6 ms·

Ethanol and... juice.

pavlov 10y ago
An Hermès bag is a tiny slice of dead cow with some cheap metal and string to hold it together. Yet the bags go for thousands of dollars. Any luxury product can be reduced to absurdity this way, but it's not very useful in understanding the culture that produces and values them.
- rottyguy 10y ago
  Well, value is only what someone will pay for it. Usually it goes hand in hand with scarcity but often propped up by brand (eg if you didn't know it was a Hermes bag, could it demand the same value?)
- jedrek 10y ago
  Every time people make fun of luxury products I wonder what cars they're driving: 20 year old clunkers? What shirts they're wearing: $5 for a 10 pack off Ali Express? Burlap sacks? Are they typing on $5 cheap unbranded keyboards? Of course not. Hell, their computers probably cost twice what most people would be willing to pay, even though 90% of the time, they're doing little more than surfing the web and checking emails. But since it's something they're interested in, luxury is justified.
  - ekianjo 10y ago
    usually you spend a lot more in what you are highly involved in. Your comment is spot on.
smhost 10y ago
Are there any good, cheap laboratory wines that can pass blind taste tests?
- deleted 10y ago
  [deleted]
- closed 10y ago
  Judging from the Wikipedia article on blind wine taste tests [1], I'm not sure they're all that reliable. [1] https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blind_wine_tasting https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blind_wine_tasting
- seibelj 10y ago
  Numerous double-blind studied have shown experts can't tell the difference between common table wine and expensive bottles.[0][1] The whole thing is absurd. [0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Judgment_of_Paris_(wine) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Judgment_of_Paris_(wine) [1] https://www.cambridge.org/core/journals/journal-of-wine-economics/article/div-classtitlean-examination-of-judge-reliability-at-a-major-us-wine-competitiona-hreffn01-ref-typefnspan-classsupspanadiv/15EF999FBAC63C5FB6DCF1C2F4BB6655 https://www.cambridge.org/core/journals/journal-of-wine-econ...
  - antognini 10y ago
    I don't think those links support your claim. The Judgment of Paris was between high-end California and Bordeaux wines. The received wisdom of the time was that California Bordeaux-style wines (or, more generally, anything from the New World) were inferior to true Bordeaux wines. The Judgment of Paris showed that wasn't true. But they certainly didn't use California table wine. And the study you link to just seems to show that judges don't rank wines in competition very consistently. I don't think that table wines are often entered into these sorts of competitions. I'm fairly confident that someone with a good palette could distinguish between a high-end Bordeaux and Two-Buck Chuck.
    - seibelj 10y ago
      Do you have any science to prove your hunch? I've been following this for a while and nothing I've ever read showed that judges can distinguish two buck chuck from high end wine.
      - 09bjb 10y ago
        Uneducated drinkers wouldn't be able to tell the difference. Once you've tried enough wines, the difference is obvious and nobody debates it anymore. If you drink beer, it's not much different than mistaking Coors Light for your favorite microbrewed Stout.
        fenwick67 10y ago
- blacksmith_tb 10y ago
  You can even dye white wine red and even professional tasters will be fooled[1]. 1: https://www.theguardian.com/lifeandstyle/2013/jun/23/wine-tasting-junk-science-analysis https://www.theguardian.com/lifeandstyle/2013/jun/23/wine-ta...
  - geofft 10y ago
    Yes, but that's a statement on the distinction between (certain types of) red and white wines, not on the distinction between cheap and (worthwhile) expensive wines. It's sort of like saying that because you can install Windows on a Mac, there's no difference between an Inspiron and a MacBook Pro.
  - mrob 10y ago
    Students, not professional tasters. "The wine comparison test was carried out by 54 undergraduates from the Faculty of Oenology of the University of Bordeaux." http://www.daysyn.com/Morrot.pdf http://www.daysyn.com/Morrot.pdf
    - DonaldFisk 10y ago
      Wine students. I'd expect them to know a lot more about wine than most people. The wine's colour is part of the experience of drinking wine and affects the perceived flavour. They probably wouldn't have been fooled so easily if they were blindfolded. Knowing a wine's price also affect its perceived flavour: https://www.gsb.stanford.edu/insights/baba-shiv-how-wines-price-tag-affect-its-taste https://www.gsb.stanford.edu/insights/baba-shiv-how-wines-pr...
ekianjo 10y ago
and any living form is just carbon, nitrogen and oxygen and a spray of metals. So your point is ?
dredmorbius 10y ago
Look up Frank Lin Distillers sometime.

