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Of course it's more complicated than this, but in terms of a general rule calories in/out is pretty darn accurate. Saying it is 'dangerously wrong', is dangerou

Of course it's more complicated than this, but in terms of a general rule calories in/out is pretty darn accurate. Saying it is 'dangerously wrong', is dangerously wrong.

DanBC 10y ago
It's true, but in an unhelpful way. We've been telling fat people to eat fewer calories for many years, and we're not seeing fewer fat people. It reduces a complex problem into a simplistic slogan that's then used by many people to hate and judge fat people. "You're fat, just eat less stupid fatty". It ignores gut microbiome. Here's a story about a bug that makes it harder to gain weight: http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-22458428 http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-22458428 and another bit of research about people who are obese: http://www.nature.com/nature/journal/v444/n7122/abs/nature05414.html http://www.nature.com/nature/journal/v444/n7122/abs/nature05... It ignores "satiety". It ignores all the psycho-social stuff going on around food. It ignores changed metabolic pathways (one of the reasons people who take antipsychotic medications are overweight is because of the changes to their metabolism: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC487012/ https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC487012/)
- thecupisblue 10y ago
  > we're not seeing fewer fat people Yeah, because they mostly don't do it. The things you're focusing on are _mostly_ micro and not macro, for 99.999% of obese individuals, CICO would help them lose weight. There are exceptions to every rule tho.
  - DanBC 10y ago
    > CICO would help them lose weight The whole point is that it doesn't help them lose weight because it's unsustainable. Fat people can't manage to do that for more than a few weeks. The rigid focus on the least useful fact (CICO) means that you're failing to give any useful, usable, information.
    - thecupisblue 10y ago
      No, that is the basis of weight loss. Focus should be on introducing better eating habits (better as in lower calories and better macronutrient composition), education and finding the reason behind their overeating habits since it's usually psychological one.
    - scriptkiddy 10y ago
      >Fat people can't manage to do that for more than a few weeks. That's the problem. Lack of self control. Generally a result of psychological issues such as comfort eating or straight up food addiction. Doesn't change the fact that if those people were disciplined enough, they could still become healthy.
- chillydawg 10y ago
  Fact: fat people eat too much. Another fact: eating less when overweight can be very difficult.
  - quantumhobbit 10y ago
    Yet another fact: altering the composition of calories, more protein and fewer carbs, seems to help overweight people eat less and/or burn more calories.
- revelation 10y ago
  We've been telling people lots of things and haven't seen [insert expected improvement from awareness campaign]. The matter of fact is that telling people about things they do wrong tends to not be very effective in general. It's not an indictment of a particular topic.
- Sholmesy 10y ago
  You're right, it does seem unhelpful (just eat/smoke/<insert vice> less!). What is the proposed alternative though? Most people need a general rule they can follow to help them (read: can't afford a nutritionist/doctor). If it's a willpower issue, then we need to solve that, but just saying "Oh eating less won't help me" is just as bad.

Of course it's more complicated than this, but in terms of a general rule calories in/out is pretty darn accurate. Saying it is 'dangerously wrong', is dangerously wrong.

DanBC 10y ago

It's true, but in an unhelpful way. We've been telling fat people to eat fewer calories for many years, and we're not seeing fewer fat people. It reduces a complex problem into a simplistic slogan that's then used by many people to hate and judge fat people. "You're fat, just eat less stupid fatty". It ignores gut microbiome. Here's a story about a bug that makes it harder to gain weight: http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-22458428 http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-22458428 and another bit of research about people who are obese: http://www.nature.com/nature/journal/v444/n7122/abs/nature05414.html http://www.nature.com/nature/journal/v444/n7122/abs/nature05... It ignores "satiety". It ignores all the psycho-social stuff going on around food. It ignores changed metabolic pathways (one of the reasons people who take antipsychotic medications are overweight is because of the changes to their metabolism: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC487012/ https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC487012/)

thecupisblue 10y ago
> we're not seeing fewer fat people Yeah, because they mostly don't do it. The things you're focusing on are _mostly_ micro and not macro, for 99.999% of obese individuals, CICO would help them lose weight. There are exceptions to every rule tho.
- DanBC 10y ago
  > CICO would help them lose weight The whole point is that it doesn't help them lose weight because it's unsustainable. Fat people can't manage to do that for more than a few weeks. The rigid focus on the least useful fact (CICO) means that you're failing to give any useful, usable, information.
  - thecupisblue 10y ago
    No, that is the basis of weight loss. Focus should be on introducing better eating habits (better as in lower calories and better macronutrient composition), education and finding the reason behind their overeating habits since it's usually psychological one.
  - scriptkiddy 10y ago
    >Fat people can't manage to do that for more than a few weeks. That's the problem. Lack of self control. Generally a result of psychological issues such as comfort eating or straight up food addiction. Doesn't change the fact that if those people were disciplined enough, they could still become healthy.
chillydawg 10y ago
Fact: fat people eat too much. Another fact: eating less when overweight can be very difficult.
- quantumhobbit 10y ago
  Yet another fact: altering the composition of calories, more protein and fewer carbs, seems to help overweight people eat less and/or burn more calories.
revelation 10y ago
We've been telling people lots of things and haven't seen [insert expected improvement from awareness campaign]. The matter of fact is that telling people about things they do wrong tends to not be very effective in general. It's not an indictment of a particular topic.
Sholmesy 10y ago
You're right, it does seem unhelpful (just eat/smoke/<insert vice> less!). What is the proposed alternative though? Most people need a general rule they can follow to help them (read: can't afford a nutritionist/doctor). If it's a willpower issue, then we need to solve that, but just saying "Oh eating less won't help me" is just as bad.