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> Almost everyone I asked was willing to talk to me, but almost none of them wanted me to use their names The fear of losing career opportunities is real. I t
by throwaway713 10y ago
> Almost everyone I asked was willing to talk to me, but almost none of them wanted me to use their names
The fear of losing career opportunities is real. I typically refrain from any political discussion online because of the possibility of it being traced back to me, and on my main HN account (and any accounts linked to my name) I have never posted anything political.
That said, I live in a mid-size city in the South where a lot of people voted for Trump. I think there's a few reasons Hillary lost the election that many on the left haven't grasped yet. The single biggest one is that most people are more focused on the economy than on social issues (with one exception, noted below). Whether this is philosophically a good thing or a bad thing is debatable, but I think it's an accurate assessment that the bulk of voters in the U.S. don't see the issue of transgender rights as important as the ability to get a job. While it may be the case that Hillary had a better economic plan than Trump, the fact that she focused more on social issues than Trump at least gave a better impression that Trump could handle the economy. Bill Clinton warned Hillary's campaign managers about focusing too much on social issues, but they largely ignored him.
I think some of the Trump support is schadenfreude, pure and simple. What Sam mentions in his post about "political correctness" is valid, and while both the left and the right are susceptible to thinking in terms of black and white, I find that the left is much more punitive and vengeful if you don't exactly agree with their position (see the debacle involving Scott Aaronson and feminism). The left is much more likely to conduct online witch hunts against an individual who says something "politically incorrect", which is another source of fear. In addition to that, many on the right get the impression that the left either subtly (or not-so-subtly) thinks they are the more intelligent party. This may be in part due to the left's general command of the media and institutions of higher learning. But Jonathan Haidt (despite being liberal personally) advocates for increasing the number of conservatives in public-facing institutions to get a better variety of viewpoints. For many intelligent people on the right, the intellectualism of the left instead comes across as pseudo-intellectualism (particularly on a website like Quora), where prose is written in a way that "sounds smart" but often only holds up to surface level scrutiny.
When Trump lies, he tends to do so outright in a blatant way. When the media lies, they do so in a much subtler way that is typically discernible only to an expert. (The average person does not have the time, resources, or desire to determine the truth on climate change from primary sources.) Thus a typical right-wing voter cannot be sure of whether the media speaks the truth or not, and because the media leans to the left, the right-wing voter errs on the side of "they are feeding me propaganda, so it's probably not true".
> “He is anti-abortion.” Note: This sentiment came up a lot. A number of people I spoke to said they didn’t care about anything else he did and would always vote for whichever candidate was more anti-abortion.
I think the abortion issue is a much bigger factor than many on the left realize. Sam mentions this in passing, but I think that if Trump and Hillary had the same views on abortion, Hillary would have undoubtedly won the election. In fact, the abortion issue was the main and deciding factor for why I did not vote for Hillary. But I morally don't believe in the idea of "the lesser of two evils" (i.e., a clothespin vote), so I didn't vote for Trump either; I ended up writing in a protest vote.
The abortion issue is philosophically complex — much more than either side gives it credit for. My issue with both the left and the right is that neither side seems to particularly care about actually solving the problem and is more concerned with disparaging the other side "as evil" (anti-choice, anti-life). I find that it is impossible to debate most pro-choice people because they immediately label you as misogynistic. But most of them haven't even heard of the Giubilini and Minerva paper, the sorites paradox, or the violinist argument, so how can they have such a strong view without even really understanding the topic? On the other hand, I don't get the impression that many on the right actually care about abortion either, because if they did, they would support increased access to free birth control (if abortion is really "murder", you would do whatever you could to stop it, right?), they would consider miscarriages to be the leading cause of death (and thus in dire need of medical research funds), and they would look to address the root reasons that people get abortions in the first place rather than just trying to outlaw it.
- khuey 10y ago> but I think that if Trump and Hillary had the same views on abortion, Hillary would have undoubtedly won the election I suspect that the set of voters who would have shifted from Trump to an anti-abortion HRC is smaller than the set of voters who would have defected from a anti-abortion HRC to Jill Stein or stayed home.
- Gargoyle 10y ago> they would consider miscarriages to be the leading cause of death (and thus in dire need of medical research funds) I think you probably could get a fair amount of evangelical support for this. I've never seen the argument made, but I can easily imagine it gaining traction.
- mjevans 10y agoI expect the most extreme anti-abortion candidate to be a lost cause for anyone else. So why not focus strongly on a 'stay out of private bedrooms' and 'women's CHOICE about what to do with their body' instead?