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> Why is this being accepted as even remotely reasonable? That it's unreasonable and unacceptable doesn't mean that it's illegal. Despite your and my hopes, n

by zeveb 10y ago

> Why is this being accepted as even remotely reasonable? That it's unreasonable and unacceptable doesn't mean that it's illegal. Despite your and my hopes, not all unreasonable and unacceptable things are illegal. > What about 'login with Facebook' sites? Don't do that then. > We here know that we should change our password and logout of existing sessions ASAP after being made to do it, but our non-technical family members may not. If you've given access to your account to someone else, you've already lost, whether you log out quickly afterwards or not. Don't put yourself in a position in which you must log into an account you care about.

OJFord 10y ago
You're missing my point entirely: People do 'login with Facebook'; people will (perhaps grudgingly) log in for them/hand over their password. You won't, I won't, but people will because they're asked to by the uniformed officer, despite how mad it is. I'm just amazed at the lack of significant opposition to this, there doesn't even really seem to be any opposition. Here on HN where one might expect it to be most opposed, we're merely discussing how to mitigate the effects (you can't, don't go - or be prepared to be turned around). I wouldn't pay for my own travel to the USA (while I've been before, and enjoyed my trips, etc.) because I'm not an idiot - and handing over a password is idiotic - and I can't really afford a wasted trip. Sure, sunk cost, whatever - the cost/risk isn't worth it, at least for now until it's shown that they rarely do it, and really it's only x,y,z countries from where I do not hail.
- zeveb 10y ago
  > I'm just amazed at the lack of significant opposition to this I'm amazed at all the many ways people will give up their rights, and yet folks continue to advocate for their rights to be taken away. > Here on HN where one might expect it to be most opposed, we're merely discussing how to mitigate the effects (you can't, don't go - or be prepared to be turned around). I can't change the law, but I can change my behaviour. > I wouldn't pay for my own travel to the USA (while I've been before, and enjoyed my trips, etc.) because I'm not an idiot - and handing over a password is idiotic - and I can't really afford a wasted trip. Sure, sunk cost, whatever - the cost/risk isn't worth it, at least for now until it's shown that they rarely do it, and really it's only x,y,z countries from where I do not hail. a) they rarely do it (roughly 4,500 times last year, IIRC) b) any country might do it, and many do; this is not a U.S.-only thing
  - OJFord 10y ago
    > they rarely do it (roughly 4,500 times last year, IIRC) My mistake, I hadn't heard of this until recently (and clearly didn't read the article properly) and assumed it was a new policy under Trump. At a rate of around 0.0012%, and assuming it's more targeted than random, my actual chance of being asked is much lower, yes sure, that probably is worth the risk of being turned around.
    - zeveb 10y ago
      > My mistake, I hadn't heard of this until recently (and clearly didn't read the article properly) and assumed it was a new policy under Trump. The really great thing about having a Republican (even if only technically) president is that the news media suddenly rediscover the virtues of small government, and the dangers of an unbalanced power structure (a similar phenomenon holds with Democratic presidents & conservatives). It'd be awesome if people would just be principled, but apparently that is too much to ask. > At a rate of around 0.0012%, and assuming it's more targeted than random, my actual chance of being asked is much lower, yes sure, that probably is worth the risk of being turned around. Yes, but I just carry a clean device with no access to my accounts. I can honestly and without deception say that I cannot do what is asked.
      - OJFord 10y ago
        > I can honestly and without deception say that I cannot do what is asked. The general consensus seems to be that you'll be turned around.

by zeveb 10y ago

OJFord 10y ago

You're missing my point entirely: People do 'login with Facebook'; people will (perhaps grudgingly) log in for them/hand over their password. You won't, I won't, but people will because they're asked to by the uniformed officer, despite how mad it is. I'm just amazed at the lack of significant opposition to this, there doesn't even really seem to be any opposition. Here on HN where one might expect it to be most opposed, we're merely discussing how to mitigate the effects (you can't, don't go - or be prepared to be turned around). I wouldn't pay for my own travel to the USA (while I've been before, and enjoyed my trips, etc.) because I'm not an idiot - and handing over a password is idiotic - and I can't really afford a wasted trip. Sure, sunk cost, whatever - the cost/risk isn't worth it, at least for now until it's shown that they rarely do it, and really it's only x,y,z countries from where I do not hail.

zeveb 10y ago
> I'm just amazed at the lack of significant opposition to this I'm amazed at all the many ways people will give up their rights, and yet folks continue to advocate for their rights to be taken away. > Here on HN where one might expect it to be most opposed, we're merely discussing how to mitigate the effects (you can't, don't go - or be prepared to be turned around). I can't change the law, but I can change my behaviour. > I wouldn't pay for my own travel to the USA (while I've been before, and enjoyed my trips, etc.) because I'm not an idiot - and handing over a password is idiotic - and I can't really afford a wasted trip. Sure, sunk cost, whatever - the cost/risk isn't worth it, at least for now until it's shown that they rarely do it, and really it's only x,y,z countries from where I do not hail. a) they rarely do it (roughly 4,500 times last year, IIRC) b) any country might do it, and many do; this is not a U.S.-only thing
- OJFord 10y ago
  > they rarely do it (roughly 4,500 times last year, IIRC) My mistake, I hadn't heard of this until recently (and clearly didn't read the article properly) and assumed it was a new policy under Trump. At a rate of around 0.0012%, and assuming it's more targeted than random, my actual chance of being asked is much lower, yes sure, that probably is worth the risk of being turned around.
  - zeveb 10y ago
    > My mistake, I hadn't heard of this until recently (and clearly didn't read the article properly) and assumed it was a new policy under Trump. The really great thing about having a Republican (even if only technically) president is that the news media suddenly rediscover the virtues of small government, and the dangers of an unbalanced power structure (a similar phenomenon holds with Democratic presidents & conservatives). It'd be awesome if people would just be principled, but apparently that is too much to ask. > At a rate of around 0.0012%, and assuming it's more targeted than random, my actual chance of being asked is much lower, yes sure, that probably is worth the risk of being turned around. Yes, but I just carry a clean device with no access to my accounts. I can honestly and without deception say that I cannot do what is asked.
    - OJFord 10y ago
      > I can honestly and without deception say that I cannot do what is asked. The general consensus seems to be that you'll be turned around.