7 ms·

Ex-Hacker Adrian Lamo Institutionalized for Asperger's

68 points by edw519 16y ago

jrockway 16y ago
Interesting. I clicked through to a related article about this guy, and his last run-in with the law was because he refused to provide his DNA to the federal government. Because apparently hacking web pages leaves a lot of DNA evidence, and they want to get him for sure next time, or something. Frightening.
- jacquesm 16y ago
  Sounds like he's pretty sane to me. I'm considering not renewing my passport because they want my fingerprints too, apparently to stop terrorists from getting passports. Maybe I've got Aspergers?
  - benologist 16y ago
    You should try being a foreigner ... I've had my fingerprints taken 5 times now entering the US.
    - jrockway 16y ago
      FWIW, I would never visit the US. The immigration rules are insane, and I wouldn't want the legal liability of accidentally not crossing a T or dotting an I on an immigration form. Fortunately, I suppose, I'm a citizen, and other countries aren't dumb enough to inflict such terror on their guests. If they did, I wouldn't visit those either. (It's really and interesting case study in what a great idea the Constitution is. It doesn't apply to immigration and customs, supposedly, so those agencies act like a mutant Hitler-Stalin lovechild. The rest of the government, though, does a pretty good job. They pass a retarded law, and the Supreme Court strikes it down.) I apologize. I consider myself personally at fault for allowing my government to do this. It's a shame that non-citizens are not given the same "freedom from government" that citizens are. It's what makes America great, and it's unfortunate that we don't share it. Oh well, when I overthrow the government one day...
      - benologist 16y ago
        It gets worse really... I'm from a first world, priviledged country and a member of the visa waiver program which means it's actually easy for me to enter the US. I can't even imagine what it's like for citizens of many countries. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Visa_Waiver_Program http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Visa_Waiver_Program
        electromagnetic 16y ago
        Agreed, I'm from the UK but have immigrated to Canada (I believe finger prints are only ever required by the police when performing a full criminal history check when applying for citizenship; there was no such mention of it during my PR application process) and the thought that a 5-hour drive can land me having to be finger printed just to visit is very barbaric. I've walked past police with machine guns in airports and that doesn't cross me nearly as unnerving as having to give my finger prints. It's not that I'm worried for anything I've done, I have had police checks performed (twice from the UK) and I come up clean because I've never had a problem with the police and I've never committed a crime. What worries me is that our governments have data sharing policies, as soon as I'm finger printed entering the US I have little doubt that they've been entered into a database back in the UK as well. I dislike the thought that someone will be capable of checking up on me behind my back. I can understand why the US would want it, even if it seems exceptionally barbaric, but it's that the UK and possibly Canadian or other governments will be checking up on if my fingerprints have appeared anywhere. Precisely because after the Madrid bombings an Oregon based lawyer was arrested on an 'incontrovertible match' by the FBI based on prints lifted and arrested him, however completely ignored the fact (for two weeks!) that he hadn't left the country - he matched because he was an Islamic convert and his wife was Egyptian born, his fingerprint never matched at all. My figuring is that the longer my fingerprints stay out of any national or international registry, the less chance I have of being hassled during my lifetime because of a government screw up with the data.
