6 ms·

My relatives have this same issue. Uncle owns his own auto shop and has had 20+ people working for him at times, now it's 5. They are always looking for workers

by Balgair 10y ago

My relatives have this same issue. Uncle owns his own auto shop and has had 20+ people working for him at times, now it's 5. They are always looking for workers, but have a very hard time finding 'decent' ones. It's not the pay that is the issue, they are ~10% above market for the area. Its the education and the drugs. They are a 'dry' shop and that means no beer or anything else. Would you want a drunk or oxy-head working on your brakes or transmission? Neither does my Uncle. Lawyers aside, it is really tough to work with a drunk or a tweaker and get them into work on time. They steal things to finance their habits. The education issue is also big. Auto-repair requires a fair bit of math these days and literacy. And I don't mean reading words one at a time, I mean remembering what the start of a sentence was by 10 words in. You have to be fluid in your reading and can't be deciphering what a word is like an Egyptian hieroglyph. Most diagnostics occur via online forums in auto-repair and you have to read and carry out instructions in a timely manner. This is far above most HS grads in that area (reasons are complicated). The hollowing out of these areas of the US is a collective blame. Passing the buck off to ignorant racists masks the real issues of drug policy and education policy that must be solved. We must empathize with the tweakers, the bosses, the racists and the coastal liberals to solve this.

delinka 10y ago
"Would you want a drunk or oxy-head working on your brakes or transmission?" I don't want someone who's inebriated (or withdrawing, or with altered priorities) attempting to do anything where they have to be safety-conscious.
- Balgair 10y ago
  I mean, duh, but most shops aren't dry to begin with. Odds are that your last brake or oil change was done well past any legal limits. Especially if it is a franchised place. Independent and local auto-shops are your best bet for quality service. The franchise places may have 'rules' but they are overlooked usually as the franchise owner has pressure from above. Generally, they get the bottom of the barrel employees that have washed out of the independent shops for being piss-ants. This goes triple for YourMechanic and anything else that smells like Uber-but-for-auto-repair. Those techs are flat-backing on a neighborhood sidewalk in whatever rain or heat there is, likely in huge violation of local ordinances and HOAs, with whatever tools they got in their truck. It's a shit job with big risks that only real addicts and drunks are going to take when they have no other options. Turns out, auto-repair is hard and can't be done without a lift or a pit.
soperj 10y ago
At the same time, would I work at a place that says I can never have a drink? Maybe for a couple years for more money, but not forever.
- CocaKoala 10y ago
  I don't think he's saying that everybody employed by the autoshop needs to be a straightedge teetotaler; he's saying "don't drink or do drugs at work. When you show up to work, you need to be sober and clean".
  - VLM 10y ago
    Actually, no, I work for a giant megacorporation and anyone with access to vehicle keys cannot have any drug record or any drinking related offense for insurance reasons, absolute zero tolerance (except for management employees of course). If a driving privs field circus tech gets an alcohol related offense even on personal time, even not involving a vehicle, they're out a job permanently, ditto anything drug related. At best they can apply for another non-driving position but that never seems to work out. So I find it incredibly likely that a car mechanic driving cars in and out of a service bay and taking test drives after a brake job etc is almost certainly a zero tolerance environment.
    - CocaKoala 10y ago
      It's entirely possible to enjoy some drinks without having drug or alcohol related offenses on your record, though.
    - Balgair 10y ago
