6 ms·

Google is leapfrogging Apple

69 points by edw519 16y ago

MikeCapone 16y ago
Wasn't Google supposed to announce an encrypted search this week? Whatever happened to that? Anyone has the inside scoop?
- bonecandy 16y ago
  http://arstechnica.com/web/news/2010/05/encrypted-google-search-coming-to-a-browser-near-you.ars http://arstechnica.com/web/news/2010/05/encrypted-google-sea... It's coming
  - sandipc 16y ago
    it's here. (beta) https://www.google.com/ https://www.google.com/
    - kmfrk 16y ago
      I get redirected to the http site. (I use Duck Duck Go---which is encrypted---but I just wanted to let you know.)
      - bbatsell 16y ago
        My guess is that it's being slowly rolled out to some of Google's front-end servers. I'll get the SSL homepage one load, then a few minutes later when I'm round-robinned to a different server, I get redirected to http:// http://.
      - w1ntermute 16y ago
        Must be something on your end, works fine for me: http://i.imgur.com/ssbIT.png http://i.imgur.com/ssbIT.png
      - freetard 16y ago
        Works fine here.
- chaosmachine 16y ago
  It went live a couple hours ago: http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=1368499 http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=1368499
jsz0 16y ago
I think Apple as a very mature company likes the long term strategy. They start with a bang but they also realize Version 2 of a product, at its core, is strikingly similar to Version 10. I don't think they feel pressured to dominate a market probably because their business model doesn't require it. The iPod was a bit of a fluke in that sense. It had a lot more to do with the competition losing than Apple being hell bent on domination. Google on the other hand, like Microsoft in the past, needs to succeed with big volume. More searches, more data collected, more services to serve more advertisements, new places to put advertisements, etc.
- boucher 16y ago
  I think that was a good description of Apple Computer, Inc. Now that we live in the post iPhone world of Apple, Inc., they seem to be behaving quite differently. Their strategy seems dominated by short term market share grabbing in the mobile space, rather than long term product innovation and higher priced products.
  - grinich 16y ago
    * Their strategy seems dominated by short term market share grabbing in the mobile space, rather than long term product innovation...* Even in light of the iPad?
    - grinich 16y ago
      Actually, I've rethought my comment a bit and I agree with you. I see the way Apple is behaving now very akin to the early PC wars, when a bunch of platforms were trying to become the dominant one. These days, the platform war is the tablet form factor, and the iPad is definitely cheaper than anyone really expected. I have yet to see an actual competitor, in terms of price, software, and retail locations. So sure, it's a land grab right now. But I wouldn't confuse that with true product innovation. They're just taking it step-by-step. And I'm sure the iPad still maintains their margins, although it seems cheaper. (my hypothesis as to why it has no camera, cleaning cloth, included slipcase, etc.)
perpetuity 16y ago
The techerati's frothing over new Google announcements is goofy. As if GOOG is some saviour from an indescibable hell. The view from here is already amazing. Everything is amazing and everyone is pissed off. I'm think most of these people cheering and jeering need to spend some time naked, bare assed, with a bone through their nose and then see if this still matters so much to them. And BTW. No, GOOG is not leap frogging. Hyperbole deluxe.
zackola 16y ago
The whole leapfrogging thing implies (to me) that you are not only doing more things than someone, but also doing them better. Yes, FroYo has added a ton of great features to android, however I still feel that Apple has not yet been leapfrogged in the most basic parts of design for core parts today's mobile experience. The most obvious of these to me is text entry via touch screen. There can be no claims of leapfrogging until I can use an android device's touch screen to SMS someone without pulling (what little is left of) my hair out. Next is the whole activity response/switching thing. Yes, blah blah, tradeoffs for multitasking, whatever. Why not have a way to turn off non-system multi-tasking in favor of super lightning quick responsiveness on android? It's enough to almost throw the phone across the room when you are trying to answer the phone and key presses don't register. In terms of industrial design, there have been no great leaps by any of Google's hardware partners - Every single android handset I've used has felt like a cheap, disposable piece of junk (G1, Hero, N1) or a giant tank (Droid) compared to the first generation iPhone. I haven't played with the incredible yet, so I still have hope, but not much. Google and Apple have taken two different approaches to mobile. Google is trying to throw as many different features into android in as short a time as possible, and Apple is set on perfecting each detail before incorporating more. This is fine, it's two different philosophies. After my prolonged experiences with the G1 and the original iPhone, I'd much rather live day to day with software and hardware that has been developed to Apple's design and usability standards. (I'm talking about the system software here, not 3rd party apps) I hope in the coming year Google has a chance to go back and spend time polishing what they've accomplished so far instead of continually heaping feature upon feature onto android. If Google can get back to user interaction basics and stop mucking around with some of their other tangents, they could make android great, not just passable. Or maybe I was just too abused by my time with the G1 to judge this argument fairly anymore, definitely possible.
