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Almost all of the comments here are very dismissive of the trade union's arguments, but I think it is very important to look at the key problem UBI faces IMHO:
by ar0 10y ago
Almost all of the comments here are very dismissive of the trade union's arguments, but I think it is very important to look at the key problem UBI faces IMHO: Proper work is not just a source of money, but also a source of pride and a feeling of purpose / usefulness. And UBI alone cannot replace this.
This is not only a problem with UBI but with all welfare-focused policies, regardless of how well-intentioned and useful they might be. Put yourself into the shoes of someone on the receiving end. The story a blue-collar worker you are automating away is hearing is this: "We are sorry, but in our AI-fuelled, robot-driven world you are useless. We have no need for you anymore because you can't program deep neural networks. You just don't have what it takes to be a useful member of our society. But - don't worry! We recognize this is a problem, so we have introduced UBI / <insert other welfare programs here> to make sure you are financially covered and don't have to worry about your mortgage."
Is this something you want to hear? No. And that's why people are dismissing UBI and vote Trump - because "You are a hard-working, very capable individual whose job was unfairly stolen by an illegal immigrant" is a much, much better story for your self-esteem. And self-esteem is important [1]!
Not all people have a bucket list of things they would want to do in their spare time, like contributing to cool open source programs or writing the next Harry Potter series. Many just want to live a "regular" life and want to feel useful by providing for their families. They benefit from having a job where they feel useful and are accepted and where someone else (their boss) structures their work and tells them what to do. Taking this away and replacing it with UBI cannot be the (whole) answer. [And, no, I don't have the right answer, either.]
Money is not everything.
[1]: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Self-esteem#Importance https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Self-esteem#Importance
- usefulcat 10y agoNot sure why this is downvoted. One can certainly argue that personal identity /shouldn't/ be closely tied to one's occupation, but for better or worse right now for most people it very much is, at least in the US and I'm guessing in many other places as well. To my mind, this is the potentially problematic aspect of UBI for which the solutions are least obvious.
- benibela 10y ago>Proper work is not just a source of money, but also a source of pride and a feeling of purpose / usefulness. And UBI alone cannot replace this. That can also be used as pro-UBI argument to countering the argument "With an UBI everyone would quit there job and society would collapse." >"We are sorry, but in our AI-fuelled, robot-driven world you are useless. We have no need for you anymore because you can't program deep neural networks. You just don't have what it takes to be a useful member of our society Well, if robots actually can run everything one day, that is just what they will be told. UBI or not. >Not all people have a bucket list of things they would want to do in their spare time, like contributing to cool open source programs or writing the next Harry Potter series. If they do not want to do one of these things, they can do something similar to what they do now in their job. Or do they not want to do their job? That is quite a cognitive dissonance. Neither wanting to do it nor wanting to stop doing it. If they want to be told to do something against their will, they can find someone to draft them to something. Most open source projects could draft people to do something (If they can't contribute to an open source projects, they are useless after all in the robot driven world). I have 1800 unread mails about my open source project. I really could draft some people to check them out.