4 ms·

Trading privacy for a false sense of security, are we?

by z0noxz 10y ago

Oletros 10y ago
Trading privacy? Can you elaborate?
- z0noxz 10y ago
  The idea of storing sensitive data at one of the most data hungry company in the world "for security", doesn't sound like it came from a genius. I thought I was pretty clear earlier? Moving FOSS into the cloud as a SaS sounds kinda regressive to me...
  - Oletros 10y ago
    If you can explain your fears perhaps we would understand, because I still don't know why using Azure is a privacy trade? Does Microsoft "steal" the data?
    - z0noxz 10y ago
      It happens all the time, and also; when using proprietary software you never know, and that's the big issue (for me). I never use SaS or MS-products (I only use FOSS) so I don't fear for myself.
      - bykovich 10y ago
        When has a SaaS operator stolen data hosted on their service?
        z0noxz 10y ago
        The question was about Microsoft, and it depends on the definition of "stealing" and the definition of "your". It's in the terms and conditions when using their services. As a user you agree to a lot, that you probably wouldn't agree to if you took your time to read the fine print. Many SaaS operators has also a history of selling data to others, and a breach of the service might effect all users of that service and not just one. Many companies have restrictions against usage of SaaS for exactly those reasons...
        Oletros 10y ago
        > It's in the terms and conditions when using their services. The it will be easy to point to those terms in Azure service. > SaaS operators has also a history of selling data to others, Then it willbe easy to link to news about those SASS operators selling the data. > Many companies have restrictions against usage of SaaS for exactly those reasons... Then it will be easy to bring examples of those companies with restrictions.
        z0noxz 10y ago
        If you haven't looked it up for yourself in 10 days (when I have access to my PC) and if I remember this, I will send you some reference to read. But I if you really want to find out (which I doubt) just look it up yourself. It's so easy. I get the feeling you have some affiliation with MS?
        Oletros 10y ago
        > If you haven't looked it up for yourself in 10 days I have looked and I have not find any single case of Microsoft stealing Azure data. Or any big SaaS company like Amazon or Google doing that > But I if you really want to find out (which I doubt I'm not the one making unsupported claims without trying to provide any single example, perhaps the one that doesn't want to lok that their claims are wrong is not me > I get the feeling you have some affiliation with MS? No, I don't have any affiliation with Microsoft and it is not one of my most loved companies. And I'm not the one accusing others of shills of secret ties with companies. I'm also not the one making unsupported claims.
        z0noxz 10y ago
        Me neither :) check here again in 10 days.
        itaysk 10y ago
        https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/TrustCenter/Privacy/default.aspx https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/TrustCenter/Privacy/default.... Also, Azure has the best suite of compliance\certifications that demonstrated their commitments. BTW, Have you read the terms and conditions before speculating on them?
        avh02 10y ago
        Not agreeing with thread OP here, but I would certainly differentiate between "stealing" and "exploiting" (not in a security exploit sense). User data certainly gets exploited on _some_ SaaSs that would otherwise be unexploitable on your own stack. I'm not saying this necessarily applies to compute engines or storage as a service or whatever, but something like gmail (SaaS) where your data is used to target ads at you could be considered exploiting your data. I would not put it beyond large companies to start considering doing the same on their storage-as-a-service offerings soon enough.
        z0noxz 10y ago
        That is exactly my point. I never use the word steal either as it would imply loss for the original owner. My point was directed to the privacy concern together with the impossibility of knowing what happens when the vendor manages the data, and also for the second hand clients (in government solutions for example).
        Oletros 10y ago
        The difference is that in the case of Gmail, monetisation is though ads and in the case of compute engine or storage the monetisation is through client payments. If Google, Microsoft or other companies start to look at the data to exploit it hey will lose trust, the customers and the data.
      - deleted 10y ago
        [deleted]
      - Oletros 10y ago
        > It happens all the time Still waiting any proof of your claim
        z0noxz 10y ago
        Next time when I have access to a PC I can do the searching and reading for you, but until then you will have to wait. I will have access to a PC in about 10 days. I'm not great at typing without a keyboard. But if you can't wait, just search it on the web. I'm sure HN is full of articles about Microsoft and privacy issues as well.