- moultano 16y ago
  >There can be no claims of leapfrogging until I can use an android device's touch screen to SMS someone without pulling (what little is left of) my hair out. This is almost certainly what you are used to. I haven't had any difficulty with my nexus one. The iphone drove me to insanity everytime I tried to type on it. >Every single android handset I've used has felt like a cheap, disposable piece of junk (G1, Hero, N1) Everyone I know who has seen the nexus one in person found it much more attractive than the iphone. (sampling bias, yadda yadda) >Or maybe I was just too abused by my time with the G1 to judge this argument fairly anymore, definitely possible. That's the only reasonable explanation I can come up with for your post. (I feel your pain on that one. ;)
czhiddy 16y ago
Interesting on how the tone of the Gizmodo article is almost over-the-top pro-Google and anti-Apple. Seems almost like a backlash to the entire Jason Chen/REACT situation.
davidedicillo 16y ago
There are few things that bothers me when people talk about Google taking the lead: 1) They are comparing two different things, an open OS vs an OS tied to one company. 2) Google didn't surpassed anybody. FroYo hasn't been released yet and they are comparing them to a phone that is going to be updated in two weeks. FroYo has tethering, but iPhone has tethering since 3.0, if AT&T doesn't allow it, it isn't Apple's fault. And I'm not sure how free that wireless hotspot will be. FroYo is faster, but nobody knows if faster than OS 4.0 on the new iPhone. They presented wireless sync, but nobody knows if Apple will introduce the same in two weeks. After all, they bought Lala for some reason. Maybe it's just me, but I like to compare shipped products, not demos and announcements.
- tvon 16y ago
  The tethering issue may not be Apple's fault, but that's fairly irrelevant since you can't get the phone with any other carrier in the U.S.. Point being, no matter whose fault it is, the iPhone just doesn't have tethering in the U.S.. Otherwise I tend to agree, there are no devices shipping with Froyo so saying it has surpassed a shipping and soon-to-be-updated product is a bit silly.
  - davidedicillo 16y ago
    The only Android phone that initially will have that functionality won't be available with AT&T nor T-Mobile... And the Nexus One isn't a pentaband phone either.
    - warfangle 16y ago
      Correct me if I'm wrong, but I'll be able to flash froyo to my nexus one, correct? And the nexus one is available on at&t. Ergo, I will be able to tether my phone on at&t. Right?
      - deleted 16y ago
        [deleted]
      - 16y ago
ShabbyDoo 16y ago
What is more remarkable to me than any Apple vs. Google rivalry is how infrequently the press has mentioned Microsoft in articles on the matter. Is it a given that MSFT has gotten so far behind that it won't ever catch up?
- whughes 16y ago
  Palm?
  - warfangle 16y ago
    s/palm/HP Just sayin'. ;-)
  - ShabbyDoo 16y ago
    Yeah. They've been mentioned even less in all of this. Certainly the HP takeover and the quiet surrounding it hasn't helped their PR.
- zweben 16y ago
  I don't know if it's a given that they'll never catch up, but at the moment they're not really relevant in the market, so it makes sense to leave them out. What would the articles say about them? Microsoft may regain relevance in the market when the first version of their new smartphone OS is released months from now? That's about all there is to say.
  - cubicle67 16y ago
    except that WM7 is a subset of iPhone OS features and includes all those that people so dislike on the iPhone (just as controlled, if not more so)
dedward 16y ago
I love all the new android phones I see.... and I like the openness - the hacker in me wants one. But you know - the iphone/ipod Touch - it took me 10 seconds to figure out how that stuff worked. I had to ask my friend to show me how to navigate around his android based phone with all it's buttons and gestures and whatnot...... I can definitely see more possibilities wiht the android - but Apple still has them beet on the Mom test.
cpr 16y ago
Man, how breathless can one article get? Nothing is this simple in real life.
joegaudet 16y ago
Something seems suspect about an article on (ms)nbc claiming that google is now beating apple... Can't quite put my finger on it.
fuminahara 16y ago
Froyo looks really cool, and I would seriously consider the jump from iPhone to Android, but AT&T has such crap android phones. I want a nexus one or a droid! http://listeasy.net/ http://listeasy.net/
- cubicle67 16y ago
  no spammy links please
erikstarck 16y ago
The thing to watch is not the feature list on one phone or platform release but the innovation speed and how fast you can improve the product in a closed environment vs an open one.
ecq 16y ago
The article is from gizmodo.

