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Here's an analogous situation - let's suppose you are a buyer in an auction for a car. You're competing with all other interested buyers to get the car, and af
by pdovy 10y ago
Here's an analogous situation - let's suppose you are a buyer in an auction for a car. You're competing with all other interested buyers to get the car, and after a bunch of back and forth, you win the auction.
Later, you find out that one of the most aggressive bidders in the auction was actually just a buddy of the seller, trying to increase the price in his/her favor but avoid at all costs actually winning the auction.
You'd probably rightfully think this was unfair, and this is exactly what spoofers are doing in an electronic market. They are generating the illusion of interest to buy or sell, without the intention to actually do so, in order to move the market in their favor.
- oh_sigh 10y agoWhy is that illegal? Why doesn't it just get you kicked from the market if you do it?
- user5994461 10y agoIt kicks you out of the market by sending you to prison.
- mwfunk 10y agoBecause it's financial fraud, and it harms the legitimacy of the market itself and it harms the other people participating in the market. It's not like banning a cheater in a video game, there are real world stakes.
- oh_sigh 10y agoIf video games have real world financial stakes(say, for professional eSports players like Dota/LoL), should cheating be punishable by jail time?
- alasdair_ 10y agoMaybe. If we are playing poker, and you cheat, you have stolen my money through fraud. Certainly if I cheat at a casino, I'm likely going to jail.
- oh_sigh 10y agoI believe if you cheat at a casino, you are just banned and kicked out. Also, perhaps there is a differentiation between working within the mechanics of a system to cheat, and going around a system to cheat. An example from the esports league would be the difference between using a corner case to shoot through a wall, versus hacking into the server and modifying the code.
- cpwright 10y agoIf you don't cheat, but do something the casino doesn't approve of you are kicked out. If you actually cheat, and the casino decides it is worth it, you'll have the government come down on you too.
- al_chemist 10y agoBluffing in poker is not cheating, is it? This guy bluffed that he want to sell when he did not.
- kolinko 10y agoIt actually is.
- sgt101 10y agoIt's a scheme to get money by being dishonest; so it's stealing.
- VT_Drew 10y ago>get money by being dishonest; so it's stealing. That isn't the definition of stealing. In fact I would argue, while it is dishonest, it isn't stealing in slightest. Stealing means you took something, without agreement, that rightfully belongs to someone else. The scheme is more accurately described as fraud than stealing.
- alasdair_ 10y agoI don't see a problem with this. At any time, I could stop bidding and the buddy would be left with the car and the fees from the sale. I'm not going to bid more than the car is worth to me.
- colanderman 10y agoThe idea is, the seller just buys the car back off his buddy.
- deleted 10y ago[deleted]
- kolbe 10y agothis is not an accurate analogy. a spoofer's order is legitimate. if someone buys or sells it, the spoofer made a transaction.
- rrrrsss99 10y agoNo, only one order was legitimate. They placed an ask at the top level and then placed 3 bids below the top level. As soon as someone hit the ask, they cancelled the bids. The bids made it look like the market was going up. If the top level bid had been hit first, they still would have cancelled
- facepalm 10y agoIt's annoying, but I wouldn't consider it unfair. In the end, nobody forces you to pay more than you are prepared to pay.