me?
    - kaiser 16y ago
      You are right. It's just Google advocates so strongly open standards (check the first 10 min of google i/o keynote)and now they are directly supporting flash in Chrome and Android. imho it's just very inconsistent. I'm still trying to figure out, if I can just compile froyo and put it on our labs google nexus (I would expect that from an open source mobile phone operating system, ... seems not possible from what I see).
  - elblanco 16y ago
    In the U.S. at least, the iPhone does not tether without jailbreaking it.
    - kaiser 16y ago
      yes, but it's not an iphone/apple problem, but a carrier issue. Wouldn't be surprised if you cannot tether with Android mobiles on some carriers.
      - elblanco 16y ago
        You can tether with other phones on AT&T in the U.S. without problem. It's only the iPhone that appears to have the problem.
- KirinDave 16y ago
  Why would the iPhone need to JIT? Everything is native. Did you just get caught up in the listing of features and let that one slip by? P.S., V8 is not, strictly, a jit'ing interpreter; Nitro is. That doesn't necessarily mean SFE/Nitro is better, just that it's more of a classic interpreter and V8 is actually something more akin to ObjC but with compilation happening as soon as the code is available. The tradeoffs involved are beyond the scope of your chastisement.
  - elblanco 16y ago
    That's okay, if you don't care about JIT, the laundry list of other stuff still proves the point.
    - KirinDave 16y ago
      It's not if I care about JIT or not. It's that you put JIT in a list for direct comparison, and it has no business being there.
      - elblanco 16y ago
        Is the new JIT compiler a listed feature of Froyo? Does the iPhone run non-native compiled software?
        KirinDave 16y ago
        Yes. No (or yes and no, depends on how thorough Apple gets about their new TOS). But bikes have infinite gas mikage so they should always be better, right? Or perhaps that's just the wrong axis of comparison.

by rufo 16y ago

Froyo looks like a great update, but I'm not clear on why it's the game-changer/straw that breaks the iPhone's back that everybody seems to think it is. Is there something I'm missing here?

elblanco 16y ago

Simple, look at the feature list for Froyo. All things the iPhone most clearly does not do. Even discounting flash, these things are among the most requested things that people want their iPhones to do: like tethering, wi-fi hotspots, jit, media sync OTA, media streaming OTA, flash 10.1, web app access to the compass and camera, voice to voice language translation, etc. It's not necessarily that it's "better" than the iPhone. It's that it squarely does all of the things that Jobs artificially prevents the iPhone from doing that consumers actually want.

kaiser 16y ago
sorry, my iphone tethers since 3.0 (depends on the carrier :) the media sync and streaming sound lie an awesome feature. Considering flash ... I find it sad, that google is actually supporting it. Where is the open standards idea there?? Other than that, I'm happy about the competition. Hopefully makes Apple to include some of this features. Yet, I don't see the UI on Android getting any notable improvements in Froyo :( Maybe I need to play with it, as soon as it's available.
- detst 16y ago
  > Considering flash ... I find it sad, that google is actually supporting it. Where is the open standards idea there?? That should be my choice as a user. I love open standards but why is it sad that they would support it if users want it? Why should it be up to Google (or Apple)? Shouldn't it ultimately be up to Adobe and me?
  - kaiser 16y ago
    You are right. It's just Google advocates so strongly open standards (check the first 10 min of google i/o keynote)and now they are directly supporting flash in Chrome and Android. imho it's just very inconsistent. I'm still trying to figure out, if I can just compile froyo and put it on our labs google nexus (I would expect that from an open source mobile phone operating system, ... seems not possible from what I see).
- elblanco 16y ago
  In the U.S. at least, the iPhone does not tether without jailbreaking it.
  - kaiser 16y ago
    yes, but it's not an iphone/apple problem, but a carrier issue. Wouldn't be surprised if you cannot tether with Android mobiles on some carriers.
    - elblanco 16y ago
      You can tether with other phones on AT&T in the U.S. without problem. It's only the iPhone that appears to have the problem.
KirinDave 16y ago
Why would the iPhone need to JIT? Everything is native. Did you just get caught up in the listing of features and let that one slip by? P.S., V8 is not, strictly, a jit'ing interpreter; Nitro is. That doesn't necessarily mean SFE/Nitro is better, just that it's more of a classic interpreter and V8 is actually something more akin to ObjC but with compilation happening as soon as the code is available. The tradeoffs involved are beyond the scope of your chastisement.
- elblanco 16y ago
  That's okay, if you don't care about JIT, the laundry list of other stuff still proves the point.
  - KirinDave 16y ago
    It's not if I care about JIT or not. It's that you put JIT in a list for direct comparison, and it has no business being there.
    - elblanco 16y ago
      Is the new JIT compiler a listed feature of Froyo? Does the iPhone run non-native compiled software?
      - KirinDave 16y ago
        Yes. No (or yes and no, depends on how thorough Apple gets about their new TOS). But bikes have infinite gas mikage so they should always be better, right? Or perhaps that's just the wrong axis of comparison.