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Dear MongoDB users, we welcome you in Azure DocumentDB
- dirkg 10y agoNever looked at DocumentDB before. So if I get this straight, I can get a fully managed DB that can scale easily, but still have all the advantages and compatibility of a regular NoSQL like Mongo? I think that's a first, right?
- willvarfar 10y agoPercona have their drop-in MongoDB replacement that uses TokuMX under the hood and they'll manage it for you.
- mat_keep 10y agoTokuMX was discontinued last year MongoDB Atlas will manage MongoDB for you
- fergie 10y agoIsn't it the same general idea as Amazon's DynamoDB?
- tech2 10y agoSo long as you skip over the costs if you want any kind of performance (you need to configure a "number of accesses per time period" with costs scaling alarmingly the higher you go)
- dirkg 10y agoDynamoDB isn't the same thing at all, its very limited and you need to use it in very specific ways. You certainly can't just use your current MongoDb data with it.
- redwood 10y agoExcept that the advantages and compatibility are not all there. Plus there are now fully managed options for the real thing.
- youdontknowtho 10y agoThe advantages are real. Compatibility might not be 100%, but honestly Mongo isn't magic. DocumentDB has strengths of it's own.
- redwood 10y agoI'd be happy to learn about your experience developing an application against DocumentDB and its strengths. Care to share?
- youdontknowtho 10y agoim actually building a fairly well massive app with documentdb and service bus. its not a user facing app, so i dont know if that counts for what you were talking about.
- redwood 10y agoSure, use case aside - expressiveness or the query language, learning curve, secondary indexing etc - keen to hear how all this feels to a new developer to the platform
- youdontknowtho 10y agohttps://channel9.msdn.com/Shows/Azure-Friday/DocumentDB-Support-for-Aggregates https://channel9.msdn.com/Shows/Azure-Friday/DocumentDB-Supp...
- doublerebel 10y agoFully managed easily scalable nosql DBs have been available for many years as CouchDB variants from multiple providers.
- supremesaboteur 10y ago> First and foremost, security is our priority In response to https://www.theregister.co.uk/2017/01/09/mongodb/ https://www.theregister.co.uk/2017/01/09/mongodb/ ? "MongoDB databases are being decimated in soaring ransomware attacks that have seen the number of compromised systems more than double to 27,000 in a day."
- deleted 10y ago[deleted]
- verandaguy 10y agoI've been out of touch with Mongo for a while, but when did it stop being common practice to just hide :27017 behind a firewall with only your app's DB access layer (or, at most, a few nodes in the local subnet) talking to it?
- laurentdc 10y agoProbably around the same time ops were deemed useless :) [1] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=13644789 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=13644789
- deleted 10y ago[deleted]
- virmundi 10y agoI saw that chain too. I guess I do devops differently. Since I'm bootstrapping I don't have money for an ops person. So I've set about learning ufw, let's encrypt, nginx/tls termination to a service only accepting local connections to the port, etc. I see devops as the developer learning the ops side to take responsibility for the whole stack.
- damagednoob 10y agoAs a dev, I've been going through the same process for several months now. Honestly, for each of the concepts I've come across (ufw, let's encrypt, etc), you might bang your head for a few days with each one but you will eventually get it. I don't know why people make it out to be so difficult.
- astral303 10y agoStigma around ops and QA work.
- y0ghur7_xxx 10y ago> hide :27017 behind a firewall with only your app's DB access layer talking to it? Because if you can do without it, why bother? Developing an access layer costs time and money. If you can leverage the DB features to do what you need, you can make you stack simpler and more maintainable.
- curiousDog 10y agoNeeds more hashtags. Reach all those Millenials graduating $10k 3-month bootcamps. Sigh.
- camus2 10y agolol, yeah, this marketing piece doesn't really feel professional. It is littered with useless illustrations and bad poetry. > Third, we do it with love… With love for our money sure. What the hell does that even mean? I really rolled my eyes reading that blog post. This is childish and out of place for an article trying to sell security.
- romanovcode 10y agoI think they know their target audience. (It's for MongoDB users after all.)
- flintchip 10y agoWhat a sweeping generalisation to make.
- fb03 10y agoIt's really satisfying when I read some post with what I exactly wanted to write but didn't have the balls to. Thank you :)
- deleted 10y ago[deleted]
- z0noxz 10y agoTrading privacy for a false sense of security, are we?