69 points by edw519 16y ago

Wasn't Google supposed to announce an encrypted search this week? Whatever happened to that? Anyone has the inside scoop?

bonecandy 16y ago
http://arstechnica.com/web/news/2010/05/encrypted-google-search-coming-to-a-browser-near-you.ars http://arstechnica.com/web/news/2010/05/encrypted-google-sea... It's coming
- sandipc 16y ago
  it's here. (beta) https://www.google.com/ https://www.google.com/
  - kmfrk 16y ago
    I get redirected to the http site. (I use Duck Duck Go---which is encrypted---but I just wanted to let you know.)
    - bbatsell 16y ago
      My guess is that it's being slowly rolled out to some of Google's front-end servers. I'll get the SSL homepage one load, then a few minutes later when I'm round-robinned to a different server, I get redirected to http:// http://.
    - w1ntermute 16y ago
      Must be something on your end, works fine for me: http://i.imgur.com/ssbIT.png http://i.imgur.com/ssbIT.png
    - freetard 16y ago
      Works fine here.
chaosmachine 16y ago
It went live a couple hours ago: http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=1368499 http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=1368499

jsz0 16y ago

I think Apple as a very mature company likes the long term strategy. They start with a bang but they also realize Version 2 of a product, at its core, is strikingly similar to Version 10. I don't think they feel pressured to dominate a market probably because their business model doesn't require it. The iPod was a bit of a fluke in that sense. It had a lot more to do with the competition losing than Apple being hell bent on domination. Google on the other hand, like Microsoft in the past, needs to succeed with big volume. More searches, more data collected, more services to serve more advertisements, new places to put advertisements, etc.

boucher 16y ago
I think that was a good description of Apple Computer, Inc. Now that we live in the post iPhone world of Apple, Inc., they seem to be behaving quite differently. Their strategy seems dominated by short term market share grabbing in the mobile space, rather than long term product innovation and higher priced products.
- grinich 16y ago
  * Their strategy seems dominated by short term market share grabbing in the mobile space, rather than long term product innovation...* Even in light of the iPad?
  - grinich 16y ago
    Actually, I've rethought my comment a bit and I agree with you. I see the way Apple is behaving now very akin to the early PC wars, when a bunch of platforms were trying to become the dominant one. These days, the platform war is the tablet form factor, and the iPad is definitely cheaper than anyone really expected. I have yet to see an actual competitor, in terms of price, software, and retail locations. So sure, it's a land grab right now. But I wouldn't confuse that with true product innovation. They're just taking it step-by-step. And I'm sure the iPad still maintains their margins, although it seems cheaper. (my hypothesis as to why it has no camera, cleaning cloth, included slipcase, etc.)

perpetuity 16y ago

The techerati's frothing over new Google announcements is goofy. As if GOOG is some saviour from an indescibable hell. The view from here is already amazing. Everything is amazing and everyone is pissed off. I'm think most of these people cheering and jeering need to spend some time naked, bare assed, with a bone through their nose and then see if this still matters so much to them. And BTW. No, GOOG is not leap frogging. Hyperbole deluxe.

zackola 16y ago

The whole leapfrogging thing implies (to me) that you are not only doing more things than someone, but also doing them better. Yes, FroYo has added a ton of great features to android, however I still feel that Apple has not yet been leapfrogged in the most basic parts of design for core parts today's mobile experience. The most obvious of these to me is text entry via touch screen. There can be no claims of leapfrogging until I can use an android device's touch screen to SMS someone without pulling (what little is left of) my hair out. Next is the whole activity response/switching thing. Yes, blah blah, tradeoffs for multitasking, whatever. Why not have a way to turn off non-system multi-tasking in favor of super lightning quick responsiveness on android? It's enough to almost throw the phone across the room when you are trying to answer the phone and key presses don't register. In terms of industrial design, there have been no great leaps by any of Google's hardware partners - Every single android handset I've used has felt like a cheap, disposable piece of junk (G1, Hero, N1) or a giant tank (Droid) compared to the first generation iPhone. I haven't played with the incredible yet, so I still have hope, but not much. Google and Apple have taken two different approaches to mobile. Google is trying to throw as many different features into android in as short a time as possible, and Apple is set on perfecting each detail before incorporating more. This is fine, it's two different philosophies. After my prolonged experiences with the G1 and the original iPhone, I'd much rather live day to day with software and hardware that has been developed to Apple's design and usability standards. (I'm talking about the system software here, not 3rd party apps) I hope in the coming year Google has a chance to go back and spend time polishing what they've accomplished so far instead of continually heaping feature upon feature onto android. If Google can get back to user interaction basics and stop mucking around with some of their other tangents, they could make android great, not just passable. Or maybe I was just too abused by my time with the G1 to judge this argument fairly anymore, definitely possible.

