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I have been, but the current administration's tax proposal looks like it would reduce my tax rate, and in order to make a noticable impact on society as a whole

by ericd 10y ago

I have been, but the current administration's tax proposal looks like it would reduce my tax rate, and in order to make a noticable impact on society as a whole is going to require taxation, people probably aren't suddenly going to get a whole lot more charitable than they have been. Your statement is the equivalent of the oft-stated "every little bit helps". It really doesn't, because it usually serves as a palliative and stops people short of doing the major work that needs to be done. I want the decimation of public education to be reversed, I want us to figure out ways to help our fellow citizens who are hurting economically and psychologically. Massive unevenness in wealth accumulation is a huge problem. This is going to take a society-wide effort to fix, not a few NGOs.

humanrebar 10y ago
I find that political solutions tend to stop at the palliative, especially compared to forming friendships and active engagement with relevant charities. > This is going to take a society-wide effort to fix, not a few NGOs. The difference between our viewpoints is that I don't see the government as the sole or best face of "society". It's merely one option, and often not the best one.
- ericd 10y ago
  That's often the case, but it doesn't have to be. That said, how would you suggest coordinating a large segment of the population to do something if not through government?
  - humanrebar 10y ago
    I think coordination is often overrated compared to removing perverse incentives and instituting healthy ones. Coordination leaves very little room for innovation, for instance. Do we need a coordinated effort to retrain displaced workers? Or do we just need a large and flexible one? Given than flexibility is one of the issues where employers can't keep up with workers, I suspect a less coordinated but more motivated effort sounds better here. Guaranteed minimum income compared to a Smorgasbord of targeted programs is also less coordinated but probably better.
- nikdaheratik 10y ago
  Except that for many people it is simply the only option. Disabled Veterans are employed by government at something like 10x the rate of other employers. Minorities are employed at much higher rates as well. Alot of this is because of the way the civil service hiring works, which is perverse in some ways and highly merit based on others. There are alot of metrics where private enterprise is just plain terrible, and government is the lesser of two evils.
  - humanrebar 10y ago
    I've worked for several big corps who do exactly the same thing WRT minorities and veterans. The best thing for people isn't to give them a patron but a chance to build a good career. So the next time they apply for a job, they're not a statistic but a competitive candidate. If private businesses need help here, let's form groups to work toward that.

by ericd 10y ago

humanrebar 10y ago

I find that political solutions tend to stop at the palliative, especially compared to forming friendships and active engagement with relevant charities. > This is going to take a society-wide effort to fix, not a few NGOs. The difference between our viewpoints is that I don't see the government as the sole or best face of "society". It's merely one option, and often not the best one.

ericd 10y ago
That's often the case, but it doesn't have to be. That said, how would you suggest coordinating a large segment of the population to do something if not through government?
- humanrebar 10y ago
  I think coordination is often overrated compared to removing perverse incentives and instituting healthy ones. Coordination leaves very little room for innovation, for instance. Do we need a coordinated effort to retrain displaced workers? Or do we just need a large and flexible one? Given than flexibility is one of the issues where employers can't keep up with workers, I suspect a less coordinated but more motivated effort sounds better here. Guaranteed minimum income compared to a Smorgasbord of targeted programs is also less coordinated but probably better.
nikdaheratik 10y ago
Except that for many people it is simply the only option. Disabled Veterans are employed by government at something like 10x the rate of other employers. Minorities are employed at much higher rates as well. Alot of this is because of the way the civil service hiring works, which is perverse in some ways and highly merit based on others. There are alot of metrics where private enterprise is just plain terrible, and government is the lesser of two evils.
- humanrebar 10y ago
  I've worked for several big corps who do exactly the same thing WRT minorities and veterans. The best thing for people isn't to give them a patron but a chance to build a good career. So the next time they apply for a job, they're not a statistic but a competitive candidate. If private businesses need help here, let's form groups to work toward that.