        jacquesm 16y ago
        You've pretty much perfectly outlined my reasons for not wanting the government to fingerprint me. It's ridiculous, and it does not make us one bit safer. The real problem here is that the general public does not understand the issues at all.
    - jacquesm 16y ago
      I know. It's one of the reasons I won't travel to the US any more. TSA ftw.
      - jrockway 16y ago
        It's not the TSA, it's their parent organization, the DHS, which also oversees customs and immigration. The TSA is a hilarious joke, customs and immigration are fucking scary.
        jacquesm 16y ago
        Yes, that's right, the TSA are the jokers in the airport luggage and person screening area, the customs and immigration officials are the jerks behind little bits of glass. But they seem to hang out in the same airports. Apparently according to some 'mission statement' I once spotted on a wall there they are 'Americas first line of defense against terrorism'. I guess they really believe that or they wouldn't be working there, but to me the level of harassment of people just going about their lives is several steps across the line. The image of the US abroad because of these clowns is really suffering.
    - rue 16y ago
      > You should try being a foreigner ... I've had my fingerprints taken 5 times now entering the US. They also fingerprint green card holders, i.e. legal residents. Nothing makes you feel welcome back home like having to justify your reasons for daring have gone outside the U.S. to an asshole with the power to refuse your entry at whim.
  - jrockway 16y ago
    No, you just realize that terrorists can get valid passports just as easily as ordinary citizens. If anything, things like biometric passports just make people less safe -- since customs agents will just assume that if your passport is valid you aren't a threat, they won't ask tough questions. Then a terrorist will slip by, and they'll have an excuse to require rectal imaging on the next generation of passports. The irony is that the terrorists have already won.
    - dasil003 16y ago
      http://everything2.com/title/The+terrorists+have+already+won+%2522ANY+BREAKFAST+BAGEL+SANDWICH%2522+at+McDonald%2527s%2521 http://everything2.com/title/The+terrorists+have+already+won...
rbanffy 16y ago
Is that a Commodore 65 or a 128 Lamo is sitting next to?
- hachiya 16y ago
  Looks like it may be a C64c. That later model was more attractive looking than the first.
  - rbanffy 16y ago
    You are probably right. I forgot completely the 64c existed. An 8-bit Commodore is something that's missing from my collection. edit (for the retro-curious): the 64c http://www.old-computers.com/museum/computer.asp?c=998 http://www.old-computers.com/museum/computer.asp?c=998 the 128 http://www.old-computers.com/museum/computer.asp?st=1&c=96 http://www.old-computers.com/museum/computer.asp?st=1&c=... and the 65 http://www.old-computers.com/museum/computer.asp?st=1&c=273 http://www.old-computers.com/museum/computer.asp?st=1&c=...
milkshakes 16y ago
“I have always maintained that what I did isn’t necessarily technical, it’s about seeing things differently" Him and Michael burry. Who else?
matt1 16y ago
