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"'I am that I am' was said by Jesus who ate, defecated and everything else like any human being, and he is considered God by Christians, so he's very much like

"'I am that I am' was said by Jesus who ate, defecated and everything else like any human being, and he is considered God by Christians, so he's very much like Greek gods walking around the Earth all the time. " First - "I am that I am" is God - to Moses. Not Jesus. And by the way - that very line betrays your argument: the Monotheistic 'God' is nothing like Zeus, who would never say something so abstract :). Zeus was knowable. 'God' is a metaphysical concept. And no - Jesus not 'like the Greek gods because he 'ate and defecated'. Zeus was a powerful war lord, who ran around screwing women, got pissed off at others, demanded offerings - he was not a moral example, nor did he demand morality. He was like a superhuman Chieftain. Zeus was the Donald Trump of religions. (Bad joke). Jesus wanted his followers to 'have faith and love one another' - and not necessarily make offerings, worry about money, or get too involved in rituals. All are equal before God, and are judged for their actions - not their power, money or social status. Yada, yada, yada. Nothing like the Zeusinator. There are really few if any theological similarities between Zeus and Jesus. They are 'far apart' on the religion scale :) "earning about the ancient Greek gods helps explaining a lot of weird Jewish and Christian stories. Also learning about the Mesopotamian and Egyptian gods and stories." Yes - some bits of narrative are similar, and the 'nativity' bit is a rather common theme in the era. But it's not about the 'magic tricks' :). Put another way: Greek pantheism is about the Greek Gods. Christianity is about the teachings of a man (or son of god, or god incarnate, depending on ...) And finally - a lot of formal Christian groups that do not believe Jesus was a God. That's been a big debate since the beginning i.e. Nicaeae etc. :)

acqq 10y ago
"I am" is said by Jesus seven times in the Gospel of John, that's more important for a Christian: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/I_am_(biblical_term) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/I_am_(biblical_term) > There are really few if any theological similarities between Zeus and Jesus. They are 'far apart' on the religion scale To properly compare you have to compare Yahweh, the god from Jewish scriptures (a.k.a the Old Testament for the Christians, for who Yahweh is a father-god) and Zeus, the Greek father god. Both are hungry for the animal sacrifices. The God personally visits Abraham who prepares a meal (freshly baked bread and flesh) for him and the God eats, under a tree. Not "transcendent" at all. For their children: Jesus, the son of the God and a human mother, and Heracles, the son of the God and a human mother. Heracles rises to Olympus as he dies, unlike the other mortals, just like Jesus rises to heaven. And both Jesus and Heracles visit Hades (Hell) only to get out of there: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Harrowing_of_Hell https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Harrowing_of_Hell Learning about the Greek gods is really enlightened. By the way, the name of the Jewish father-god is Yahweh, and "Jesus" comes from the Greek "Iesous" rendition of a Hebrew common name "Yehoshua" (Joshua) which means "Yahweh is salvation." Also a convenient element for the later "the father is also a son" idea. Only, there were a lot of Joshuas living around for more centuries.
- edblarney 10y ago
  "I am" - and - "I am that I am" are two different things. :) And yes, I agree - 'Yahweh' from Jewish antiquity is more comparable to Zeus, for sure. (Though Yahweh evolved a lot over time, and was something else by the time Jesus came) But you were comparing Jesus to Zeus. Those two are not very comparable. Zeus belongs in the Egyptian/Roman/Mesopotamian camp. a little bit like Yahweh. Jesus belongs more with Buddha, and Mohammed. The former were 'myths to believe that explained things', the later were 'historical figures' and 'teachers' of 'how we ought to be as moral and spiritual beings'. These are very different eras, different kinds of religions, is my whole point. FYI - that's why in 2016 there are tons of Buddhists, Muslims and Christians, and basically zero followers of 'Zeus'. Which further validates 'how different Jesus is to Zeus & Co'
  - acqq 10y ago
    > 'Yahweh' from Jewish antiquity The Christians actually call that what you call "Jewish antiquity" "the Old Testament." And they don't pronounce the name of the God, just like Jews stopped doing that, but only after names like "Yehoshua" (Joshua and Jesus) and "Yohanan" (John) (both constructed from Yahweh) already became common. This simple "his name can't be told" rule is the primary spark for the whole "transcendental" buildup and people naming "the only" "God" for any formally unrelated belief. And the Jews got that idea (keep the name secret) from the Egyptians. > But you were comparing Jesus to Zeus. No, check for yourself, I have explicitly compared the father of Jesus with Zeus, Zeus being the inseminator just like Jesus' father. > Jesus belongs more with Buddha, and Mohammed. No, Mohammad was a jealous supremacist murderous warlord, killing hundreds of people even after they surrender, torturing the captives, taking the female slaves as sex slaves, ordering the killings for revenge to somebody making some funny poems about him, ordering stonings of others for having extramarital sex, but for himself organizing "legal" sex with a 9-year old, inventing special messages from God to allow him having more wives than other Muslims etc (all documented in the religious texts). Jesus was just an apocalyptic religious hippie announcing that "the end is coming soon" who died once he tried to cause the change in the middle of Jerusalem, the governmental, financial and religious center of Judea at the peak of its yearly activity (overturning the tables in the "banks" there effectively(1)). Buddha is not comparable to both Jesus and Mohammad, as Buddha was the one who recognized that he can chose to not believe in the religious dogma of his environment (Hinduism) and be free and happy instead, not ending in the Hindu equivalent of Hell (which was for them "being reborn again") but simply dying (which is called the "nirvana" -- simply ending being "blown out" like a candle, that's the meaning of that word). But the Buddhists, conveniently for them, made a new religious dogma out of Buddha. ---- 1) The term "bank" actually comes from Italian "banca" which simply means "the table" -- the tables were used as "the banks" to perform the money transactions in the old times. Jesus actually disrupted the banks in the city. Which were very stressed at the Passover, the time he decided to do it. But it wouldn't be enough to sentence him to death, the reason for that was that there were the witnesses who confirmed him claiming to be the "King of the Jews" -- he was sentenced for leading the "regime change" during the times of the festival. By the oldest Gospel, Jesus, poor believer, didn't understand why the God didn't intervene then ("Eli, Eli, lama sabachthani? that is to say, My God, my God, why hast thou forsaken me?")

