6 ms·

Unfortunately, Mesosphere is no longer focusing on Marathon as an Apache Mesos framework and is instead integrating it into DC/OS, their commercial offering. Op

Unfortunately, Mesosphere is no longer focusing on Marathon as an Apache Mesos framework and is instead integrating it into DC/OS, their commercial offering. Open-source Mesos+Marathon no longer appears to be an option.

nemothekid 10y ago
Isn't DC/OS now opensource? (https://github.com/dcos/dcos https://github.com/dcos/dcos)
- ssk2 10y ago
  Yup! https://mesosphere.com/blog/2016/04/19/open-source-dcos/ https://mesosphere.com/blog/2016/04/19/open-source-dcos/ (I am a Mesosphere employee.)
  - SEJeff 10y ago
    Will any of the commercial only stuff (like the distributed firewall or ldap authentication / authorization bits) ever be open sourced, or will DC/OS forever be open core crippleware?
    - ssk2 10y ago
      That's a little harsh. I don't think the intention is to be open core crippleware - there are certainly a good number of users using (open) DC/OS in production without the enterprise features that you mention. I can't speak to the specific roadmap since I am uninformed but generally I believe the trend is for most enterprise features to trickle down into open over time.
  - poooogles 10y ago
    Care to comment on GP?
    - ssk2 10y ago
      We're very much committed to the Marathon open source community and keeping them happy. I'm afraid I don't know what the plans are for the project (not working on Marathon myself) but being the most popular open source project run and maintained by Mesosphere, I have no doubt that we will continue adding new features and functionality.
- lowbloodsugar 10y ago
  So DC/OS is a "one solution for all the things" offering, like K8s. It's "magical" and "monolithic": if it happens to do what you want, out of the box, then you're in luck. If it doesn't, or more likely, if you can't figure out how to make it do what it says it does, then there is a small community that can help you. And that's if you use the "magical" installer. I wouldn't even consider building the i-dont-know-how-many-but-more-than-ten (its 30) different "open-source" packages that make up DC/OS myself, let alone deploy them. If you are searching for a product in this space, then K8s is the way to go. It has a huge community. If, on the other hand, you are looking for a small, non-monolithic, resource scheduler + some basic frameworks (i.e. Apache Mesos + Marathon) then DC/OS is not that. But since Mesosphere are no longer supporting working on Marathon outside of DC/OS, or indeed any framework outside of DC/OS, the Mesos/Marathon is effectively dead, since, while Mesos is open source, the only major supporter of frameworks for it is Mesosphere, and you wont get them unless you use DC/OS.
  - jaaron 10y ago
    I think it's a matter of scope. For some relatively small projects, k8s is sufficient. But pretty quickly you end up needing more and more functionality and you end up in a larger stack like OpenShift. That's the place that Mesos and DC/OS (IMHO) shine: when you're working with large clusters (1000+) running very different workloads. Because in that scenario, k8s is still pretty immature and you're going to inevitably need to solve all the other problems that OpenShift, DC/OS, Rancher or other stacks solve. Just like Linux distros, in theory, anyone can do it. In practice, it's a pain and you want to pick up a standard distro. That's what these stacks provide: a pre-configured suite of open source tools that get you way more than k8s or Mesos or Marathon on their own provide.
    - lowbloodsugar 10y ago
      Sure, but DC/OS has yet to demonstrate that it can do any of that. Mesos has demonstrated that it can handle clusters at scale, but I don't know of anyone running the full smorgasbord of all 30 services on a cluster that big, and its the other 29 things that's going to fail at scale. And again, if you are going to be running DC/OS at that scale, then you are going to be running the enterprise version, because you aren't going to be running that much magical shit on million dollar hardware without someone being paid to troubleshoot. That might be me in a few years, except that Mesosphere seems to be attempting to kill me in the short term by killing non-DC/OS mesos/marathon while crippling non-enterprise DC/OS. So looks like we'll be migrating to K8s and hoping that in a few years K8s scales. The "K8s doesn't scale" argument is losing ground with every new release btw.
poooogles 10y ago
Source for this?
- lowbloodsugar 10y ago
  https://github.com/mesosphere/marathon-ui https://github.com/mesosphere/marathon-ui >Dear Marathon Community, ... >Because of our focus on integrating the experience of using Marathon and DC/OS, we aren’t planning on updating the old UI further. And by "old UI" they mean the one that works without DC/OS. So there is no Apache Mesos + Marathon. There's Mesos. With no actively developed frameworks (Chronos is dead too). And then there's DC/OS.
  - jaaron 10y ago
    I don't think that's really fair. Marathon is still being developed as an open source Mesos framework. The _UI_ is going to stall out a bit, but it's just the UI. Chronos is still being developed, but Mesosphere is taking Metronome and folding it into Marathon, making it more like Aurora. Moreover there's Singularity, PaaSTA, and a whole lot more: http://mesos.apache.org/documentation/latest/frameworks/ http://mesos.apache.org/documentation/latest/frameworks/ Yes, DC/OS is intended to be a (mostly) full stack, but even then, it's still just Mesos under the hood and you can run any Mesos framework on it. The open source edition of DC/OS is fairly full featured, while the enterprise version gives you better account security, networking and integrated secrets (vault) support.
    - lowbloodsugar 10y ago
      Mesosphere official github repo: "we aren’t planning on updating the old UI further" Jaaron: "The _UI_ is going to stall out a bit, but its just the UI." My options are: a) running latest marathon backend without the user interface b) running latest marathon backend and clone/maintain the user interface c) migrate the whole thing to enterprise DC/OS (since I need authentication) d) migrate to K8s I view the lack of option "(e) keep using marathon-the-product as it is now", as a breach of trust, so (c) is off the table (whereas, before, it was my expected endpoint). YMMV.
bogomipz 10y ago
Mesosphere has had an open-source free version for nearly a year now. You can read about it here: https://mesosphere.com/blog/2016/04/19/open-source-dcos/ https://mesosphere.com/blog/2016/04/19/open-source-dcos/
- fh973 10y ago
  Are there package repositories for DC/OS somewhere? I could only find these install scripts but I guess they are meant for demo installations.
  - ssk2 10y ago
    DC/OS has a unique packaging mechanism, and cannot be found as a traditional Linux package. (Personally, I'd love to see that happen at some point but for simplicity's sake, it's distributed as a single binary - this allows us to upgrade the bits on nodes near atomically). There are three ways to install it: 1) Cloud provider specific templates (e.g. CloudFormation / Azure Resource Manager. GCP support is on the backlog) 2) The ssh installer (this has a UI and a CLI). I believe this doesn't work well for larger installations because of the one to many issue. 3) The advanced install method. This generates a binary that is copied to each node. You can integrate this with Puppet, Chef, Ansible and so on. https://dcos.io/install/ https://dcos.io/install/ and https://dcos.io/docs/ https://dcos.io/docs/ has more details on this.