An Hermès bag is a tiny slice of dead cow with some cheap metal and string to hold it together. Yet the bags go for thousands of dollars. Any luxury product can be reduced to absurdity this way, but it's not very useful in understanding the culture that produces and values them.

rottyguy 10y ago
Well, value is only what someone will pay for it. Usually it goes hand in hand with scarcity but often propped up by brand (eg if you didn't know it was a Hermes bag, could it demand the same value?)
jedrek 10y ago
Every time people make fun of luxury products I wonder what cars they're driving: 20 year old clunkers? What shirts they're wearing: $5 for a 10 pack off Ali Express? Burlap sacks? Are they typing on $5 cheap unbranded keyboards? Of course not. Hell, their computers probably cost twice what most people would be willing to pay, even though 90% of the time, they're doing little more than surfing the web and checking emails. But since it's something they're interested in, luxury is justified.
- ekianjo 10y ago
  usually you spend a lot more in what you are highly involved in. Your comment is spot on.

smhost 10y ago

Are there any good, cheap laboratory wines that can pass blind taste tests?

deleted 10y ago
[deleted]
closed 10y ago
Judging from the Wikipedia article on blind wine taste tests [1], I'm not sure they're all that reliable. [1] https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blind_wine_tasting https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blind_wine_tasting
seibelj 10y ago
Numerous double-blind studied have shown experts can't tell the difference between common table wine and expensive bottles.[0][1] The whole thing is absurd. [0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Judgment_of_Paris_(wine) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Judgment_of_Paris_(wine) [1] https://www.cambridge.org/core/journals/journal-of-wine-economics/article/div-classtitlean-examination-of-judge-reliability-at-a-major-us-wine-competitiona-hreffn01-ref-typefnspan-classsupspanadiv/15EF999FBAC63C5FB6DCF1C2F4BB6655 https://www.cambridge.org/core/journals/journal-of-wine-econ...
- antognini 10y ago
  I don't think those links support your claim. The Judgment of Paris was between high-end California and Bordeaux wines. The received wisdom of the time was that California Bordeaux-style wines (or, more generally, anything from the New World) were inferior to true Bordeaux wines. The Judgment of Paris showed that wasn't true. But they certainly didn't use California table wine. And the study you link to just seems to show that judges don't rank wines in competition very consistently. I don't think that table wines are often entered into these sorts of competitions. I'm fairly confident that someone with a good palette could distinguish between a high-end Bordeaux and Two-Buck Chuck.
  - seibelj 10y ago
    Do you have any science to prove your hunch? I've been following this for a while and nothing I've ever read showed that judges can distinguish two buck chuck from high end wine.
    - 09bjb 10y ago
      Uneducated drinkers wouldn't be able to tell the difference. Once you've tried enough wines, the difference is obvious and nobody debates it anymore. If you drink beer, it's not much different than mistaking Coors Light for your favorite microbrewed Stout.
      - fenwick67 10y ago
blacksmith_tb 10y ago
You can even dye white wine red and even professional tasters will be fooled[1]. 1: https://www.theguardian.com/lifeandstyle/2013/jun/23/wine-tasting-junk-science-analysis https://www.theguardian.com/lifeandstyle/2013/jun/23/wine-ta...
- geofft 10y ago
  Yes, but that's a statement on the distinction between (certain types of) red and white wines, not on the distinction between cheap and (worthwhile) expensive wines. It's sort of like saying that because you can install Windows on a Mac, there's no difference between an Inspiron and a MacBook Pro.
- mrob 10y ago
  Students, not professional tasters. "The wine comparison test was carried out by 54 undergraduates from the Faculty of Oenology of the University of Bordeaux." http://www.daysyn.com/Morrot.pdf http://www.daysyn.com/Morrot.pdf
  - DonaldFisk 10y ago
    Wine students. I'd expect them to know a lot more about wine than most people. The wine's colour is part of the experience of drinking wine and affects the perceived flavour. They probably wouldn't have been fooled so easily if they were blindfolded. Knowing a wine's price also affect its perceived flavour: https://www.gsb.stanford.edu/insights/baba-shiv-how-wines-price-tag-affect-its-taste https://www.gsb.stanford.edu/insights/baba-shiv-how-wines-pr...

ekianjo 10y ago

and any living form is just carbon, nitrogen and oxygen and a spray of metals. So your point is ?

dredmorbius 10y ago

Look up Frank Lin Distillers sometime.