You guys might like this autobiographical profile of Adrian's from 2001 when he went by the handle Magus: http://www.mattmazur.com/archive/aol-files/downloads/people/magus.html http://www.mattmazur.com/archive/aol-files/downloads/people/... Quote: its amazing how many security guards will escort you up to the roof of a skyscraper if you only ask, or won't even stop you if you look like you know where you're going This is taken from an archive of an AOL hacking website called AOL-Files.com that I ran back in 2000/2001. We had a section called AOL People where the site's visitors could submit profiles on themselves. The full list of profiles is here: http://www.mattmazur.com/archive/aol-files/downloads/people/ http://www.mattmazur.com/archive/aol-files/downloads/people/ Mine, which is hilarious now, is here: http://www.mattmazur.com/archive/aol-files/downloads/people/tau.html http://www.mattmazur.com/archive/aol-files/downloads/people/.... So much for being an astronaut and not sitting in front of a computer all day...
- xtac 16y ago
  tau, go fix mine please http://www.mattmazur.com/archive/aol-files/downloads/people/xtac.html http://www.mattmazur.com/archive/aol-files/downloads/people/... ;(
  - matt1 16y ago
    Will do tonight.
davidmathers 16y ago
I didn't know there was such a thing as medication for Asperger's. Does anyone know what it might be?
- neurotech1 16y ago
  There isn't. There is medications that help tangentially only. Antidepressants, Anti-Anxiety & anti-psychotic medications are commonly prescribed to treat the symptoms.
  - davidmathers 16y ago
    I'm just very curious to know which medication is being referenced here: Now, the new medication prescribed in Woodland has made a positive change in his interactions with other people. “Talking to strangers was really hard for me,” Lamo says. “I had to script it all in my head and act out normal behaviors in a very conscious way. Essentially, I had to learn how human beings act.” “Now I no longer feel there’s a surface tension that I have to break through when I talk to somebody, like I’m a fish going after a particularly tasty bug and I have to break through the water to get it,” he continues. “I just talk to somebody, like it’s a natural function.” Any guesses?
    - neurotech1 16y ago
      I'm not a medical doctor, but I some anti-depressants can have that effect, i.e Prozac. Also some anti-anxiety medication, such as Valium can reduce social anxiety, even in low dosages.
    - peterwwillis 16y ago
      geez. this makes me want to take some anti-anxiety meds. talking to strangers is very nerve-wracking.
      - neurotech1 16y ago
        Actually, you may do better with qEEG-guided neurofeedback. The problem is that its hard to for a lot of people to be fully functional after taking a Valium. Social meetings are one thing, but business meetings are another.
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switch007 16y ago
Did this not scare anybody else?: Something about his halting, monotone speech, perhaps slowed by his medication, got the officers’ attention. An ambulance arrived. “After a few moments of conversation, they just kind of exchanged a look and told me to get on the stretcher,” says Lamo. We are going to see more of this. The more we label this kind of behaviour, the more people will be institutionalised. He obviously has the support of his family, so who made this decision? ...where he was placed on a 72-hour involuntary psychiatric hold under a state law allowing the temporary forced hospitalization of those judged dangerous or unable to care for themselves.
- devinj 16y ago
  It scares me. It reminds me very strongly of the way things worked back in the 50s and 60s. I thought we were past forced institutionalization for disorders that didn't cause serious danger.
akadien 16y ago
Give them medicine so they conform. Wouldn't it be beneficial to society to find a way to productively harness the way the brains of those with this condition are differently wired and let them solve problems, rather than killing their natural instinct with drugs?
- devinj 16y ago
  Drugs don't kill the analytical mind, they just make socializing easier. "Drugs" are not ipso facto bad.
  - zackattack 16y ago
    akadien may have been confused by A Beautiful Mind