- Oletros 10y agoTrading privacy? Can you elaborate?
- z0noxz 10y agoThe idea of storing sensitive data at one of the most data hungry company in the world "for security", doesn't sound like it came from a genius. I thought I was pretty clear earlier? Moving FOSS into the cloud as a SaS sounds kinda regressive to me...
- Oletros 10y agoIf you can explain your fears perhaps we would understand, because I still don't know why using Azure is a privacy trade? Does Microsoft "steal" the data?
- z0noxz 10y agoIt happens all the time, and also; when using proprietary software you never know, and that's the big issue (for me). I never use SaS or MS-products (I only use FOSS) so I don't fear for myself.
- bykovich 10y agoWhen has a SaaS operator stolen data hosted on their service?
- z0noxz 10y agoThe question was about Microsoft, and it depends on the definition of "stealing" and the definition of "your". It's in the terms and conditions when using their services. As a user you agree to a lot, that you probably wouldn't agree to if you took your time to read the fine print. Many SaaS operators has also a history of selling data to others, and a breach of the service might effect all users of that service and not just one. Many companies have restrictions against usage of SaaS for exactly those reasons...
- deleted 10y ago[deleted]
- trustfundbaby 10y agoFrom frying pan to fire probably.
- hoodoof 10y agoAWS needs something like this. The missing piece for the AWS serverless story is a database that is suitable for writing real world applications. DynamoDB is far from suitable for that task, which leaves AWS serverless with no good database.
- steve918 10y agoDynamoDB would be pretty close if it just allowed null values.
- steve918 10y agoActually I guess the query language and indexing is pretty limiting too.
- hoodoof 10y agoDynamoDB is effectively useless for querying, except perhaps for some sort of highly specialised application able to fit within the DynamoDB strange and arcane query model. What sort of database is effectively useless for querying? Also they need to ditch the really, really confusiong and limiting scaling model. For a database that advertises scaling as one of its key strengths, DynamoDB sure has a bad scaling story.
- stephen123 10y agoIt works well for a CQRS model. Which helps with super high scale apps. But most devs want joins and dont want to take the discipline to manage the data duplication.
- phamilton 10y agoI just rolled out a feature on DynamoDB and when monitoring it, I look at one yeah. Provisioned capacity vs consumed capacity. That's all I have to care about. No CPU, RAM, disk space metrics. Usage can increase 4x and performance is flat. It's great. The application is less flexible and required making a lot of decisions up front, but operationally it's fantastic.
- searchfaster 10y agoInteresting... So compatible with Mongodb protocol but not using mongodb internally ? What is your view of services, which provide functionality of some other software or SAAS and is API / Protocol compatible ? Can API / protocols be copyrighted or patented? I believe not based on Google vs Oracle.
- willvarfar 10y agoHasn't tokuMX already put a 'proper' solid DB behind the mongo API?
- mat_keep 10y agoTokuMX was discontinued last year
- joe563323 10y agoMicrosoft trying hard to get developers to work on their platform and fail has really become very much fun. Microsoft deserves for being evil. Example: Microsoft does not save history in cmd shell(its so irritating for devs). The height of the cruelty is they aliased the curl and wget by default to its own program(do not remember).
- partycoder 10y agoYou cannot look at the code, and cannot monitor the infrastructure. The only thing left is trust. Trust in the belief that Microsoft will act in your best interest regarding the privacy of your data. But, isn't reasonable then to ask if Microsoft is actually trustworthy? PRISM, NSAKEY, Flame malware propagating via Windows Update, their 0day policy... I don't think Microsoft is trustworthy.
- willvarfar 10y agoPeople choose managed services all the time. If you worry about interception, then code inspection and monitoring isn't going to give you any assurances. You'd have to run open-source software locally, audit it, and not put it on a cloud like Azure in the first place? (And the NSAKEY was something completely different if you dig into it.)
- partycoder 10y agoUsing a service means trusting a service. Nothing wrong with either, it's a decision up to the consumer. I am just saying, in this specific case, should you trust Microsoft with your data? That's all.
- willvarfar 10y agoWell, do you trust Amazon, Google, Oracle or Rackspace? How about your local mum pop hosting provider? How is Microsoft different?
- partycoder 10y agoA track record of backdooring everything that can be backdoored.
