5 ms·

They are also much, much cheaper per mile. Something is wrong with construction in the US that makes rail lines dramatically more expensive here.

jjawssd 10y ago
I'm interested in finding out more about this issue
- niftich 10y ago
  Some write-ups and musings on this: [1] https://www.bloomberg.com/view/articles/2016-04-08/why-u-s-infrastructure-costs-so-much https://www.bloomberg.com/view/articles/2016-04-08/why-u-s-i... [2] http://www.motherjones.com/kevin-drum/2013/06/how-much-bang-do-we-get-our-infrastructure-buck http://www.motherjones.com/kevin-drum/2013/06/how-much-bang-... [3] https://pedestrianobservations.wordpress.com/2011/05/16/us-rail-construction-costs/ https://pedestrianobservations.wordpress.com/2011/05/16/us-r... [4] https://pedestrianobservations.wordpress.com/2013/06/03/comparative-subway-construction-costs-revised/ https://pedestrianobservations.wordpress.com/2013/06/03/comp... [5] http://theweek.com/articles/449646/why-expensive-build-bridge-america http://theweek.com/articles/449646/why-expensive-build-bridg...
- MK999 10y ago
  Why Trains Suck in America https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mbEfzuCLoAQ https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mbEfzuCLoAQ
nimish 10y ago
Its a hell of a lot easier to fly over the dozens or hundreds of different landowners and jurisdictions than it is to convince each of them to allow you to build a giant railroad through them The us rail infra was built when this wasn't an issue or could be solved by sending some heavies in or bribing the right people.
- WildUtah 10y ago
  The landowner problem was much worse in Japan and Europe, but was overcome with cash and persuasion. The US rail construction problem is much more complicated and costly than that. And it applies to urban rail where the right of way is entirely public just as much as high speed.
- chiph 10y ago
  Texas Central is about 1/3 of the way through right of way acquisition on their Houston to Dallas route. http://www.texascentral.com/alignment-maps/ http://www.texascentral.com/alignment-maps/ They're partnering with Japan National Railways and planning on running the N700-I Bullet total system (the international version of the Tokaido Shinkansen).
ino 10y ago
In Europe it's usually much cheaper to get a low cost flight than the train.
Sanddancer 10y ago
Infrastructure is expensive. For example, the project to upgrade state route 99 in California, which parallels the High Speed Rail tracks for about 130 miles, to Interstate standards was projected to cost $22 billion ten years ago [1]. A lot of the huge costs are from the infrastructure debt of refusing to pay for a rail network, and for destroying a lot of the network that was in place. The HSR system will give a lot of benefits for a substantial amount of the state in terms of giving a modern transit backbone. [1] https://www.fhwa.dot.gov/planning/economic_development/studies/casr992005.cfm https://www.fhwa.dot.gov/planning/economic_development/studi...
hkmurakami 10y ago
Not really. Tokyo-Osaka is going to be a bit under $200 whichever way you might choose. Maybe rail is $30 cheaper but it's a 15% difference rather than say 50%+.
- ghaff 10y ago
  The Shinkansen is great but it's fairly expensive unless you buy a visitor rail pass overseas. That's a pretty common pattern (except for maybe China). HSR may be a nice option but it not infrequently costs more than flying.

jjawssd 10y ago

I'm interested in finding out more about this issue

niftich 10y ago
Some write-ups and musings on this: [1] https://www.bloomberg.com/view/articles/2016-04-08/why-u-s-infrastructure-costs-so-much https://www.bloomberg.com/view/articles/2016-04-08/why-u-s-i... [2] http://www.motherjones.com/kevin-drum/2013/06/how-much-bang-do-we-get-our-infrastructure-buck http://www.motherjones.com/kevin-drum/2013/06/how-much-bang-... [3] https://pedestrianobservations.wordpress.com/2011/05/16/us-rail-construction-costs/ https://pedestrianobservations.wordpress.com/2011/05/16/us-r... [4] https://pedestrianobservations.wordpress.com/2013/06/03/comparative-subway-construction-costs-revised/ https://pedestrianobservations.wordpress.com/2013/06/03/comp... [5] http://theweek.com/articles/449646/why-expensive-build-bridge-america http://theweek.com/articles/449646/why-expensive-build-bridg...
MK999 10y ago
Why Trains Suck in America https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mbEfzuCLoAQ https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mbEfzuCLoAQ

nimish 10y ago

Its a hell of a lot easier to fly over the dozens or hundreds of different landowners and jurisdictions than it is to convince each of them to allow you to build a giant railroad through them The us rail infra was built when this wasn't an issue or could be solved by sending some heavies in or bribing the right people.

WildUtah 10y ago
The landowner problem was much worse in Japan and Europe, but was overcome with cash and persuasion. The US rail construction problem is much more complicated and costly than that. And it applies to urban rail where the right of way is entirely public just as much as high speed.
chiph 10y ago
Texas Central is about 1/3 of the way through right of way acquisition on their Houston to Dallas route. http://www.texascentral.com/alignment-maps/ http://www.texascentral.com/alignment-maps/ They're partnering with Japan National Railways and planning on running the N700-I Bullet total system (the international version of the Tokaido Shinkansen).

ino 10y ago

In Europe it's usually much cheaper to get a low cost flight than the train.

Sanddancer 10y ago

Infrastructure is expensive. For example, the project to upgrade state route 99 in California, which parallels the High Speed Rail tracks for about 130 miles, to Interstate standards was projected to cost $22 billion ten years ago [1]. A lot of the huge costs are from the infrastructure debt of refusing to pay for a rail network, and for destroying a lot of the network that was in place. The HSR system will give a lot of benefits for a substantial amount of the state in terms of giving a modern transit backbone. [1] https://www.fhwa.dot.gov/planning/economic_development/studies/casr992005.cfm https://www.fhwa.dot.gov/planning/economic_development/studi...

hkmurakami 10y ago

Not really. Tokyo-Osaka is going to be a bit under $200 whichever way you might choose. Maybe rail is $30 cheaper but it's a 15% difference rather than say 50%+.

ghaff 10y ago
The Shinkansen is great but it's fairly expensive unless you buy a visitor rail pass overseas. That's a pretty common pattern (except for maybe China). HSR may be a nice option but it not infrequently costs more than flying.