      This is more of a small business and as employees are hard enough to find in the first place; drinking off the job is fine. DUIs are not. Heck, knowing my Uncle, I doubt that he'd really care if you smoked pot or whatnot, you just can't get courts involved as then the insurance companies will drop you. For work, it's the addictive drugs that are the real worry. Addicts steal things out of cars, they don't come in because they are on a bender, they show up high, etc. Drunks do this too, but they stay sober for longer. Most people relapse though and then you have to fire them. It happens a lot and for a lot of reasons, but they still have to go. I'll note: my uncle is very much a rarity in auto-repair. If you go into the back room of most auto-shops, you'll find a fridge of Buds or Coors. Guys may have one or two during lunch. Its not that big of a deal typically. Also, Crank gets it's nickname because the Hell's Angels used to hid the meth in the crankshafts of their choppers. Hallucinogens are not common as they don't take the edge off like opioids or booze. Hucking dirty transmissions in 100+ heat while covered in grease and grime is not a good idea for your back. Its a problem, yes, but the US fleet is maintained by guys on god-knows-what and has been since Al Capone's rum runners. Check the writing on your transmission or oil-pan, in yellow grease pen it'll have the initials of the guy that last worked on it, his phone/shop name, and maybe a lewd drawing of him smoking something.
CocaKoala 10y ago
Part of the problem is that the people who are able to show up reliably, clean and sober, to do the work tend to be able to find work that pays better. Sure, your uncle's shop pays ten percent above market wage for the area, but that doesn't mean a lot, because the people he's trying to hire aren't limited to that market. I used to work in a bakery, and my wage went from 9 bucks an hour to 13 within a year of starting; at the time, minimum wage was 7.25. I have absolutely zero doubt that I was making at least ten percent more than the market value for the position I was hired at. A year after I started making 13 dollars an hour, I quit my job and went back to school for computer science, got hired out of school, and now I'm living in California making ~125,000 a year. There's just not enough money in baking to get that kind of salary, even if you own the location.
- VLM 10y ago
  There should be a continuous pool of young kids, in theory. Similar to your story I went from around 2x minimum wage at a grocery store as night shift manager and going to class during the day, to around about 8x doing software stuff, but the school I attended while working night shift hasn't exactly closed. So where's the kids? There should be another CS department senior student making what would now be $15/hr at that store. Note that $15/hr is more than the steelworks pays new hires. If you can show up on time and sober, there's no point in working at a dirty exhausting dangerous loud steelworks for $12/hr if you can boss high school kids around for $15/hr in a suit and tie.
  - Balgair 10y ago
    In CA, minimum wage for a mechanic without tools is 2x the state minimum; that's ~$20/hr now, right? In auto-repair there are no young guns anymore, the High Schools got rid of shop, let alone auto-shop, about 30 years ago. Besides, chicks don't dig grease under the fingernails. Almost no HS grads have the chops to become mechanics, they really need to go to Tech Schools beforehand. Some of those Tech Schools are really bad, but some can be good (Las Modanas in the East Bay). In the end, the pay is shit because the owners can't charge the customers enough. Most shops, like restaurants, close quickly because people won't pay. Also, ~90% of my uncle's business is in credit cards. Pre-2008 it was ~30%. The economy has really never recovered for most people.
dugditches 10y ago
Some of the best and hardest workers I've ever worked with had alcohol and drug problems. It comes down to the individual. These people have problems, and both are pushed by large corporate interests(alcohol culture/companies, pharmaceutical companies/doctors). Should companies take risks on them? Not all of them, no. But they shouldn't simply be passed off as 'drunks' or 'oxy-heads'. There's lots of very smart, honest hard working people out there that suffer from these problems.

