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This is exactly what the current top comment (by shklnrj) is talking about, and is one of the major reasons that Trump got elected. darkmouth here is doubling d

This is exactly what the current top comment (by shklnrj) is talking about, and is one of the major reasons that Trump got elected. darkmouth here is doubling down on the exact same strategy that lead many away from liberalism this election cycle.

darkmouth 10y ago
and you're suggesting we shut up and keep quiet when we KNOW we are RIGHT? That is not going to happen. Submitting to tantrums only makes those people get stronger.
- tdkl 10y ago
  Of course you won't, you're screaming, crying, assaulting people and causing damage to property instead.
- Cyphase 10y ago
  Plenty of people who disagree on all sorts of things KNOW they are RIGHT about those things.
- yamaneko 10y ago
  Facing tantrums with tantrums only makes both sides more angry. In general, if I confront someone in a rude way, it is more probable that the other person will get defensive and the discussion derails. Don't get me wrong, it's not about being quiet either, but I think there are better ways of exposing your point of view¹. Before I became more left-aligned, I had to read several articles and listen a lot, but the tone wasn't abrasive as in most discussions. (Sometimes it was and it made me get defensive, but I knew from past experience that maybe I was wrong again, then I had to listen to see their point. After a few days, it clicked and I started understanding it better). Of course, if someone doesn't want to be helped, it's not you who is going to change it. But, I think the 'adversary' is always more compelling to learn if you express it in a sincere way, more neutral/polite instead of attacking. And you will learn too. ¹Just to be clear, I'm talking about discussions on the Internet or in person.
intended 10y ago
This is patently untrue. All this navel gazing in this thread is bizarre and forgets the past 30 years of political history in America. You'll (Americans) have long ceased to have a conversation with each other. People seem to have forgotten the many decades of Fox News (when there was no internet), the steady movement of debate from policy to stuff like "birthers", tea parties, gun boats, creationism, and so on. The larger debate has been going south for decades. Why do you think people weren't violently sick when a person who would count as a boorish Buffoon 20 years ago, became the republican candidate? There never was any debate or meeting in the first place! Today liberals are frightened and incandescently angry. As a result they are turning to the same kind of language and radicalization any group does in such a situation. People aren't going to be going away from liberalism - they're going to be more militantly liberal in order to meet conservative forces.
- dragonwriter 10y ago
  > People seem to have forgotten the many decades of Fox News (when there was no internet), Fox News was founded in 1996; the internet started being publicly popular in 1994-1995 (and had been around for decades earlier); there were not any decades of Fox News when there was no internet.
  - intended 10y ago
    Do note that by internet, I am referring to the current scenario - where the net is the primary source of content for a majority of the population. The period 1996-2006 was extremely different when compared to the last several years. Consumption of media is not the same, and the impact of old media sources is not the same either. ----- I do appreciate the correction. I was wrong and your correction Has helped me recall and revise other facts about the empire built by Fox News and Murdoch. As I recall Fox News is the one which helped make climate change deniers look respectable, and helped build the world we live in today.

darkmouth 10y ago

and you're suggesting we shut up and keep quiet when we KNOW we are RIGHT? That is not going to happen. Submitting to tantrums only makes those people get stronger.

tdkl 10y ago
Of course you won't, you're screaming, crying, assaulting people and causing damage to property instead.
Cyphase 10y ago
Plenty of people who disagree on all sorts of things KNOW they are RIGHT about those things.
yamaneko 10y ago
Facing tantrums with tantrums only makes both sides more angry. In general, if I confront someone in a rude way, it is more probable that the other person will get defensive and the discussion derails. Don't get me wrong, it's not about being quiet either, but I think there are better ways of exposing your point of view¹. Before I became more left-aligned, I had to read several articles and listen a lot, but the tone wasn't abrasive as in most discussions. (Sometimes it was and it made me get defensive, but I knew from past experience that maybe I was wrong again, then I had to listen to see their point. After a few days, it clicked and I started understanding it better). Of course, if someone doesn't want to be helped, it's not you who is going to change it. But, I think the 'adversary' is always more compelling to learn if you express it in a sincere way, more neutral/polite instead of attacking. And you will learn too. ¹Just to be clear, I'm talking about discussions on the Internet or in person.

intended 10y ago

This is patently untrue. All this navel gazing in this thread is bizarre and forgets the past 30 years of political history in America. You'll (Americans) have long ceased to have a conversation with each other. People seem to have forgotten the many decades of Fox News (when there was no internet), the steady movement of debate from policy to stuff like "birthers", tea parties, gun boats, creationism, and so on. The larger debate has been going south for decades. Why do you think people weren't violently sick when a person who would count as a boorish Buffoon 20 years ago, became the republican candidate? There never was any debate or meeting in the first place! Today liberals are frightened and incandescently angry. As a result they are turning to the same kind of language and radicalization any group does in such a situation. People aren't going to be going away from liberalism - they're going to be more militantly liberal in order to meet conservative forces.

dragonwriter 10y ago
> People seem to have forgotten the many decades of Fox News (when there was no internet), Fox News was founded in 1996; the internet started being publicly popular in 1994-1995 (and had been around for decades earlier); there were not any decades of Fox News when there was no internet.
- intended 10y ago
  Do note that by internet, I am referring to the current scenario - where the net is the primary source of content for a majority of the population. The period 1996-2006 was extremely different when compared to the last several years. Consumption of media is not the same, and the impact of old media sources is not the same either. ----- I do appreciate the correction. I was wrong and your correction Has helped me recall and revise other facts about the empire built by Fox News and Murdoch. As I recall Fox News is the one which helped make climate change deniers look respectable, and helped build the world we live in today.