- itaysk 10y agohttps://www.microsoft.com/en-us/TrustCenter/Privacy/default.aspx https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/TrustCenter/Privacy/default.... If you don't trust MS you can trust one of the organisations that certified them for the strictest compliance and regulations in the public cloud space.
- etoykan 10y agoI think Microsoft should implement basic aggregation functions first.
- ZGF4 10y agoImplementing aggregation at query time is a temporary solution. For systems like this aggregation should be done on insert time - many hugely popular databases do not provide much more than a basic get operation for this reason
- etoykan 10y agoYou might be right but Mongo supports them and Microsoft says that we can start using DocumentDb without changing any line of code which is not true.
- ec109685 10y agoOne of the best things about AWS is the "Jeff Barr style" posts describing every service they release. I find them much easier to consume than a blog post like this.
- zip1234 10y agoWell, this post was a marketing post, not a product release. Product release posts in Azure are much more informative for a dev that this post.
- OJFord 10y ago> Product release posts in Azure are much more informative for a dev [than] this post. Who is this for then?
- tracker1 10y agoThe dev managers that see a new buzzword and think, "ooh azure supports mongo now... we should target it for our new app, I hear that MEAN stack is really nice, it should fit right in."
- rdiddly 10y agoPotter's paying 50 cents on the dollar for your shares in the Building & Loan...
- morghus 10y agoYes, except you can't do the most basic things with DocumentDB and it becomes very expensive very fast. Especially if you want multiple collections. There's a lot lacking with DocumentDB, as evident from the feedback forum, that comparing it to Mongo is like comparing an infant to an adult. The infant might be cute, but it can't do a whole lot. https://feedback.azure.com/forums/263030-documentdb/filters/top https://feedback.azure.com/forums/263030-documentdb/filters/...
- youdontknowtho 10y agoTo build something similarly sized with the free version of Mongo would also be expensive. It's a trade off.
- vikestep 10y agoWe used to use DocumentDB, but switched to Azure Table Storage a while back. Did some benchmarking and DocumentDB was too slow for our needs (getting documents for a range between two epochs). Not sure if others experienced the same thing or if things have gotten better since then though.
- alexyoung 10y agoAs someone that almost got bitten by MongoDB's lax auth defaults, I was happy to read that DocumentDB has enabled access control out of the box and no default username/password. Also, there's a query playground if you want to try it out quickly: https://www.documentdb.com/sql/demo https://www.documentdb.com/sql/demo
- raverbashing 10y agoIt's important to be aware of security implications of leaving an unauthenticated server listening on the open internet (listening on 0.0.0.0 is not the default since some time now and if installing the rpm/deb package listening on 127.0.0.1 is the default option). Also never leave an internet facing server without a firewall. As a SaaS it's not surprising DocumentDB got security configured, and it also won't be surprising when people lose data because they'll put '123456' as their password or commit their password to a public repository
- tracker1 10y agoPretty much everything Azure does is over TLS and requires authentication.. some of the authentication for services is more convoluted than others. Personally, I'm pretty happy with how easy it is to use the Azure Storage services (blob, tables, queues) as well as their Azure SQL offering. Far less arcane configuration options than you get with AWS's competing options. If only their compute nodes weren't so pricey.
- EpicEng 10y agoOf course, you really shouldn't be exposing databases if you don't know how to administer them. I agree that the defaults should be better, but...
- blablabla123 10y agoIs this fake news? :'D EDIT: you don't need to flag/down vote... Obviously this is a joke but when you read the other comments it's clear that the information provided is pure Marketing...
- al2o3cr 10y agoI hear it's got even better write performance than /dev/null ;)
- mat_keep 10y agoWhen users have evaluated DocumentDB against MongoDB, they see major shortcomings in Microsoft's offering: "As we were developing our new financial benchmarking service last year, we evaluated Microsoft’s Azure DocumentDB, but MongoDB offered much richer query and indexing functionality" KPMG France https://www.mongodb.com/blog/post/kpmg-france-enters-the-cloud-era-with-new-mongodb-data-lake https://www.mongodb.com/blog/post/kpmg-france-enters-the-clo...
- redwood 10y agoAll of the following three share something in common: 1) Microsoft Azure DocumentDB 2) Google Cloud Spanner 3) Amazon Web Services DynamoDB Total cloud-vendor lock-in. It's clear why the clouds want users investing in these difficult-to-migrate-from solutions...