Trading privacy for a false sense of security, are we?

by z0noxz 10y ago

Trading privacy for a false sense of security, are we?

Oletros 10y ago

Trading privacy? Can you elaborate?

z0noxz 10y ago
The idea of storing sensitive data at one of the most data hungry company in the world "for security", doesn't sound like it came from a genius. I thought I was pretty clear earlier? Moving FOSS into the cloud as a SaS sounds kinda regressive to me...
- Oletros 10y ago
  If you can explain your fears perhaps we would understand, because I still don't know why using Azure is a privacy trade? Does Microsoft "steal" the data?
  - z0noxz 10y ago
    It happens all the time, and also; when using proprietary software you never know, and that's the big issue (for me). I never use SaS or MS-products (I only use FOSS) so I don't fear for myself.
    - bykovich 10y ago
      When has a SaaS operator stolen data hosted on their service?
      - z0noxz 10y ago
        The question was about Microsoft, and it depends on the definition of "stealing" and the definition of "your". It's in the terms and conditions when using their services. As a user you agree to a lot, that you probably wouldn't agree to if you took your time to read the fine print. Many SaaS operators has also a history of selling data to others, and a breach of the service might effect all users of that service and not just one. Many companies have restrictions against usage of SaaS for exactly those reasons...
        Oletros 10y ago
        > It's in the terms and conditions when using their services. The it will be easy to point to those terms in Azure service. > SaaS operators has also a history of selling data to others, Then it willbe easy to link to news about those SASS operators selling the data. > Many companies have restrictions against usage of SaaS for exactly those reasons... Then it will be easy to bring examples of those companies with restrictions.
        z0noxz 10y ago
        If you haven't looked it up for yourself in 10 days (when I have access to my PC) and if I remember this, I will send you some reference to read. But I if you really want to find out (which I doubt) just look it up yourself. It's so easy. I get the feeling you have some affiliation with MS?
        Oletros 10y ago
        > If you haven't looked it up for yourself in 10 days I have looked and I have not find any single case of Microsoft stealing Azure data. Or any big SaaS company like Amazon or Google doing that > But I if you really want to find out (which I doubt I'm not the one making unsupported claims without trying to provide any single example, perhaps the one that doesn't want to lok that their claims are wrong is not me > I get the feeling you have some affiliation with MS? No, I don't have any affiliation with Microsoft and it is not one of my most loved companies. And I'm not the one accusing others of shills of secret ties with companies. I'm also not the one making unsupported claims.
        z0noxz 10y ago
        Me neither :) check here again in 10 days.
        itaysk 10y ago
        https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/TrustCenter/Privacy/default.aspx https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/TrustCenter/Privacy/default.... Also, Azure has the best suite of compliance\certifications that demonstrated their commitments. BTW, Have you read the terms and conditions before speculating on them?
      - avh02 10y ago
        Not agreeing with thread OP here, but I would certainly differentiate between "stealing" and "exploiting" (not in a security exploit sense). User data certainly gets exploited on _some_ SaaSs that would otherwise be unexploitable on your own stack. I'm not saying this necessarily applies to compute engines or storage as a service or whatever, but something like gmail (SaaS) where your data is used to target ads at you could be considered exploiting your data. I would not put it beyond large companies to start considering doing the same on their storage-as-a-service offerings soon enough.
        z0noxz 10y ago
        That is exactly my point. I never use the word steal either as it would imply loss for the original owner. My point was directed to the privacy concern together with the impossibility of knowing what happens when the vendor manages the data, and also for the second hand clients (in government solutions for example).
        Oletros 10y ago
        The difference is that in the case of Gmail, monetisation is though ads and in the case of compute engine or storage the monetisation is through client payments. If Google, Microsoft or other companies start to look at the data to exploit it hey will lose trust, the customers and the data.
    - deleted 10y ago
      [deleted]
    - Oletros 10y ago
      > It happens all the time Still waiting any proof of your claim
      - z0noxz 10y ago
        Next time when I have access to a PC I can do the searching and reading for you, but until then you will have to wait. I will have access to a PC in about 10 days. I'm not great at typing without a keyboard. But if you can't wait, just search it on the web. I'm sure HN is full of articles about Microsoft and privacy issues as well.