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I seriously have issue with calling us wage slaves and such, let alone claiming its because of the failed labor movement. we are slaves to our uncontrolled pas

I seriously have issue with calling us wage slaves and such, let alone claiming its because of the failed labor movement. we are slaves to our uncontrolled passions that marketers have ruthlessly and easily exploited having us believe we need something we cannot afford. we allow ourselves to be convinced that our life would not be as fulfilling without the latest fad/gadget/etc. If people paid in cash for what they want, put off such purchases for three or more days, and bought a home one income could support, there would less "slave to wages" than people think

mrec 10y ago
> If people [...] bought a home one income could support I think GGP's point was that those are becoming hard-to-impossible to find in many places, especially places with decent-paying jobs. I don't agree with him that this was a deliberate conspiracy by employers to keep workers oppressed; I think it has far more to do with an out-of-control financial sector and governments addicted to over-loose monetary policy. But blaming people's "uncontrolled passions" for wanting a stable home, one they might actually be able to pay off one day, is a bit silly. (Disclaimer: this is a view from London, which while it might not be quite the absolute worst for housing is pretty damn close to it. YMMV.)
- kristopolous 10y ago
  Businesses extracting profit from the labor of its workforce isn't a conspiracy. It's fully disclosed to children in school and I don't think anyone challenges it. Now if the question is whether they try to maximize profits, once again, this is not a secret or a back room conspiracy, this is how it works. As an employee, enter into every negotiation knowing this.
  - mrec 10y ago
    > Businesses extracting profit from the labor of its workforce isn't a conspiracy. I'm not sure you who you're arguing with. What I said was > I don't agree with him that this was a deliberate conspiracy and branchless' GGP comment I was disagreeing with wasn't about "extracting profit from the labor of its workforce" in general, it was about "The whole point behind high land prices is to prevent most people achieving financial independence."
- hx87 10y ago
  Loose monetary policy is only a part of the problem; NIMBYism and excessive historical preservation is probably a larger contributor.
- branchless 10y ago
  Agreed, finance gone mad. Especially in London.
branchless 10y ago
This is exactly wrong. We bid for land in the main as most jobs require living in an area where demand exceeds supply (especially as demand is inflated by our land speculation system). If we get more productive and wages rise we have more disposable income so rents / renting money from the bank (mortgage) rises. If we cut back on consumption we have more disposable income so rent rises. Productivity gains are captured by land prices.

mrec 10y ago

> If people [...] bought a home one income could support I think GGP's point was that those are becoming hard-to-impossible to find in many places, especially places with decent-paying jobs. I don't agree with him that this was a deliberate conspiracy by employers to keep workers oppressed; I think it has far more to do with an out-of-control financial sector and governments addicted to over-loose monetary policy. But blaming people's "uncontrolled passions" for wanting a stable home, one they might actually be able to pay off one day, is a bit silly. (Disclaimer: this is a view from London, which while it might not be quite the absolute worst for housing is pretty damn close to it. YMMV.)

kristopolous 10y ago
Businesses extracting profit from the labor of its workforce isn't a conspiracy. It's fully disclosed to children in school and I don't think anyone challenges it. Now if the question is whether they try to maximize profits, once again, this is not a secret or a back room conspiracy, this is how it works. As an employee, enter into every negotiation knowing this.
- mrec 10y ago
  > Businesses extracting profit from the labor of its workforce isn't a conspiracy. I'm not sure you who you're arguing with. What I said was > I don't agree with him that this was a deliberate conspiracy and branchless' GGP comment I was disagreeing with wasn't about "extracting profit from the labor of its workforce" in general, it was about "The whole point behind high land prices is to prevent most people achieving financial independence."
hx87 10y ago
Loose monetary policy is only a part of the problem; NIMBYism and excessive historical preservation is probably a larger contributor.
branchless 10y ago
Agreed, finance gone mad. Especially in London.

branchless 10y ago

This is exactly wrong. We bid for land in the main as most jobs require living in an area where demand exceeds supply (especially as demand is inflated by our land speculation system). If we get more productive and wages rise we have more disposable income so rents / renting money from the bank (mortgage) rises. If we cut back on consumption we have more disposable income so rent rises. Productivity gains are captured by land prices.