nemothekid 10y ago

Isn't DC/OS now opensource? (https://github.com/dcos/dcos https://github.com/dcos/dcos)

ssk2 10y ago
Yup! https://mesosphere.com/blog/2016/04/19/open-source-dcos/ https://mesosphere.com/blog/2016/04/19/open-source-dcos/ (I am a Mesosphere employee.)
- SEJeff 10y ago
  Will any of the commercial only stuff (like the distributed firewall or ldap authentication / authorization bits) ever be open sourced, or will DC/OS forever be open core crippleware?
  - ssk2 10y ago
    That's a little harsh. I don't think the intention is to be open core crippleware - there are certainly a good number of users using (open) DC/OS in production without the enterprise features that you mention. I can't speak to the specific roadmap since I am uninformed but generally I believe the trend is for most enterprise features to trickle down into open over time.
- poooogles 10y ago
  Care to comment on GP?
  - ssk2 10y ago
    We're very much committed to the Marathon open source community and keeping them happy. I'm afraid I don't know what the plans are for the project (not working on Marathon myself) but being the most popular open source project run and maintained by Mesosphere, I have no doubt that we will continue adding new features and functionality.
lowbloodsugar 10y ago
So DC/OS is a "one solution for all the things" offering, like K8s. It's "magical" and "monolithic": if it happens to do what you want, out of the box, then you're in luck. If it doesn't, or more likely, if you can't figure out how to make it do what it says it does, then there is a small community that can help you. And that's if you use the "magical" installer. I wouldn't even consider building the i-dont-know-how-many-but-more-than-ten (its 30) different "open-source" packages that make up DC/OS myself, let alone deploy them. If you are searching for a product in this space, then K8s is the way to go. It has a huge community. If, on the other hand, you are looking for a small, non-monolithic, resource scheduler + some basic frameworks (i.e. Apache Mesos + Marathon) then DC/OS is not that. But since Mesosphere are no longer supporting working on Marathon outside of DC/OS, or indeed any framework outside of DC/OS, the Mesos/Marathon is effectively dead, since, while Mesos is open source, the only major supporter of frameworks for it is Mesosphere, and you wont get them unless you use DC/OS.
- jaaron 10y ago
  I think it's a matter of scope. For some relatively small projects, k8s is sufficient. But pretty quickly you end up needing more and more functionality and you end up in a larger stack like OpenShift. That's the place that Mesos and DC/OS (IMHO) shine: when you're working with large clusters (1000+) running very different workloads. Because in that scenario, k8s is still pretty immature and you're going to inevitably need to solve all the other problems that OpenShift, DC/OS, Rancher or other stacks solve. Just like Linux distros, in theory, anyone can do it. In practice, it's a pain and you want to pick up a standard distro. That's what these stacks provide: a pre-configured suite of open source tools that get you way more than k8s or Mesos or Marathon on their own provide.
  - lowbloodsugar 10y ago
    Sure, but DC/OS has yet to demonstrate that it can do any of that. Mesos has demonstrated that it can handle clusters at scale, but I don't know of anyone running the full smorgasbord of all 30 services on a cluster that big, and its the other 29 things that's going to fail at scale. And again, if you are going to be running DC/OS at that scale, then you are going to be running the enterprise version, because you aren't going to be running that much magical shit on million dollar hardware without someone being paid to troubleshoot. That might be me in a few years, except that Mesosphere seems to be attempting to kill me in the short term by killing non-DC/OS mesos/marathon while crippling non-enterprise DC/OS. So looks like we'll be migrating to K8s and hoping that in a few years K8s scales. The "K8s doesn't scale" argument is losing ground with every new release btw.

