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But this wasn't an article about Loom pushing storytelling forward. It pushed interaction forward. Adventure games like Zork wanted a sentence typed. Later, a

But this wasn't an article about Loom pushing storytelling forward. It pushed interaction forward. Adventure games like Zork wanted a sentence typed. Later, a sentence was constructed using a mouse. Loom removed the sentence as the player's action upon the game, and realized the player's intent didn't have to be a literal sentence. It's just as much a breakthrough as Nintendo understanding that "pressing up" on a controller to lift a racket could be replaced by lifting an arm with a controller in it, in the case of the Wii.

Baeocystin 10y ago
That's the thing- it really didn't. Loom was novel for its lack of violence, and lack of a way to lose. But games like Neuromancer predated Loom by years, and were already using (comparatively) complex interfaces, for example.
- sparkpeasy 10y ago
  I praised Loom for its inventive simplicity, and how it avoids text towards direct interaction, and you refute that by referencing Neuromancer, a game with, in your words, a "(comparatively) complex interface." Neuromancer is riddled with complex text interfaces for every interaction. Every choice demands a read through, along with several text selections to decide from. Here's a video of how awful it is. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5tNMdbq_Z7w https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5tNMdbq_Z7w How is that more simple?
  - Baeocystin 10y ago
    Awful? Those few minutes of example show more player agency than the entirety of Loom combined. This is not a novel criticism- it was one of the main complaints levelled against Loom when it first came out. There's a difference between text you read, and text you have to guess at/type (ie, the find-the-synonym frustrations of Infocom games).
    - sparkpeasy 10y ago
      Player agency in a medium without unlimited outcomes is a Choose Your Own Adventure, where the trick is done in plain sight and therefore unconvincing. Loom is just trying to tell a linear story in a convincing manner with the tools it has available, and it elevated the tools available. That's my only point.
      - Baeocystin 10y ago
        Fair enough. // (Although speaking of Choose Your Own Adventure: http://io9.gizmodo.com/remember-inside-ufo-54-40-the-unwinnable-choose-your-o-1552187271 http://io9.gizmodo.com/remember-inside-ufo-54-40-the-unwinna... had a fun "choice".)
        coroxout 10y ago
        I had that book. Very weird and trippy to my pre-teen mind. After many, many readings, both legitimate play-throughs and cheating flip-throughs, I don't think I realised what the article points out.
- mseepgood 10y ago
  > Loom was novel for its lack of violence Bishop Mandible's death wasn't exactly non-violent: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WEQ6Kx0wY0c&t=1h23m29s https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WEQ6Kx0wY0c&t=1h23m29s
  - Baeocystin 10y ago
    True, but notable in that the player had nothing to do with it.
- dvanduzer 10y ago
  LucasFilm Games was a noteworthy studio, among many other reasons, because they weren't dedicated to making shooters when that was clearly where the money was going. The shooter that they did produce (Dark Forces) was also better than Hexen. The "lack of a way to lose" was what distinguished them from Sierra Publishing, the only other interesting video game studio of the era. LOOM™ was novel within the context of the studio, for being radically simplistic with the interface, considering how far they'd already "dumbed down" the interface from spiritual predecessors like Zork. A side note: If you have not already seen Professor Moriarty's lecture on the actual origins of the CYOA format, this is probably the most interesting thing you will read all year: http://ludix.com/moriarty/electric.html http://ludix.com/moriarty/electric.html
  - Baeocystin 10y ago
    That was a fun read. Thanks for sharing it.
  - coroxout 10y ago
    An interesting read. I was just wondering what Moriarty had done since Loom, something the article doesn't mention (presumably saved for the future article it hints will feature his exit from the industry), so thanks for a peek into his more recent career.

Baeocystin 10y ago

That's the thing- it really didn't. Loom was novel for its lack of violence, and lack of a way to lose. But games like Neuromancer predated Loom by years, and were already using (comparatively) complex interfaces, for example.

sparkpeasy 10y ago
I praised Loom for its inventive simplicity, and how it avoids text towards direct interaction, and you refute that by referencing Neuromancer, a game with, in your words, a "(comparatively) complex interface." Neuromancer is riddled with complex text interfaces for every interaction. Every choice demands a read through, along with several text selections to decide from. Here's a video of how awful it is. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5tNMdbq_Z7w https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5tNMdbq_Z7w How is that more simple?
- Baeocystin 10y ago
  Awful? Those few minutes of example show more player agency than the entirety of Loom combined. This is not a novel criticism- it was one of the main complaints levelled against Loom when it first came out. There's a difference between text you read, and text you have to guess at/type (ie, the find-the-synonym frustrations of Infocom games).
  - sparkpeasy 10y ago
    Player agency in a medium without unlimited outcomes is a Choose Your Own Adventure, where the trick is done in plain sight and therefore unconvincing. Loom is just trying to tell a linear story in a convincing manner with the tools it has available, and it elevated the tools available. That's my only point.
    - Baeocystin 10y ago
      Fair enough. // (Although speaking of Choose Your Own Adventure: http://io9.gizmodo.com/remember-inside-ufo-54-40-the-unwinnable-choose-your-o-1552187271 http://io9.gizmodo.com/remember-inside-ufo-54-40-the-unwinna... had a fun "choice".)
      - coroxout 10y ago
        I had that book. Very weird and trippy to my pre-teen mind. After many, many readings, both legitimate play-throughs and cheating flip-throughs, I don't think I realised what the article points out.
mseepgood 10y ago
> Loom was novel for its lack of violence Bishop Mandible's death wasn't exactly non-violent: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WEQ6Kx0wY0c&t=1h23m29s https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WEQ6Kx0wY0c&t=1h23m29s
- Baeocystin 10y ago
  True, but notable in that the player had nothing to do with it.
dvanduzer 10y ago
LucasFilm Games was a noteworthy studio, among many other reasons, because they weren't dedicated to making shooters when that was clearly where the money was going. The shooter that they did produce (Dark Forces) was also better than Hexen. The "lack of a way to lose" was what distinguished them from Sierra Publishing, the only other interesting video game studio of the era. LOOM™ was novel within the context of the studio, for being radically simplistic with the interface, considering how far they'd already "dumbed down" the interface from spiritual predecessors like Zork. A side note: If you have not already seen Professor Moriarty's lecture on the actual origins of the CYOA format, this is probably the most interesting thing you will read all year: http://ludix.com/moriarty/electric.html http://ludix.com/moriarty/electric.html
- Baeocystin 10y ago
  That was a fun read. Thanks for sharing it.
- coroxout 10y ago
  An interesting read. I was just wondering what Moriarty had done since Loom, something the article doesn't mention (presumably saved for the future article it hints will feature his exit from the industry), so thanks for a peek into his more recent career.