68 points by edw519 16y ago

Interesting. I clicked through to a related article about this guy, and his last run-in with the law was because he refused to provide his DNA to the federal government. Because apparently hacking web pages leaves a lot of DNA evidence, and they want to get him for sure next time, or something. Frightening.

jacquesm 16y ago
Sounds like he's pretty sane to me. I'm considering not renewing my passport because they want my fingerprints too, apparently to stop terrorists from getting passports. Maybe I've got Aspergers?
- benologist 16y ago
  You should try being a foreigner ... I've had my fingerprints taken 5 times now entering the US.
  - jrockway 16y ago
    FWIW, I would never visit the US. The immigration rules are insane, and I wouldn't want the legal liability of accidentally not crossing a T or dotting an I on an immigration form. Fortunately, I suppose, I'm a citizen, and other countries aren't dumb enough to inflict such terror on their guests. If they did, I wouldn't visit those either. (It's really and interesting case study in what a great idea the Constitution is. It doesn't apply to immigration and customs, supposedly, so those agencies act like a mutant Hitler-Stalin lovechild. The rest of the government, though, does a pretty good job. They pass a retarded law, and the Supreme Court strikes it down.) I apologize. I consider myself personally at fault for allowing my government to do this. It's a shame that non-citizens are not given the same "freedom from government" that citizens are. It's what makes America great, and it's unfortunate that we don't share it. Oh well, when I overthrow the government one day...
    - benologist 16y ago
      It gets worse really... I'm from a first world, priviledged country and a member of the visa waiver program which means it's actually easy for me to enter the US. I can't even imagine what it's like for citizens of many countries. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Visa_Waiver_Program http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Visa_Waiver_Program
      - electromagnetic 16y ago
        Agreed, I'm from the UK but have immigrated to Canada (I believe finger prints are only ever required by the police when performing a full criminal history check when applying for citizenship; there was no such mention of it during my PR application process) and the thought that a 5-hour drive can land me having to be finger printed just to visit is very barbaric. I've walked past police with machine guns in airports and that doesn't cross me nearly as unnerving as having to give my finger prints. It's not that I'm worried for anything I've done, I have had police checks performed (twice from the UK) and I come up clean because I've never had a problem with the police and I've never committed a crime. What worries me is that our governments have data sharing policies, as soon as I'm finger printed entering the US I have little doubt that they've been entered into a database back in the UK as well. I dislike the thought that someone will be capable of checking up on me behind my back. I can understand why the US would want it, even if it seems exceptionally barbaric, but it's that the UK and possibly Canadian or other governments will be checking up on if my fingerprints have appeared anywhere. Precisely because after the Madrid bombings an Oregon based lawyer was arrested on an 'incontrovertible match' by the FBI based on prints lifted and arrested him, however completely ignored the fact (for two weeks!) that he hadn't left the country - he matched because he was an Islamic convert and his wife was Egyptian born, his fingerprint never matched at all. My figuring is that the longer my fingerprints stay out of any national or international registry, the less chance I have of being hassled during my lifetime because of a government screw up with the data.
        jacquesm 16y ago
        You've pretty much perfectly outlined my reasons for not wanting the government to fingerprint me. It's ridiculous, and it does not make us one bit safer. The real problem here is that the general public does not understand the issues at all.
  - jacquesm 16y ago
    I know. It's one of the reasons I won't travel to the US any more. TSA ftw.
    - jrockway 16y ago
      It's not the TSA, it's their parent organization, the DHS, which also oversees customs and immigration. The TSA is a hilarious joke, customs and immigration are fucking scary.
      - jacquesm 16y ago
        Yes, that's right, the TSA are the jokers in the airport luggage and person screening area, the customs and immigration officials are the jerks behind little bits of glass. But they seem to hang out in the same airports. Apparently according to some 'mission statement' I once spotted on a wall there they are 'Americas first line of defense against terrorism'. I guess they really believe that or they wouldn't be working there, but to me the level of harassment of people just going about their lives is several steps across the line. The image of the US abroad because of these clowns is really suffering.
  - rue 16y ago
    > You should try being a foreigner ... I've had my fingerprints taken 5 times now entering the US. They also fingerprint green card holders, i.e. legal residents. Nothing makes you feel welcome back home like having to justify your reasons for daring have gone outside the U.S. to an asshole with the power to refuse your entry at whim.
- jrockway 16y ago
  No, you just realize that terrorists can get valid passports just as easily as ordinary citizens. If anything, things like biometric passports just make people less safe -- since customs agents will just assume that if your passport is valid you aren't a threat, they won't ask tough questions. Then a terrorist will slip by, and they'll have an excuse to require rectal imaging on the next generation of passports. The irony is that the terrorists have already won.
  - dasil003 16y ago
    http://everything2.com/title/The+terrorists+have+already+won+%2522ANY+BREAKFAST+BAGEL+SANDWICH%2522+at+McDonald%2527s%2521 http://everything2.com/title/The+terrorists+have+already+won...

rbanffy 16y ago

Is that a Commodore 65 or a 128 Lamo is sitting next to?

hachiya 16y ago
Looks like it may be a C64c. That later model was more attractive looking than the first.
- rbanffy 16y ago
  You are probably right. I forgot completely the 64c existed. An 8-bit Commodore is something that's missing from my collection. edit (for the retro-curious): the 64c http://www.old-computers.com/museum/computer.asp?c=998 http://www.old-computers.com/museum/computer.asp?c=998 the 128 http://www.old-computers.com/museum/computer.asp?st=1&c=96 http://www.old-computers.com/museum/computer.asp?st=1&c=... and the 65 http://www.old-computers.com/museum/computer.asp?st=1&c=273 http://www.old-computers.com/museum/computer.asp?st=1&c=...