moultano 16y ago
>There can be no claims of leapfrogging until I can use an android device's touch screen to SMS someone without pulling (what little is left of) my hair out. This is almost certainly what you are used to. I haven't had any difficulty with my nexus one. The iphone drove me to insanity everytime I tried to type on it. >Every single android handset I've used has felt like a cheap, disposable piece of junk (G1, Hero, N1) Everyone I know who has seen the nexus one in person found it much more attractive than the iphone. (sampling bias, yadda yadda) >Or maybe I was just too abused by my time with the G1 to judge this argument fairly anymore, definitely possible. That's the only reasonable explanation I can come up with for your post. (I feel your pain on that one. ;)

czhiddy 16y ago

Interesting on how the tone of the Gizmodo article is almost over-the-top pro-Google and anti-Apple. Seems almost like a backlash to the entire Jason Chen/REACT situation.

davidedicillo 16y ago

There are few things that bothers me when people talk about Google taking the lead: 1) They are comparing two different things, an open OS vs an OS tied to one company. 2) Google didn't surpassed anybody. FroYo hasn't been released yet and they are comparing them to a phone that is going to be updated in two weeks. FroYo has tethering, but iPhone has tethering since 3.0, if AT&T doesn't allow it, it isn't Apple's fault. And I'm not sure how free that wireless hotspot will be. FroYo is faster, but nobody knows if faster than OS 4.0 on the new iPhone. They presented wireless sync, but nobody knows if Apple will introduce the same in two weeks. After all, they bought Lala for some reason. Maybe it's just me, but I like to compare shipped products, not demos and announcements.

tvon 16y ago
The tethering issue may not be Apple's fault, but that's fairly irrelevant since you can't get the phone with any other carrier in the U.S.. Point being, no matter whose fault it is, the iPhone just doesn't have tethering in the U.S.. Otherwise I tend to agree, there are no devices shipping with Froyo so saying it has surpassed a shipping and soon-to-be-updated product is a bit silly.
- davidedicillo 16y ago
  The only Android phone that initially will have that functionality won't be available with AT&T nor T-Mobile... And the Nexus One isn't a pentaband phone either.
  - warfangle 16y ago
    Correct me if I'm wrong, but I'll be able to flash froyo to my nexus one, correct? And the nexus one is available on at&t. Ergo, I will be able to tether my phone on at&t. Right?
    - deleted 16y ago
      [deleted]
    - 16y ago

ShabbyDoo 16y ago

What is more remarkable to me than any Apple vs. Google rivalry is how infrequently the press has mentioned Microsoft in articles on the matter. Is it a given that MSFT has gotten so far behind that it won't ever catch up?

whughes 16y ago
Palm?
- warfangle 16y ago
  s/palm/HP Just sayin'. ;-)
- ShabbyDoo 16y ago
  Yeah. They've been mentioned even less in all of this. Certainly the HP takeover and the quiet surrounding it hasn't helped their PR.
zweben 16y ago
I don't know if it's a given that they'll never catch up, but at the moment they're not really relevant in the market, so it makes sense to leave them out. What would the articles say about them? Microsoft may regain relevance in the market when the first version of their new smartphone OS is released months from now? That's about all there is to say.
- cubicle67 16y ago
  except that WM7 is a subset of iPhone OS features and includes all those that people so dislike on the iPhone (just as controlled, if not more so)

dedward 16y ago

I love all the new android phones I see.... and I like the openness - the hacker in me wants one. But you know - the iphone/ipod Touch - it took me 10 seconds to figure out how that stuff worked. I had to ask my friend to show me how to navigate around his android based phone with all it's buttons and gestures and whatnot...... I can definitely see more possibilities wiht the android - but Apple still has them beet on the Mom test.

cpr 16y ago

Man, how breathless can one article get? Nothing is this simple in real life.

joegaudet 16y ago

Something seems suspect about an article on (ms)nbc claiming that google is now beating apple... Can't quite put my finger on it.

fuminahara 16y ago

Froyo looks really cool, and I would seriously consider the jump from iPhone to Android, but AT&T has such crap android phones. I want a nexus one or a droid! http://listeasy.net/ http://listeasy.net/

cubicle67 16y ago
no spammy links please

erikstarck 16y ago

The thing to watch is not the feature list on one phone or platform release but the innovation speed and how fast you can improve the product in a closed environment vs an open one.

ecq 16y ago

The article is from gizmodo.