5 ms·

Is this docker for BSD or is there more going on here?

stonogo 10y ago
The technologies upon which this is based have been part of FreeBSD long before Docker was even conceived. This appears to be a new management tool for existing functionality, along with a praxis for use.
- vacri 10y ago
  The technologies that Docker was based on had also been part of linux for a long time beforehand. Docker was simply a new management tool for handling them.
  - craftkiller 10y ago
    Both correct, adding some concrete dates and names for the technologies: FreeBSD Jails were added in FreeBSD 4 which was released in 2000 Docker (on Linux) is based on Linux CGroups which were added in 2007 Initial release of docker in March 2013 Initial support for Docker based on jails added to FreeBSD in July 2015
djsumdog 10y ago
Docker for FreeBSD is over a year out of date and not production ready. I tried to use it for some things and it does work, but doesn't support any of the newer APIs in newer versions of docker compose and other orchestration tools. I really wish the Docker team would have made FreeBSD a first-class citizen, considering the native zfs support in FreeBSD. Currently the only thing Docker runs on natively is Linux. Even with the newest MacOS/Win variants, it still running in a hypervisor.
- jfoutz 10y ago
  What's MacOS's version of LXC? Windows Server Containers look like a plausible foundation, but really new.
  - pjmlp 10y ago
    Mac OS X has an hypervisor framework, which is also used by Docker https://github.com/docker/hyperkit https://github.com/docker/hyperkit https://developer.apple.com/reference/hypervisor https://developer.apple.com/reference/hypervisor Also there is App Sandbox for writing safer applications, but it requires programming explicitly against it. https://developer.apple.com/library/content/documentation/Security/Conceptual/AppSandboxDesignGuide/AboutAppSandbox/AboutAppSandbox.html#//apple_ref/doc/uid/TP40011183-CH1-SW1 https://developer.apple.com/library/content/documentation/Se...
    - jfoutz 10y ago
      But a hypervisor is a full VM. LXC, and Windows containers provide that funky process level virtualization. I guess the point i'm trying to make, there will be no "native" docker for MacOS. You'll always (or for the foreseeable future) have to start a linux VM (mabye windows?!?) to host the processes.
      - pjmlp 10y ago
        Windows containers are based on Hyper-V. As for Mac OS, I use it for Cocoa and iOS development, so no experience with containers as such.
        jfoutz 10y ago
        Nah, MS added a lightweight version with no hyper-v https://docs.microsoft.com/en-us/virtualization/windowscontainers/about/ https://docs.microsoft.com/en-us/virtualization/windowsconta...
        pjmlp 10y ago
        Have to look it better then, thanks.
- justincormack 10y ago
  Docker runs natively on Windows as well as Linux, with no hypervisor. There is a Solaris port being worked on (unless it got cancelled). We would love an upstream FreeBSD port, I have talked to a few people who are interested in working on it. The ZFS side should be fine as there is already support, and the old port should be useful as a basis.
  - johnsmith21006 10y ago
    Containers use the Linux kernel. How does a Linux container run native on Windows? Are the entry points mapped? How does Windows enable shared read between containers? With Linux it is the dir path and then inodes. How does Windows pull this off? How does SElinux work? What is exposed inside Windows?
    - justincormack 10y ago
      Windows containers use the Windows kernel. Windows does not have SELinux so of course that is not supported. It runs Windows program not Linux programs, so there is no mapping of entry points. There is lots of docs from Microsoft eg https://docs.microsoft.com/en-us/virtualization/windowscontainers/quick-start/quick-start-windows-server https://docs.microsoft.com/en-us/virtualization/windowsconta...

The technologies upon which this is based have been part of FreeBSD long before Docker was even conceived. This appears to be a new management tool for existing functionality, along with a praxis for use.

vacri 10y ago
The technologies that Docker was based on had also been part of linux for a long time beforehand. Docker was simply a new management tool for handling them.
- craftkiller 10y ago
  Both correct, adding some concrete dates and names for the technologies: FreeBSD Jails were added in FreeBSD 4 which was released in 2000 Docker (on Linux) is based on Linux CGroups which were added in 2007 Initial release of docker in March 2013 Initial support for Docker based on jails added to FreeBSD in July 2015

djsumdog 10y ago

Docker for FreeBSD is over a year out of date and not production ready. I tried to use it for some things and it does work, but doesn't support any of the newer APIs in newer versions of docker compose and other orchestration tools. I really wish the Docker team would have made FreeBSD a first-class citizen, considering the native zfs support in FreeBSD. Currently the only thing Docker runs on natively is Linux. Even with the newest MacOS/Win variants, it still running in a hypervisor.

jfoutz 10y ago
What's MacOS's version of LXC? Windows Server Containers look like a plausible foundation, but really new.
- pjmlp 10y ago
  Mac OS X has an hypervisor framework, which is also used by Docker https://github.com/docker/hyperkit https://github.com/docker/hyperkit https://developer.apple.com/reference/hypervisor https://developer.apple.com/reference/hypervisor Also there is App Sandbox for writing safer applications, but it requires programming explicitly against it. https://developer.apple.com/library/content/documentation/Security/Conceptual/AppSandboxDesignGuide/AboutAppSandbox/AboutAppSandbox.html#//apple_ref/doc/uid/TP40011183-CH1-SW1 https://developer.apple.com/library/content/documentation/Se...
  - jfoutz 10y ago
    But a hypervisor is a full VM. LXC, and Windows containers provide that funky process level virtualization. I guess the point i'm trying to make, there will be no "native" docker for MacOS. You'll always (or for the foreseeable future) have to start a linux VM (mabye windows?!?) to host the processes.
    - pjmlp 10y ago
      Windows containers are based on Hyper-V. As for Mac OS, I use it for Cocoa and iOS development, so no experience with containers as such.
      - jfoutz 10y ago
        Nah, MS added a lightweight version with no hyper-v https://docs.microsoft.com/en-us/virtualization/windowscontainers/about/ https://docs.microsoft.com/en-us/virtualization/windowsconta...
        pjmlp 10y ago
        Have to look it better then, thanks.
justincormack 10y ago
Docker runs natively on Windows as well as Linux, with no hypervisor. There is a Solaris port being worked on (unless it got cancelled). We would love an upstream FreeBSD port, I have talked to a few people who are interested in working on it. The ZFS side should be fine as there is already support, and the old port should be useful as a basis.
- johnsmith21006 10y ago
  Containers use the Linux kernel. How does a Linux container run native on Windows? Are the entry points mapped? How does Windows enable shared read between containers? With Linux it is the dir path and then inodes. How does Windows pull this off? How does SElinux work? What is exposed inside Windows?
  - justincormack 10y ago
    Windows containers use the Windows kernel. Windows does not have SELinux so of course that is not supported. It runs Windows program not Linux programs, so there is no mapping of entry points. There is lots of docs from Microsoft eg https://docs.microsoft.com/en-us/virtualization/windowscontainers/quick-start/quick-start-windows-server https://docs.microsoft.com/en-us/virtualization/windowsconta...