poooogles 10y ago

Source for this?

lowbloodsugar 10y ago
https://github.com/mesosphere/marathon-ui https://github.com/mesosphere/marathon-ui >Dear Marathon Community, ... >Because of our focus on integrating the experience of using Marathon and DC/OS, we aren’t planning on updating the old UI further. And by "old UI" they mean the one that works without DC/OS. So there is no Apache Mesos + Marathon. There's Mesos. With no actively developed frameworks (Chronos is dead too). And then there's DC/OS.
- jaaron 10y ago
  I don't think that's really fair. Marathon is still being developed as an open source Mesos framework. The _UI_ is going to stall out a bit, but it's just the UI. Chronos is still being developed, but Mesosphere is taking Metronome and folding it into Marathon, making it more like Aurora. Moreover there's Singularity, PaaSTA, and a whole lot more: http://mesos.apache.org/documentation/latest/frameworks/ http://mesos.apache.org/documentation/latest/frameworks/ Yes, DC/OS is intended to be a (mostly) full stack, but even then, it's still just Mesos under the hood and you can run any Mesos framework on it. The open source edition of DC/OS is fairly full featured, while the enterprise version gives you better account security, networking and integrated secrets (vault) support.
  - lowbloodsugar 10y ago
    Mesosphere official github repo: "we aren’t planning on updating the old UI further" Jaaron: "The _UI_ is going to stall out a bit, but its just the UI." My options are: a) running latest marathon backend without the user interface b) running latest marathon backend and clone/maintain the user interface c) migrate the whole thing to enterprise DC/OS (since I need authentication) d) migrate to K8s I view the lack of option "(e) keep using marathon-the-product as it is now", as a breach of trust, so (c) is off the table (whereas, before, it was my expected endpoint). YMMV.

bogomipz 10y ago

Mesosphere has had an open-source free version for nearly a year now. You can read about it here: https://mesosphere.com/blog/2016/04/19/open-source-dcos/ https://mesosphere.com/blog/2016/04/19/open-source-dcos/

fh973 10y ago
Are there package repositories for DC/OS somewhere? I could only find these install scripts but I guess they are meant for demo installations.
- ssk2 10y ago
  DC/OS has a unique packaging mechanism, and cannot be found as a traditional Linux package. (Personally, I'd love to see that happen at some point but for simplicity's sake, it's distributed as a single binary - this allows us to upgrade the bits on nodes near atomically). There are three ways to install it: 1) Cloud provider specific templates (e.g. CloudFormation / Azure Resource Manager. GCP support is on the backlog) 2) The ssh installer (this has a UI and a CLI). I believe this doesn't work well for larger installations because of the one to many issue. 3) The advanced install method. This generates a binary that is copied to each node. You can integrate this with Puppet, Chef, Ansible and so on. https://dcos.io/install/ https://dcos.io/install/ and https://dcos.io/docs/ https://dcos.io/docs/ has more details on this.