milkshakes 16y ago

“I have always maintained that what I did isn’t necessarily technical, it’s about seeing things differently" Him and Michael burry. Who else?

matt1 16y ago

You guys might like this autobiographical profile of Adrian's from 2001 when he went by the handle Magus: http://www.mattmazur.com/archive/aol-files/downloads/people/magus.html http://www.mattmazur.com/archive/aol-files/downloads/people/... Quote: its amazing how many security guards will escort you up to the roof of a skyscraper if you only ask, or won't even stop you if you look like you know where you're going This is taken from an archive of an AOL hacking website called AOL-Files.com that I ran back in 2000/2001. We had a section called AOL People where the site's visitors could submit profiles on themselves. The full list of profiles is here: http://www.mattmazur.com/archive/aol-files/downloads/people/ http://www.mattmazur.com/archive/aol-files/downloads/people/ Mine, which is hilarious now, is here: http://www.mattmazur.com/archive/aol-files/downloads/people/tau.html http://www.mattmazur.com/archive/aol-files/downloads/people/.... So much for being an astronaut and not sitting in front of a computer all day...

xtac 16y ago
tau, go fix mine please http://www.mattmazur.com/archive/aol-files/downloads/people/xtac.html http://www.mattmazur.com/archive/aol-files/downloads/people/... ;(
- matt1 16y ago
  Will do tonight.

davidmathers 16y ago

I didn't know there was such a thing as medication for Asperger's. Does anyone know what it might be?

neurotech1 16y ago
There isn't. There is medications that help tangentially only. Antidepressants, Anti-Anxiety & anti-psychotic medications are commonly prescribed to treat the symptoms.
- davidmathers 16y ago
  I'm just very curious to know which medication is being referenced here: Now, the new medication prescribed in Woodland has made a positive change in his interactions with other people. “Talking to strangers was really hard for me,” Lamo says. “I had to script it all in my head and act out normal behaviors in a very conscious way. Essentially, I had to learn how human beings act.” “Now I no longer feel there’s a surface tension that I have to break through when I talk to somebody, like I’m a fish going after a particularly tasty bug and I have to break through the water to get it,” he continues. “I just talk to somebody, like it’s a natural function.” Any guesses?
  - neurotech1 16y ago
    I'm not a medical doctor, but I some anti-depressants can have that effect, i.e Prozac. Also some anti-anxiety medication, such as Valium can reduce social anxiety, even in low dosages.
  - peterwwillis 16y ago
    geez. this makes me want to take some anti-anxiety meds. talking to strangers is very nerve-wracking.
    - neurotech1 16y ago
      Actually, you may do better with qEEG-guided neurofeedback. The problem is that its hard to for a lot of people to be fully functional after taking a Valium. Social meetings are one thing, but business meetings are another.

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switch007 16y ago

Did this not scare anybody else?: Something about his halting, monotone speech, perhaps slowed by his medication, got the officers’ attention. An ambulance arrived. “After a few moments of conversation, they just kind of exchanged a look and told me to get on the stretcher,” says Lamo. We are going to see more of this. The more we label this kind of behaviour, the more people will be institutionalised. He obviously has the support of his family, so who made this decision? ...where he was placed on a 72-hour involuntary psychiatric hold under a state law allowing the temporary forced hospitalization of those judged dangerous or unable to care for themselves.

devinj 16y ago
It scares me. It reminds me very strongly of the way things worked back in the 50s and 60s. I thought we were past forced institutionalization for disorders that didn't cause serious danger.

akadien 16y ago

Give them medicine so they conform. Wouldn't it be beneficial to society to find a way to productively harness the way the brains of those with this condition are differently wired and let them solve problems, rather than killing their natural instinct with drugs?

devinj 16y ago
Drugs don't kill the analytical mind, they just make socializing easier. "Drugs" are not ipso facto bad.
- zackattack 16y ago
  akadien may have been confused by A Beautiful Mind