acqq 10y ago

"I am" is said by Jesus seven times in the Gospel of John, that's more important for a Christian: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/I_am_(biblical_term) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/I_am_(biblical_term) > There are really few if any theological similarities between Zeus and Jesus. They are 'far apart' on the religion scale To properly compare you have to compare Yahweh, the god from Jewish scriptures (a.k.a the Old Testament for the Christians, for who Yahweh is a father-god) and Zeus, the Greek father god. Both are hungry for the animal sacrifices. The God personally visits Abraham who prepares a meal (freshly baked bread and flesh) for him and the God eats, under a tree. Not "transcendent" at all. For their children: Jesus, the son of the God and a human mother, and Heracles, the son of the God and a human mother. Heracles rises to Olympus as he dies, unlike the other mortals, just like Jesus rises to heaven. And both Jesus and Heracles visit Hades (Hell) only to get out of there: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Harrowing_of_Hell https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Harrowing_of_Hell Learning about the Greek gods is really enlightened. By the way, the name of the Jewish father-god is Yahweh, and "Jesus" comes from the Greek "Iesous" rendition of a Hebrew common name "Yehoshua" (Joshua) which means "Yahweh is salvation." Also a convenient element for the later "the father is also a son" idea. Only, there were a lot of Joshuas living around for more centuries.

edblarney 10y ago
"I am" - and - "I am that I am" are two different things. :) And yes, I agree - 'Yahweh' from Jewish antiquity is more comparable to Zeus, for sure. (Though Yahweh evolved a lot over time, and was something else by the time Jesus came) But you were comparing Jesus to Zeus. Those two are not very comparable. Zeus belongs in the Egyptian/Roman/Mesopotamian camp. a little bit like Yahweh. Jesus belongs more with Buddha, and Mohammed. The former were 'myths to believe that explained things', the later were 'historical figures' and 'teachers' of 'how we ought to be as moral and spiritual beings'. These are very different eras, different kinds of religions, is my whole point. FYI - that's why in 2016 there are tons of Buddhists, Muslims and Christians, and basically zero followers of 'Zeus'. Which further validates 'how different Jesus is to Zeus & Co'
- acqq 10y ago
  > 'Yahweh' from Jewish antiquity The Christians actually call that what you call "Jewish antiquity" "the Old Testament." And they don't pronounce the name of the God, just like Jews stopped doing that, but only after names like "Yehoshua" (Joshua and Jesus) and "Yohanan" (John) (both constructed from Yahweh) already became common. This simple "his name can't be told" rule is the primary spark for the whole "transcendental" buildup and people naming "the only" "God" for any formally unrelated belief. And the Jews got that idea (keep the name secret) from the Egyptians. > But you were comparing Jesus to Zeus. No, check for yourself, I have explicitly compared the father of Jesus with Zeus, Zeus being the inseminator just like Jesus' father. > Jesus belongs more with Buddha, and Mohammed. No, Mohammad was a jealous supremacist murderous warlord, killing hundreds of people even after they surrender, torturing the captives, taking the female slaves as sex slaves, ordering the killings for revenge to somebody making some funny poems about him, ordering stonings of others for having extramarital sex, but for himself organizing "legal" sex with a 9-year old, inventing special messages from God to allow him having more wives than other Muslims etc (all documented in the religious texts). Jesus was just an apocalyptic religious hippie announcing that "the end is coming soon" who died once he tried to cause the change in the middle of Jerusalem, the governmental, financial and religious center of Judea at the peak of its yearly activity (overturning the tables in the "banks" there effectively(1)). Buddha is not comparable to both Jesus and Mohammad, as Buddha was the one who recognized that he can chose to not believe in the religious dogma of his environment (Hinduism) and be free and happy instead, not ending in the Hindu equivalent of Hell (which was for them "being reborn again") but simply dying (which is called the "nirvana" -- simply ending being "blown out" like a candle, that's the meaning of that word). But the Buddhists, conveniently for them, made a new religious dogma out of Buddha. ---- 1) The term "bank" actually comes from Italian "banca" which simply means "the table" -- the tables were used as "the banks" to perform the money transactions in the old times. Jesus actually disrupted the banks in the city. Which were very stressed at the Passover, the time he decided to do it. But it wouldn't be enough to sentence him to death, the reason for that was that there were the witnesses who confirmed him claiming to be the "King of the Jews" -- he was sentenced for leading the "regime change" during the times of the festival. By the oldest Gospel, Jesus, poor believer, didn't understand why the God didn't intervene then ("Eli, Eli, lama sabachthani? that is to say, My God, my God, why hast thou forsaken me?")