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I think it could also be described as a bait-and-switch. > You think MZ's vision of replacing democratic institutions with facebook is a bad idea? Me too! bec

I think it could also be described as a bait-and-switch. > You think MZ's vision of replacing democratic institutions with facebook is a bad idea? Me too! becomes > Let me point out to you all the ways that MZ's intentions are good. I guess he's really a nice guy and we should trust him to provide a replacement for a failing democracy. Personally, I can't get behind it, no matter how nuanced the rhetorical strategy used to persuade me.

JumpCrisscross 10y ago
It's an articulation of the general versus the specific. He's saying the general idea underpinning Zuckerberg's manifesto is concerning. He's just personally okay given it's specifically Zuckerberg manning the helm. (Separately, he says Facebook is in a good economic position. That's a separate train of thought from the manifesto discussion.)
- monkbent 10y ago
  I have no idea how you guys are getting the impression I'm ok with Zuckerberg's stated goals here. I think I was pretty clear on that point at least!
  - notdonspaulding 10y ago
    You were, I had no trouble picking up on it at least. It seems to me that this battle was really lost several years ago when Google unsuccessfully tried to maintain the ability to "export your social graph" from FB. What's your feeling on how things would have played out differently if at that time FB lost its control over people's social graphs? It seems to me that if you have to legislate a solution here, writing a law that guaranteed you could export your personal data from any company would be a good place to start. What do you think?
  - RodericDay 10y ago
    Are you the author? I'm not saying you're ok with his goals. I'm saying that you seem to be very concerned with not coming off as "one of those anti-FB people", to the degree that it weakens the momentum of your writing a lot. I'm sure other people really like it.
    - L_Rahman 10y ago
      Yes, monkbent is Ben's handle on HN.
  - L_Rahman 10y ago
    I thought so too, especially given that you devoted a considerable chunk of "The Cost of Monopoly" section to explain why you're actually concerned.
  - bjshepard 10y ago
    No, your essay is not very clear, nor convincing. Wechat is much better positioned to do what Zuck wants to do re: social infrastructure. Given the downwards spiral of the US and European economies, a long short on FB seems more propitious.
  - bjshepard 10y ago
    Also Thiel as an obvious hand inside the ZuckPuppet.

JumpCrisscross 10y ago

It's an articulation of the general versus the specific. He's saying the general idea underpinning Zuckerberg's manifesto is concerning. He's just personally okay given it's specifically Zuckerberg manning the helm. (Separately, he says Facebook is in a good economic position. That's a separate train of thought from the manifesto discussion.)

monkbent 10y ago
I have no idea how you guys are getting the impression I'm ok with Zuckerberg's stated goals here. I think I was pretty clear on that point at least!
- notdonspaulding 10y ago
  You were, I had no trouble picking up on it at least. It seems to me that this battle was really lost several years ago when Google unsuccessfully tried to maintain the ability to "export your social graph" from FB. What's your feeling on how things would have played out differently if at that time FB lost its control over people's social graphs? It seems to me that if you have to legislate a solution here, writing a law that guaranteed you could export your personal data from any company would be a good place to start. What do you think?
- RodericDay 10y ago
  Are you the author? I'm not saying you're ok with his goals. I'm saying that you seem to be very concerned with not coming off as "one of those anti-FB people", to the degree that it weakens the momentum of your writing a lot. I'm sure other people really like it.
  - L_Rahman 10y ago
    Yes, monkbent is Ben's handle on HN.
- L_Rahman 10y ago
  I thought so too, especially given that you devoted a considerable chunk of "The Cost of Monopoly" section to explain why you're actually concerned.
- bjshepard 10y ago
  No, your essay is not very clear, nor convincing. Wechat is much better positioned to do what Zuck wants to do re: social infrastructure. Given the downwards spiral of the US and European economies, a long short on FB seems more propitious.
- bjshepard 10y ago
  Also Thiel as an obvious hand inside the ZuckPuppet.