by Balgair 10y ago

delinka 10y ago

"Would you want a drunk or oxy-head working on your brakes or transmission?" I don't want someone who's inebriated (or withdrawing, or with altered priorities) attempting to do anything where they have to be safety-conscious.

Balgair 10y ago
I mean, duh, but most shops aren't dry to begin with. Odds are that your last brake or oil change was done well past any legal limits. Especially if it is a franchised place. Independent and local auto-shops are your best bet for quality service. The franchise places may have 'rules' but they are overlooked usually as the franchise owner has pressure from above. Generally, they get the bottom of the barrel employees that have washed out of the independent shops for being piss-ants. This goes triple for YourMechanic and anything else that smells like Uber-but-for-auto-repair. Those techs are flat-backing on a neighborhood sidewalk in whatever rain or heat there is, likely in huge violation of local ordinances and HOAs, with whatever tools they got in their truck. It's a shit job with big risks that only real addicts and drunks are going to take when they have no other options. Turns out, auto-repair is hard and can't be done without a lift or a pit.

soperj 10y ago

At the same time, would I work at a place that says I can never have a drink? Maybe for a couple years for more money, but not forever.

CocaKoala 10y ago
I don't think he's saying that everybody employed by the autoshop needs to be a straightedge teetotaler; he's saying "don't drink or do drugs at work. When you show up to work, you need to be sober and clean".
- VLM 10y ago
  Actually, no, I work for a giant megacorporation and anyone with access to vehicle keys cannot have any drug record or any drinking related offense for insurance reasons, absolute zero tolerance (except for management employees of course). If a driving privs field circus tech gets an alcohol related offense even on personal time, even not involving a vehicle, they're out a job permanently, ditto anything drug related. At best they can apply for another non-driving position but that never seems to work out. So I find it incredibly likely that a car mechanic driving cars in and out of a service bay and taking test drives after a brake job etc is almost certainly a zero tolerance environment.
  - CocaKoala 10y ago
    It's entirely possible to enjoy some drinks without having drug or alcohol related offenses on your record, though.
  - Balgair 10y ago
    This is more of a small business and as employees are hard enough to find in the first place; drinking off the job is fine. DUIs are not. Heck, knowing my Uncle, I doubt that he'd really care if you smoked pot or whatnot, you just can't get courts involved as then the insurance companies will drop you. For work, it's the addictive drugs that are the real worry. Addicts steal things out of cars, they don't come in because they are on a bender, they show up high, etc. Drunks do this too, but they stay sober for longer. Most people relapse though and then you have to fire them. It happens a lot and for a lot of reasons, but they still have to go. I'll note: my uncle is very much a rarity in auto-repair. If you go into the back room of most auto-shops, you'll find a fridge of Buds or Coors. Guys may have one or two during lunch. Its not that big of a deal typically. Also, Crank gets it's nickname because the Hell's Angels used to hid the meth in the crankshafts of their choppers. Hallucinogens are not common as they don't take the edge off like opioids or booze. Hucking dirty transmissions in 100+ heat while covered in grease and grime is not a good idea for your back. Its a problem, yes, but the US fleet is maintained by guys on god-knows-what and has been since Al Capone's rum runners. Check the writing on your transmission or oil-pan, in yellow grease pen it'll have the initials of the guy that last worked on it, his phone/shop name, and maybe a lewd drawing of him smoking something.

CocaKoala 10y ago

Part of the problem is that the people who are able to show up reliably, clean and sober, to do the work tend to be able to find work that pays better. Sure, your uncle's shop pays ten percent above market wage for the area, but that doesn't mean a lot, because the people he's trying to hire aren't limited to that market. I used to work in a bakery, and my wage went from 9 bucks an hour to 13 within a year of starting; at the time, minimum wage was 7.25. I have absolutely zero doubt that I was making at least ten percent more than the market value for the position I was hired at. A year after I started making 13 dollars an hour, I quit my job and went back to school for computer science, got hired out of school, and now I'm living in California making ~125,000 a year. There's just not enough money in baking to get that kind of salary, even if you own the location.

VLM 10y ago
There should be a continuous pool of young kids, in theory. Similar to your story I went from around 2x minimum wage at a grocery store as night shift manager and going to class during the day, to around about 8x doing software stuff, but the school I attended while working night shift hasn't exactly closed. So where's the kids? There should be another CS department senior student making what would now be $15/hr at that store. Note that $15/hr is more than the steelworks pays new hires. If you can show up on time and sober, there's no point in working at a dirty exhausting dangerous loud steelworks for $12/hr if you can boss high school kids around for $15/hr in a suit and tie.
- Balgair 10y ago
  In CA, minimum wage for a mechanic without tools is 2x the state minimum; that's ~$20/hr now, right? In auto-repair there are no young guns anymore, the High Schools got rid of shop, let alone auto-shop, about 30 years ago. Besides, chicks don't dig grease under the fingernails. Almost no HS grads have the chops to become mechanics, they really need to go to Tech Schools beforehand. Some of those Tech Schools are really bad, but some can be good (Las Modanas in the East Bay). In the end, the pay is shit because the owners can't charge the customers enough. Most shops, like restaurants, close quickly because people won't pay. Also, ~90% of my uncle's business is in credit cards. Pre-2008 it was ~30%. The economy has really never recovered for most people.

dugditches 10y ago

Some of the best and hardest workers I've ever worked with had alcohol and drug problems. It comes down to the individual. These people have problems, and both are pushed by large corporate interests(alcohol culture/companies, pharmaceutical companies/doctors). Should companies take risks on them? Not all of them, no. But they shouldn't simply be passed off as 'drunks' or 'oxy-heads'. There's lots of very smart, honest hard working people out there that suffer from these problems.