8 ms·
I am failing to see how providing your Facebook password provides any legitimate confirmation about you and your associations. You can easily create a fake Face
by nodesocket 10y ago
I am failing to see how providing your Facebook password provides any legitimate confirmation about you and your associations. You can easily create a fake Facebook profile with your picture, fake posts, fake friends, fake everything.
The internet is a cesspool of people who troll, create fake profiles, invoke reactions, behave completely different than they would on the streets, and intentionally hide their identity. Using it as a primary source of identity verification is a terrible idea.
Why not require proof of a financial statement? Bank account in your name, or a process to verify somebody via their bank account without requiring their bank account password.
- pier25 10y agoIt's just as ridiculous as those forms you are asked to fill when entering the US as a foreigner. For example: > Do you seek to engage in terrorist activities while in the United States?
- jackweirdy 10y agoAnother example of an absurd question like that was one I was asked when I was applying for my visa; along the lines of "are you planning to commit espionage for another country against the United States". I assume they do it so they can pin you for perjury as well was whatever crime you committed should you turn out to be a spy. But it's just so absurd when asked deadpan like that.
- couchand 10y agoSure that question is dumb, but it's not at all comparable to forcing you to turn over a password. Why would you make that false equivalence?
- pier25 10y agoBecause you can as easily create a fake social media profile
- greglindahl 10y agoThey're just getting you to incriminate yourself. The standard of proof for excluding someone for lying on the forms is quite different from convicting them of an actual terrorism-related crime.
- rdtsc 10y agoThe reason for those is to then quickly provide a way to invalidate their visa and have an administratively easy path to kick them out without having to go to court and such. Terrorist activities doesn't mean blowing things up, it could be open to all kinds of interpretation (donated money to some organization, protested and was arrested for rioting, went to a black-hat conference which had talks about subverting security systems of power plants etc, etc).
- pas 10y agoAny statue establishing those could also establish that those are proper cause for immediate deportation, no need for fancy forms and logic-gymnastics.
- roywiggins 10y agoThose are just to make people easily deportable if they're found to have lied.
- pier25 10y agoSo if such person engages in a terrorist act having lied on a form would matter at all?
- icebraining 10y agoSure, you can provide a fake profile. And then they'll find out your real one (Facebook will certainly be compelled to help out) and you're now guilty of lying to the border officials, and probably banned for a long time, if not for life.
- nodesocket 10y agoHow would they discover you provided a fake profile in the first place? Sure they might be able to catch a percentage of people, but not nearly all of them.
- UnoriginalGuy 10y agoThe NSA.
- deleted 10y ago[deleted]
- MichaelGG 10y agoA: Most people aren't gonna bother, or do this right. B: Most people will leave their original profile up, so quickly searching might find that person's photo with another account. C: There will probably be a lack of activity. "You signed up for Facebook 1 month ago?" "Why do you have no friends talking about this trip?" etc. People that don't want to get caught entering under false pretenses can just delete social media or not post dumb stuff on it in the first place. This isn't gonna catch spies[1] and terrorists or whatever, it'll prevent visa overstays and stuff like that. [1] Though I heard of one spy getting caught cause she tried to collect frequent flier miles on her main account while traveling under aliases. So, who knows what kinda things will happen every now and then. But that can't be the primary aim of the idea.
- roywiggins 10y agoDepends on whether they decide they want a reason to get you out of the country later. How much do you speak against the regime? They won't be interested in most people but they will target their efforts.
- 10y ago
- MichaelGG 10y agoIt won't be primary. A surprising number of people post dumb things, or even talk about their plans to violate their visa conditions while in line for entry. This'll catch a lot of mundane violations, like folks planning on working or permanently residing in the country while claiming they're just visiting for a week. It's very intrusive and I'm against it, but it will be quite effective. Most people aren't gonna create fake profiles. Or if they do, they'll be suspiciously empty. If someone is gonna go through that effort to get entry they probably can just refrain from posting their plans online in the first place.
- llukas 10y agoYou really think there won't be industry of creating and maintaining fake profiles?
- deleted 10y ago[deleted]
- MichaelGG 10y agoI've seen people talk about their plans to enter under false premises while in line at Houston (IAH). Talking about how they're gonna work as a nanny or whatever. CBP has folks walking around and sometimes they ask spot questions and suss these people out. I imagine the same will happen. People who will go thru the hassle of dealing with a fake profile will just not post about their plans to enter "illegally" in the first place. People prone to writing dumb shit online are probably not going to wise up because of this.
- Cyph0n 10y ago> It's very intrusive and I'm against it, but it will be quite effective. It will be effective initially, but people will catch wind of this and start to purge their Facebook profiles prior to entry. I'm certain that cheap online "Facebook cleaning" services will start to pop up very soon.
- deleted 10y ago[deleted]
- jacques_chester 10y ago> You can easily create a fake Facebook profile with your picture, fake posts, fake friends, fake everything. Perjuring yourself to a border agent is inadvisable. The legal threat follows you whether or not you are granted or denied entry. At any time, it may be discovered and lead to very serious criminal and administrative consequences. If you simply refuse to give over the password, they can refuse entry. But they can't necessarily treat you as an actual criminal. It is never a good idea to lie to, mislead or interfere with law enforcement officers. If you are having trouble, get a lawyer as quickly as you can. Speaking of which: I am not a lawyer and consequently this is not legal advice.
- jboles 10y agoThere is no legal obligation to be truthful in what one places on their Facebook profile, however, so it's not perjuring. You can out on whatever you like and it's up to the border agent to make of it whatever they will.
- jacques_chester 10y agoIn criminal law, intention matters as much as actions. I suspect the that deliberately creating a false profile would push you into perjury territory. And in any case, even if the rulings come down otherwise, you'll still get arrested and remanded for a long time while the lawyers sort it out. Again, though: I am not a lawyer. Consult a lawyer.
- tn13 10y agoThey will make you sign a document that would be something like "I confirm under penalty of perjury that this is the only social media account I have." Later when the government wants to target you specifically they will point out that you had also owned an Orkut account which you had failed to disclose. Bam! you have to leave the country.
- smb06 10y agoAll of that (identifiable info such as bank accounts or other docs) is already required when you are applying for the visa in the first place